Why God created us and this Universe?

February 27, 2009

Hi All,

I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right

answer.

My question is " if God or some power " has got " lot of energy " to

create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy. But " why

to create us and asking us to recognize it " ?. If there is no creation

at all there will not be any need to know that power or God.

I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways to

reach God or Moksha.

Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire or with a good

intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying to know is a kind one

or a sadist?. Is it not like below story.

I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to

live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping us

in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot. But

my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of

creation?? " . Is it not a game playing with us.

Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and we

all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is " GOOD " . Another

team name is " Bad " . I do agree that heshe might have created only

Good. And we created bad. But why to create a team called " Good " . If

that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play a

game with us?.

Is it like this example " create a toy with your power and throw it

into universe. Then the game rule is that Toy has to recognize that

creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )

otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth till

that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a saddist/psycho

or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please

kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the

group members tell their views on this and

clear this query.

Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me

different ways( Meditation/pujas/homas) to reach God or Moksha. I

want " why did he/she create us " . If anybody realised/enlightened/or

spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and

reply.

Thanks,

M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.

Email : mydearindian

February 27, 2009

People look at the world around them and they see a lot wrong with

it. Babies are born with birth defects. People die tragically of

cancer, leukemia, and a variety of genetic diseases over which they

have no control. Earthquakes kill thousands of innocent people.

Humans battle depression, loneliness, all kinds of mental illnesses

and disorders. We suffer from drought, insect infestations, war --

the list is endless. Why didn't God create an earth where bad

things, misery and pain simply could not happen?

A wise teacher said, " If I can know the mind of God, then God isn't

God. " Anyone who claims to have all the answers is a person to

avoid. We certainly have no interest in attempting to pretend to be

God, but even with our limited human wisdom we can understand some

of the reasons why God created the cosmos the way He did.

Natural disasters are not in themselves evil or a failure of God. A

classic example of this is earthquakes. An earthquake causes massive

damage to humans and can result in extreme losses of life. The fact

is, however, that earthquakes are a part of the processes that keep

the earth living and suitable for life. Land masses wear down with

time because of rain, snow, freezing, heating, glaciers, landslides,

and gravitational forces. If there were no forces that lift the land

to replenish the worn away parts, after a while all land on the

earth would be under water. Because the earth is liquid inside, land

is constantly being lifted to replace the land that is worn down.

Volcanoes do the same thing; but in addition, they add new elements

and nutrients to the soil, making plant growth accelerate and

sustaining the food chain

Dr.Ramesh Kamath

Bangalore

kamath52

sacred-objects , " Kishore " <mydearindian

wrote:

>

> Hi All,

>

> I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right

> answer.

>

> My question is " if God or some power " has got " lot of energy " to

> create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy.

But " why

> to create us and asking us to recognize it " ?. If there is no

creation

> at all there will not be any need to know that power or God.

>

> I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways

to

> reach God or Moksha.

>

> Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire or with a

good

> intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying to know is a kind

one

> or a sadist?. Is it not like below story.

>

> I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to

> live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping

us

> in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot.

But

> my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of

> creation?? " . Is it not a game playing with us.

> Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and

we

> all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is " GOOD " .

Another

> team name is " Bad " . I do agree that heshe might have created only

> Good. And we created bad. But why to create a team called " Good " .

If

> that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play

a

> game with us?.

>

> Is it like this example " create a toy with your power and throw it

> into universe. Then the game rule is that Toy has to recognize

that

> creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )

> otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth

till

> that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a

saddist/psycho

> or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please

> kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the

> group members tell their views on this and

> clear this query.

>

> Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me

> different ways( Meditation/pujas/homas) to reach God or Moksha. I

> want " why did he/she create us " . If anybody

realised/enlightened/or

> spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and

> reply.

>

> Thanks,

> M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.

> Email : mydearindian

>

February 27, 2009

Dear Sriman,

Your question is very important. Late Acharya of the Sri

Gaudiya Mission, Pujya Tridandi Swami Bhakti Hridaya Vana Maharaj

(1901-1982), taught that the reason or purpose of this exercise,

whereby unlimited Jiva-souls pass progressively through Maya, is

acintya and known only to Sri Krishna Himself. It is useless to

ponder. We must understand how the process works, but we can never

know the reason 'why.'

