Guest guest Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Hari OMAtma is said to be ever-free (Nityamuktah). An individual is constituted of the Atma functioning in and through the equipment of the body, mind and intellect. The physical body is limited by its perceptions, mind by its emotions and intellect by its thoughts. The individual is conditioned by the limitations of the body,mind and intellect and their activities. There are living entities who are eternally conditioned ( Nitya Baddhaah). Atma is independent of these equipment and their activities. It is not conditioned or limited by the equipment and their functions. Atma remains ever free. Atma is like the Sun shining above. There could be many reflected suns which are conditioned by the quality of the reflecting media. Vedanta declares Atma as both eternal(Nitya) and free(Mukta). Atma is pure (Nirmalah). A substance is said to be impure when the material of which it is made is mixed with something other than it. A sample of gold is said to be impure if it contains any other metal in it. We have seen that Atma is all-pervading. There exists nothing other than Atma. Consequently it ever remains pure. Sankaracharya calls Atma as Nitya Suddha Buddha Mukta Svabhava Paramatman. Atma is also referred to by scriptures as perfect or not fallen or shaken from its own glory( Achyutah). The Self is ever perfect. It remains changeless and unaffected by changes occurring in this world. in much the same way as a waker is with reference to the occurrences in the dream world. When a waker enters the dream state he becomes the dreamer experiencing the drem world. Identifying with the dreamexperiences, the dreamer gets entangled with the joys and sorrows therein. But none of the experiences of the dream world can ever affect a waker. The waker ever remains free from the limitations of the dreamer and the dream world. The waker 'never falls' into the limitations of the dreamer. He is considered as not fallen ( Achyutah) with reference to the dream and its experiences. Likewise, Atma may appear to have acquired an individuality but it never falls into the limitations of the individual or the world he experiences. Scriptures declare Atma as same in all ( Sarva Samah). Atma is one and the same in all beings. The one Atma is functioning through different equipment manifesting differently, producing a heterogeneous variety of living creatures. It is like the one electricity expressing itself differently in the variety of electricl equipment. Atma is indicated in scriptures as accomplished, perfect, complete and fulfilled ( Siddhah). Atma is the final goal of evolution. When we realise the Atma we reach the highest perfection. There exists nothing beyond Atma. It is a state of absolute accomplishment, completion and fulfilment in human evolution. Atma is ever perfect. All perfection is already there in the soul within us. But the perfection has been covered up by nature; layer after layer of nature is covering the purity of the soul. (to be continued) G.Balasubramanian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Dear Balasubramanian sir, iam not comfort to translate thirumanthiram verse in english. But i can tell the meaning that the form of atma is number ten ie in Tamil number ten =ya(tamil number for ten)The shape of ya is wat i have drawn in the picture. +Thirumanthiram is a collection of 3000 verses written by Thirumoolar, a tamil siddhar. i have drawn about 200 pictures for 200 verses of thirumanthiram. It can be seen in my website photo gallery. www.namashivayam.com m.namasivayam --- On Mon, 20/7/09, G Balasubramanian <gbsub wrote: G Balasubramanian <gbsubRe: SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMA Date: Monday, 20 July, 2009, 1:55 AM Dear Namassivayam,Can you kindly provide an English translation for the Tamil verse. Also pl. state as to who drew this picture and who has written the Tamil Verse on it.G.Balasubramanian nama siva <nama_sivam >om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comSunday, July 19, 2009 1:01:36 PMRe: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMA [1 Attachment] thirumoolar says atma has form pl look at the pic attached and thirumanthiram verse m.namasivayam--- On Sun, 19/7/09, G Balasubramanian <gbsub > wrote: G Balasubramanian <gbsub >[om_namah_shivaya_ group] SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMAUSBrahmins@gro ups.comCc: om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comSunday, 19 July, 2009, 5:42 PM Hari OM We have been talking about Atma as Eternal, everlasting, immortal ,immutable, indestructable etc. etc. The word Nitya used in connection with Atma in the scriptures indicates that Atma was existing from the infinite past, is existing at present and will exist in the infinite future. Atma is said to be without any desire and thought or free from conditionings (Nirvikalpa) . Incidentally, the impersonal unconditioned stae is referred to as NIRVIKALPA SAMADHI in which state , the senses and mind stop their functions. Since Atma is mindless(Amaanaskah) it is also unconditioned and without thoughts ( Nirvikalpah) . Atma is also unsullied (NIranjanah). Anjanah means stain or dirt which refers to Vasanas , the inherent tendencies ,traits, or characteristics which define our personality.. . They enshroud the Atma in us. But Atma is beyond the Vasanas. Atma," though residing in body, does not get contaminated" , as declared by Lord Krishna in chapter 13 of the Gita ( Sareerasthopi Kaunteya na lipyate). The impurities of the mind constitute the obstructions to the knowledge of the ever-present, divine and immortal dimension of man. These impurities are centered in the ego, in its attachments and bondage to the organic system. Search for Truth calls for "elimination of these impurities which alone gives the mind the power to penetrate from the surface to the depths of nature, external or internal", as Swamy Vivekananda calls it. Atma is changeless or without modification(Nirvikarah) . The body, mind and Intellect are ever changing in us. A change is noticeable only with reference to a changeless entity. Since we are aware of the changes occuring in us ,there must be a changeless aspect or centre in us with respect to which these changes are cogniseable. This changeless substratum upon which the changes of the body, mind and intellect take place is that pure Self (ATMA). The Self is immutable. Atma is indicated as Avikaryah ie., immutable in the second chapter of the Gita. Moreover, Atma is formless. We know that an object assumes a form when there exists something other than it beyond its material boundary... For example, a ball has a particular form because there is something other than the material of the ball beyond its outline. If the material of the ball extends beyond its outline , the ball will lose its particular shape and form. Since Atma is all-pervading , there exists nothing other than it to define its outline. Hence Atma can not have a form (Aroopam as stated in Katopanishad) . (to be continued) G.Balasubramanian Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more. Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 Dear Namasivayam,Thanks for your response. I am not much familiar with Thirumoolar`s Thirumandhiram. Hence the request was made for translation. You are free to follow Tirumandiram and treat that Atma has some form as described in that work. As far as I am concerned, the Scriptures viz., Vedas, Upanishads and Gita are more sacrosant. I am comfortable with Vedic declarations according to which Atma has no form. Let us leave this at that.G.Balasubramaniannama siva <nama_sivam Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 10:27:52 AMRe: SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMA Dear Balasubramanian sir, iam not comfort to translate thirumanthiram verse in english. But i can tell the meaning that the form of atma is number ten ie in Tamil number ten =ya(tamil number for ten)The shape of ya is wat i have drawn in the picture. +Thirumanthiram is a collection of 3000 verses written by Thirumoolar, a tamil siddhar. i have drawn about 200 pictures for 200 verses of thirumanthiram. It can be seen in my website photo gallery. www.namashivayam. com m.namasivayam --- On Mon, 20/7/09, G Balasubramanian <gbsub (AT) (DOT) .com> wrote: G Balasubramanian