Why NOT!?

All Jivas are eternal, sometimes inactive (like during Pralaya and

Maha-pralaya) and sometimes active, but always alive (chit). It is

reasonable to say that no Jiva soul who had full developed

intelligence of his " self " would willingly choose the painful and

doomed path of Maya.

Srila Vana Maharaj clearly taught that Jivas are injected (so to

speak) into Maya to work their way up and to Vaikuntha. The choice

comes when we reach human intelligence, as is the case right now. Even

now we could all choose to return to Vaikuntha immediately if we

really desired that 100%.

The badha Jivas are meant to enter Maya and then work their way back

to Para-vyoma Brahma Puri or the City of the Absolute. It is just one

particular process designed by HARI for His Own fun 'n' games.

In CC Kaviraj Goswami states, " Krishna bhuli shay Jiva anadi, " we have

forgotten Krishna since " before time " began, so there is no initial

choice. We cannot choose something, which is out of our memory.

The Jiva begins his seemingly eternal material existence as a

microscopic life form, like an " anu, " which is completely covered and

in state of ignorance. We do not have a rational understandable choice

until we reach human life; and amongst humans very few rarely question

reality.

They do not choose in the beginning' because there is neither

beginning nor end for the Jiva. All Jivas are eternal, conscious and

blissful in essence (sat-chit-ananda), being marginal chit particles

of Lord Hari.

Swami Vana Maharaj emphasized THREE particular tattvas' as being

principle (in relation to us, the Jivas):

(1) The eternal, all blissful, spiritual universe which is the

playground of the Lord and lies within Paravyoma brahma-puri.

(2) The temporary changeable, material universe, the endless ocean of

birth and death, prakriti, the jada-samsara.

(3) All living beings seen or unseen who belong to the Jiva (soul)

potency which is all spiritual and blissful by nature andemanates from

in between the external and internal worlds.

Although the Jiva Shakti lies in-between the spiritual and material

realms still the souls are always engaged in one or the other and do

not reside in the middle but only emanate' from that position by the

arrangement of Lord Vasudeva. Sarva karana karanam.

The example of King Puranjana in Srimad Bhagavat pertains to a soul

already long within the jada-samsar. Therefore it is not relevant to

the issue of origin or original choice of the jiva.

---Y/s Richard

sacred-objects , " Kishore " <mydearindian wrote:

>

> Hi All,

>

> I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right

> answer.

>

> My question is " if God or some power " has got " lot of energy " to

> create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy. But " why

> to create us and asking us to recognize it " ?. If there is no creation

> at all there will not be any need to know that power or God.

>

> I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways to

> reach God or Moksha.

>

> Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire or with a good

> intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying to know is a kind one

> or a sadist?. Is it not like below story.

>

> I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to

> live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping us

> in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot. But

> my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of

> creation?? " . Is it not a game playing with us.

> Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and we

> all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is " GOOD " . Another

> team name is " Bad " . I do agree that heshe might have created only

> Good. And we created bad. But why to create a team called " Good " . If

> that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play a

> game with us?.

>

> Is it like this example " create a toy with your power and throw it

> into universe. Then the game rule is that Toy has to recognize that

> creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )

> otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth till

> that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a saddist/psycho

> or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please

> kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the

> group members tell their views on this and

> clear this query.

>

> Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me

> different ways( Meditation/pujas/homas) to reach God or Moksha. I

> want " why did he/she create us " . If anybody realised/enlightened/or

> spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and

> reply.

>

> Thanks,

> M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.

> Email : mydearindian

>

February 27, 2009

AN AFTER THOUGHT: From the time the eternal jivatma is injected into

Maya or prakriti, starting from the smallest birth as an atom (anu)

and finally, after evolving through all species, as well as hells and

heavens, to reach the stage of mukti - this is the nature of the

" game " which Bhagavan has created at His own whim.

And the process for the Jiva to start into Maya as an atom, then

evolve through 8 million subhuman species, then evolve 400,000 species of human

births, and to finally reach mukti, ...the whole process takes many creations

and desolutions of the material energy. During the manifest material periods the

jiva's can be conscious " chit " and even blissful " ananda " ; but during the

unmanifest periods (Pralayas) the Jivas are on hold in nidra and only function

as " sat " (life) with the CHIT and ANANDA functions on hold.

During Pralaya each Jiva is fixed at the last position of their karma, and when

there is new creation each Jiva starts from where it left off. Thus the huge

variety of life forms.

You may or may not agree with this assessment, but you asked, and this is what I

was taught by my Gurus. Thanks. Y/s, R-

sacred-objects , " Richard Shaw Brown "

<rsbj66 wrote:

>

> Dear Sriman,

>

> Your question is very important. Late Acharya of the Sri

> Gaudiya Mission, Pujya Tridandi Swami Bhakti Hridaya Vana Maharaj

> (1901-1982), taught that the reason or purpose of this exercise,

> whereby unlimited Jiva-souls pass progressively through Maya, is

> acintya and known only to Sri Krishna Himself. It is useless to

> ponder. We must understand how the process works, but we can never

> know the reason 'why.'

>

> Why NOT!?

>

> All Jivas are eternal, sometimes inactive (like during Pralaya and

> Maha-pralaya) and sometimes active, but always alive (chit). It is

> reasonable to say that no Jiva soul who had full developed

> intelligence of his " self " would willingly choose the painful and

> doomed path of Maya.

>

> Srila Vana Maharaj clearly taught that Jivas are injected (so to

> speak) into Maya to work their way up and to Vaikuntha. The choice

> comes when we reach human intelligence, as is the case right now. Even

> now we could all choose to return to Vaikuntha immediately if we

> really desired that 100%.

>

> The badha Jivas are meant to enter Maya and then work their way back

> to Para-vyoma Brahma Puri or the City of the Absolute. It is just one

> particular process designed by HARI for His Own fun 'n' games.

>

> In CC Kaviraj Goswami states, " Krishna bhuli shay Jiva anadi, " we have

> forgotten Krishna since " before time " began, so there is no initial

> choice. We cannot choose something, which is out of our memory.

>

> The Jiva begins his seemingly eternal material existence as a

> microscopic life form, like an " anu, " which is completely covered and

> in state of ignorance. We do not have a rational understandable choice

> until we reach human life; and amongst humans very few rarely question

> reality.

>

> They do not choose in the beginning' because there is neither

> beginning nor end for the Jiva. All Jivas are eternal, conscious and

> blissful in essence (sat-chit-ananda), being marginal chit particles

> of Lord Hari.

>

> Swami Vana Maharaj emphasized THREE particular tattvas' as being

> principle (in relation to us, the Jivas):

>

> (1) The eternal, all blissful, spiritual universe which is the

> playground of the Lord and lies within Paravyoma brahma-puri.

>

> (2) The temporary changeable, material universe, the endless ocean of

> birth and death, prakriti, the jada-samsara.

>

> (3) All living beings seen or unseen who belong to the Jiva (soul)

> potency which is all spiritual and blissful by nature andemanates from

> in between the external and internal worlds.

>

> Although the Jiva Shakti lies in-between the spiritual and material

> realms still the souls are always engaged in one or the other and do

> not reside in the middle but only emanate' from that position by the

> arrangement of Lord Vasudeva. Sarva karana karanam.

>

> The example of King Puranjana in Srimad Bhagavat pertains to a soul

> already long within the jada-samsar. Therefore it is not relevant to

> the issue of origin or original choice of the jiva.

>

> ---Y/s Richard

>

> sacred-objects , " Kishore " <mydearindian@> wrote:

> >

> > Hi All,

> >

> > I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right

> > answer.

> >

> > My question is " if God or some power " has got " lot of energy " to

> > create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy. But " why

> > to create us and asking us to recognize it " ?. If there is no creation

> > at all there will not be any need to know that power or God.

> >

> > I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways to

> > reach God or Moksha.

> >

> > Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire or with a good

> > intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying to know is a kind one

> > or a sadist?. Is it not like below story.

> >

> > I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to

> > live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping us

> > in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot. But

> > my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of

> > creation?? " . Is it not a game playing with us.

> > Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and we

> > all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is " GOOD " . Another

> > team name is " Bad " . I do agree that heshe might have created only

> > Good. And we created bad. But why to create a team called " Good " . If

> > that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play a

> > game with us?.

> >

> > Is it like this example " create a toy with your power and throw it

> > into universe. Then the game rule is that Toy has to recognize that

> > creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )

> > otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth till

> > that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a saddist/psycho

> > or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please

> > kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the

> > group members tell their views on this and

> > clear this query.

> >

> > Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me

> > different ways( Meditation/pujas/homas) to reach God or Moksha. I

> > want " why did he/she create us " . If anybody realised/enlightened/or

> > spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and

> > reply.

> >

> > Thanks,

> > M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.

> > Email : mydearindian@

> >

>

February 27, 2009

In CC Kaviraj Goswami states, " Krishna bhuli shay Jiva anadi, " we have

> forgotten Krishna since " before time " began, so there is no initial

> choice. We cannot choose something, which is out of our memory

Very key point

therein lay the tragedy of mankinds fall( if we are to be poetic)

and all of the inhumanity and ills that plague us

Richard your guru taught you w ell

March 2, 2009

Dear Kishor,Few years ago..Mr Sitaram wrote following post on his website....hope it ill be useful for you....Does God Create Man, or Man Create God?More in Heaven & Earth than Dreamed in your PhilosophyThere's more in Heaven & Earth than Dreamed of in your PhilosophyGood post! Interesting question! Here are some thoughts off the top of my head:Let us distinguish three major divisions among all "philosophies" with regard to cosmology into the following:1.) Systems which aggressively posit the existence of a creator-god2.) Systems which vehemently deny the existence of a creator-god3.)

Systems which dispassionately assert that the the question of god's

existence or non-existence is immaterial to the human condition and to

issues important to mankind.Those systems which

aggressively assert the existence of a creator-god, and explain

everything in terms of that god, can never hope to demonstrate to

ORIGIN or cause of that god, or the reason or purpose behind a god's

existence. It is presumed that if there is a God, then God is the cause

of all else, prior to all else, and that such a God may not even be

properly said to EXIST in "being" since such a God is prior to and the

source of BEING and non-Being.If one WERE to cite a source

for God or a reason or purpose or cause for God, then one would be

pointing to something PRIOR to God, perhaps we might call that

"meta-God", and we are once again faced with the problem of explaining

the origin, cause, reason, or source for this meta-God. Hence we are

led to a situation of INFINITE REGRESS, positing an INFINITE number of

causes/meta-gods. We are always told by philosophers and mathemeticians

that such an INFINITE REGRESS of axioms is somehow impossible or absurd

or unsatisfactory, but we are never told WHY an infinite regress of

causes or meta-gods is not a viable option.One

philosopher/theologian was once asked why the physical world and

humanity seems imperfect, and he answered, "Since God is PERFECT, and

it was necessary for God to CREATE THE UNIVERSE as OTHER than God,

therefore it was necessary for the Universe to be IMPERFECT." The

Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity and Islam) strongly object

to the notion that God is WITHIN the material universe. The notion that

the material universe IS God, a philosophy called PANTHEISM, is

denounced by those Abrahamic religions. Somehow, God has created the

material universe like some "Energizer Bunny", and set it on its merry

way. God is SO allergic to this material universe creation of his, that

God must send ANGELS or messengers to communicate or change things in

the Universe. Nor can God in anyway be SEEN visually, although there

are certainly times in scripture when God's "voice" is heard, loud and

clear. Somehow, its "OK" for God to shout into the Universe, just so

long as God never enters INTO the Universe. And yet somehow it is the

case, we are told, that we are EXPECTED TO PRAY to this God, that we

will be rewarded if we DO PRAY, and perhaps punished if we DO NOT. Partly

our prayer is PRAISE and submission or obedience, which this God likes

very much. And in part, our prayer makes REQUESTS to God for things

that we lack, or to alter circumstances which we find unpleasant. Some

religions claim that this God has never spoken to mankind DIRECTLY but

has always used Angels or Messengers, and yet, when we are asked to

PRAY, we are FORBIDDEN to pray to Angels, but are expected to pray to

God DIRECTLY, since praying to angels would constitute some form of

idolatry which would displease God. These circumstances surrounding

God's communication with mankind, and humanity's prayer communication

to God, are most bizarre. It is certainly not a "two-way street".We

find it perfectly reasonable and acceptable to believe that "God" was

first, and from God came the physical material universe, and human and

animal life. But suppose we were to turn everything upside down and

claim the OPPOSITE. Suppose we were to say that MATTER CAME first,.....

that matter evolved CONSCIOUSNESS, in the form of living beings, and

that this CONSCIOUSNESS eventually evolves into GOD.Most

people are horrified at the blasphemy of this reversal of things. And

yet why is it worse or less plausible than traditional cosmologies. If

you object and say "where did the MATTER originally come from?" I may

counter by saying that YOUR SYSTEMS never account for where GOD comes

from, so in this regard, the two conflicting systems seem on equal

footing. The end result of the new system is IDENTICAL to

the traditional system, namely, we wind up with a material universe AND

a God or Divinity.People will argue that this new system

makes God to be LESS perfect, since God/Consciousness EVOLVES from

matter. And yet it never bothers anyone to think that God, who was

PERFECT, and presumably in need of NOTHING, decided to create a world

of IMPERFECTION and suffering.Yet, this new system which I

describe, in which MATTER evolves CONSCIOUSNESS and CONSCIOUSNESS

evolves God, is rather at the heart of Carl Jung's writings, especially

his little monograph "On the Nature of the Psyche". Such a system also

fits in with the trends of Existentialist thought which have been

developing since Kierkegaard (and perhaps Blaise Pascal).Man

has unravelled the human genome. What may result from this

accomplishment in the coming millenium is anyone's guess. Alan Turing

was the first to suggest experiments in artificial intelligence. Should

mankind succeed not only in controlling genetics and creating life, but

also in creating a CONSCIOUSNESS which dwells in artifical

intelligence, then most certainly such a consciousness might one day

border on the divine.--- On Fri, 27/2/09, Kishore <mydearindian wrote:Kishore <mydearindian Why God created us and this Universe?sacred-objects Date: Friday, 27 February, 2009, 5:58 AMHi All,I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right answer.My question is "if God or some power" has got "lot ofenergy" to create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy. But "why to create us and asking us to recognize it"?. If there is no creation at all there will not be any need to know that power or God.I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways to reach God or Moksha.Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire

or with a good intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying to know is a kind one or a sadist?. Is it not like below story.I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping us in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot. But my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of creation??". Is it not a game playing with us. Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and we all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is "GOOD". Another team name is "Bad". I do agree that heshe might have created only Good. And we created bad. But why to create a team called "Good". If that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play a game with us?.Is it like this example "create a toy with your power and throw it into universe. Then the game rule is

that Toy has to recognize that creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth till that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a saddist/psycho or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the group members tell their views on this and clear this query.Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways( Meditation/pujas/homas) to reach God or Moksha. I want "why did he/she create us". If anybody realised/enlightened/or spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and reply.Thanks,M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.Email : mydearindian---

March 3, 2009

Thanks for sharing your views.

Have a nice & productive day,

With Best wishes, M.kishore.

If you don't like to read this E-mail then please mention in subject line "REMOVE".--- On Fri, 27/2/09, Ramesh Kamath .K <kamath52 wrote:

Ramesh Kamath .K <kamath52 Re: Why God created us and this Universe?sacred-objects Date: Friday, 27 February, 2009, 1:36 PM

People look at the world around them and they see a lot wrong with it. Babies are born with birth defects. People die tragically of cancer, leukemia, and a variety of genetic diseases over which they have no control. Earthquakes kill thousands of innocent people. Humans battle depression, loneliness, all kinds of mental illnesses and disorders. We suffer from drought, insect infestations, war -- the list is endless. Why didn't God create an earth where bad things, misery and pain simply could not happen?A wise teacher said, "If I can know the mind of God, then God isn't God." Anyone who claims to have all the answers is a person to avoid. We certainly have no interest in attempting to pretend to be God, but even with our limited human wisdom we can understand some of the reasons why God created the cosmos the way He did.Natural disasters are not in themselves evil or a failure of God. A

classic example of this is earthquakes. An earthquake causes massive damage to humans and can result in extreme losses of life. The fact is, however, that earthquakes are a part of the processes that keep the earth living and suitable for life. Land masses wear down with time because of rain, snow, freezing, heating, glaciers, landslides, and gravitational forces. If there were no forces that lift the land to replenish the worn away parts, after a while all land on the earth would be under water. Because the earth is liquid inside, land is constantly being lifted to replace the land that is worn down. Volcanoes do the same thing; but in addition, they add new elements and nutrients to the soil, making plant growth accelerate and sustaining the food chainDr.Ramesh KamathBangalorekamath52 sacred-objects, "Kishore" <mydearindian@ ...> wrote:>> Hi All,> > I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right > answer.> > > My question is "if God or some power" has got "lot of energy" to > create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy. But "why > to create us and asking us to recognize it"?. If there is no creation > at all there will not be any need to know that power or God.> > I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways to > reach God or Moksha.> > > Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire or with a good > intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying to know is a kind one > or a sadist?. Is it not like below

story.> > I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to > live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping us > in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot. But > my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of > creation??". Is it not a game playing with us. > Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and we > all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is "GOOD". Another > team name is "Bad". I do agree that heshe might have created only > Good. And we created bad. But why to create a team called "Good". If > that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play a > game with us?.> > Is it like this example "create a toy with your power and throw it > into universe. Then the game rule is that Toy has to recognize

that > creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )> otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth till > that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a saddist/psycho > or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please > kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the > group members tell their views on this and > clear this query.> > Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me > different ways( Meditation/pujas/ homas) to reach God or Moksha. I > want "why did he/she create us".. If anybody realised/enlightene d/or > spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and > reply.> > Thanks,> M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.> Email : mydearindian@

....>

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March 3, 2009

Richard:

Thanks for sharing your views. My views to my question is as follows:

A Telescope made by a human being is able to catch an object from space which is hundreds of Light Years away from the Earth. This instrument made by a human brain.

And there is one more instrument which an archeologist uses to calculate the age of a stone or given object by its layers etcâ€¦

So what I believe is when an instrument made by human brain is capable of traveling such a long distances and capable of calculating its age then the creator of those instruments I mean our human brain must have got much more capability of traveling long distance and can see what happened at the beginning of the universe or before the beginning of the universe what was there. We are more capable then those instruments.

Not all but some people tried to know this truth and found what happened and then they got enlightenment. Like Lord Buddha or Ramana Maharshi etcâ€¦ but these people unfortunately did not share their experience of enlightenment but fortunately they only taught how to live.

Anyway I am in search of a person who got enlightenment about the truth and who can guide me. I know it is difficult to locate such a person. If I fail to get answer then I too have to sit and search in myself and ask myself to get enlightenment about the truth. Truth is â€œit is a wonderful cheating game by Godâ€. But we do not know the real purpose of his game. It can be good or bad. My life motto is to know the motto of this game.

Though I love that â€œSupreme powerâ€ I have intense desire to know the truth of this universe and would like to talk to it. My sincere request to you is if your Guru is in India then I would like to talk to him. Kindly tell me his address if you wish and also kindly advise me some wonderful books from which I may get some knowledge.

Have a nice & productive day,

With Best wishes, M.kishore.

If you don't like to read this E-mail then please mention in subject line "REMOVE".--- On Fri, 27/2/09, Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 wrote:

Richard Shaw Brown <rsbj66 Re: Why God created us and this Universe?sacred-objects Date: Friday, 27 February, 2009, 3:34 PM

AN AFTER THOUGHT: From the time the eternal jivatma is injected intoMaya or prakriti, starting from the smallest birth as an atom (anu)and finally, after evolving through all species, as well as hells andheavens, to reach the stage of mukti - this is the nature of the"game" which Bhagavan has created at His own whim. And the process for the Jiva to start into Maya as an atom, thenevolve through 8 million subhuman species, then evolve 400,000 species of humanbirths, and to finally reach mukti, ...the whole process takes many creations and desolutions of the material energy. During the manifest material periods the jiva's can be conscious "chit" and even blissful "ananda"; but during the unmanifest periods (Pralayas) the Jivas are on hold in nidra and only function as "sat" (life) with the CHIT and ANANDA functions on hold. During Pralaya each Jiva is fixed at the last position of their karma, and when there is

new creation each Jiva starts from where it left off. Thus the huge variety of life forms. You may or may not agree with this assessment, but you asked, and this is what I was taught by my Gurus. Thanks. Y/s, R-sacred-objects, "Richard Shaw Brown"<rsbj66 wrote:>> Dear Sriman,> > Your question is very important. Late Acharya of the Sri> Gaudiya Mission, Pujya Tridandi Swami Bhakti Hridaya Vana Maharaj> (1901-1982), taught that the reason or purpose of this exercise,> whereby unlimited Jiva-souls pass progressively through Maya, is> acintya and known only to Sri Krishna Himself. It is useless to> ponder. We must understand how the process works, but we can never> know the reason 'why.'> > Why NOT!?> > All Jivas are eternal,

sometimes inactive (like during Pralaya and> Maha-pralaya) and sometimes active, but always alive (chit). It is> reasonable to say that no Jiva soul who had full developed> intelligence of his "self" would willingly choose the painful and> doomed path of Maya.> > Srila Vana Maharaj clearly taught that Jivas are injected (so to> speak) into Maya to work their way up and to Vaikuntha. The choice> comes when we reach human intelligence, as is the case right now. Even> now we could all choose to return to Vaikuntha immediately if we> really desired that 100%.> > The badha Jivas are meant to enter Maya and then work their way back> to Para-vyoma Brahma Puri or the City of the Absolute. It is just one> particular process designed by HARI for His Own fun 'n' games.> > In CC Kaviraj Goswami states, "Krishna bhuli shay Jiva anadi," we have>

forgotten Krishna since "before time" began, so there is no initial> choice. We cannot choose something, which is out of our memory.> > The Jiva begins his seemingly eternal material existence as a> microscopic life form, like an "anu," which is completely covered and> in state of ignorance. We do not have a rational understandable choice> until we reach human life; and amongst humans very few rarely question> reality.> > They do not choose in the beginning' because there is neither> beginning nor end for the Jiva. All Jivas are eternal, conscious and> blissful in essence (sat-chit-ananda) , being marginal chit particles> of Lord Hari.> > Swami Vana Maharaj emphasized THREE particular tattvas' as being> principle (in relation to us, the Jivas):> > (1) The eternal, all blissful, spiritual universe which is the> playground of the

Lord and lies within Paravyoma brahma-puri.> > (2) The temporary changeable, material universe, the endless ocean of> birth and death, prakriti, the jada-samsara.> > (3) All living beings seen or unseen who belong to the Jiva (soul)> potency which is all spiritual and blissful by nature andemanates from> in between the external and internal worlds.> > Although the Jiva Shakti lies in-between the spiritual and material> realms still the souls are always engaged in one or the other and do> not reside in the middle but only emanate' from that position by the> arrangement of Lord Vasudeva. Sarva karana karanam.> > The example of King Puranjana in Srimad Bhagavat pertains to a soul> already long within the jada-samsar. Therefore it is not relevant to> the issue of origin or original choice of the jiva.> > ---Y/s Richard>

> > sacred-objects, "Kishore" <mydearindian@ > wrote:> >> > Hi All,> >> > I have a question for you. I hope you will help me by giving right> > answer.> >> >> > My question is "if God or some power" has got "lot of energy" to> > create us and this universe then i appreciate it's energy. But "why> > to create us and asking us to recognize it"?. If there is no creation> > at all there will not be any need to know that power or God..> >> > I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me different ways to> > reach God or Moksha.> >> >> > Did that power/God create us with some selfish desire or with a good> > intention?. Is that God/power we all are trying

to know is a kind one> > or a sadist?. Is it not like below story.> >> > I do agree that ( so called power/God ) has provided everything to> > live and all ways to know him. And that power/God has been helping us> > in everything we do. I am not against to God. I respect it a lot. But> > my qestion is " why did that God take this resposibility of> > creation??". Is it not a game playing with us.> > Don't you feel like that power/God acting like a judge/referee and we> > all are partcipents in this game?. One team name is "GOOD". Another> > team name is "Bad". I do agree that heshe might have created only> > Good. And we created bad.. But why to create a team called "Good". If> > that God has got energy can't he/she let enjoy alone. Why to play a> > game with us?.> >> > Is it like this example "create a toy

with your power and throw it> > into universe. Then the game rule is that Toy has to recognize that> > creator but not the virtual universe created by him ( i mean Maya )> > otherwise that creator will kill that toy and give another birth till> > that toy know the creator.Are we struggling to know a saddist/psycho> > or are we struggling to know a Kind person ( God/Power). Please> > kindly answer my question in your own way. I appreciate if all the> > group members tell their views on this and> > clear this query.> >> > Once again, I trust God and his power. Hence, do not advice me> > different ways( Meditation/pujas/ homas) to reach God or Moksha. I> > want "why did he/she create us". If anybody realised/enlightene d/or> > spoke with God/ or has the capacity to speak with God then ask and> > reply.>

>> > Thanks,> > M.Kishore from Hyderabad,India.> > Email : mydearindian@> >>

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March 3, 2009

Namaste Kishore,

I agree that we are greater than any material instrument. And it is by

Yoga system that yogis strive for advanced siddhis, like dur-darshan,

anima, etc. But these are VERY difficult to achieve.

My Gurus told me the " Mahat-tattva " or material energy was only

" eka-pada-vibhuti " or only 25% of total existence. In that 25% are all

this universe and all other cosmos. Shastra says there are many

Brahmandas, not only this one. The other 75% Vibhuti in composed of

sat-chit-ananda Brahman - the total spiritual energy. And my Gurus say

we Jivas come from Bhagavan's " Jiva-tattva " and we reside in one or

the other (material or spiritual existence). Jivas are very tiny, but

like " rays of the sun " - we are of the same nature as God's spiritual

energy, sat-chit-ananda, therefore the Jiva living in Maya, which is

jada (life-less) is incompatible, and this incompatibility is seen as

birth, disease, old age, and death, followed by rebirth.

I was categorizing the Shaktis of Bhagavan into three main shaktis:

1) Spiritual energy (Brahman or Vaikuntha)

2) Marginal spiritual energy (Jivas)

3) Material energy (Maya).

These are Shaktis (powers) and Bhagavan is Shaktimaan (Power-source). As to WHY

it's this way, we can only assume from the facts that Bhagavan decided it to be

this way. Pretty ingenious system, really.

This is the way I heard from my Gurus. I hope it's helpful.

Y/s,

Richard

sacred-objects , kishore kishore

<mydearindian wrote:

>

> Richard:

> Â

> Thanks for sharing your views. MyÂ views to my question is as follows:

> Â

> A Telescope made by a human being is able to catch an object from

space which is hundreds of Light Years away from the Earth. This

instrument made by a human brain.

> Â

> And there is one more instrument which an archeologist uses to

calculate the age of a stone or given object by its layers etcâ€¦

> Â

> So what I believe is when an instrument made by human brain is

capable of traveling such a long distances and capable of calculating

its age then the creator of those instruments I mean our human brain

must have got much more capability of traveling long distance and can

see what happened at the beginning of the universe or before the

beginning of the universe what was there. We are more capable then

those instruments.

> Â

> Not all but some people tried to know this truth and found what

happened and then they got enlightenment. Like Lord Buddha or Ramana

Maharshi etcâ€¦ but these people unfortunately did not share their

experience of enlightenment but fortunately they only taught how to live.

> Â

> Anyway I am in search of a person who got enlightenment about the

truth and who can guide me. I know it is difficult to locate such a

person. If I fail to get answer then I too have to sit and search in

myself and ask myself to get enlightenment about the truth. Truth is

â€œit is a wonderful cheating game by Godâ€. But we do not know the

real purpose of his game. It can be good or bad. My life motto is to

know the motto of this game.

> Â

> Though I love that â€œSupreme powerâ€ I have intense desire to know

the truth of this universe and would like to talk to it. My sincere

request to you is if your Guru is in India then I would like to talk

to him. Kindly tell me his address if you wish and also kindly advise

me some wonderful books from which I may get some knowledge.

> Â

> Have a nice & productive day,

>

> With Best wishes,

> M.kishore.

> Â

> If you don't like to read this E-mail then please mention in subject

lineÂ " REMOVE " .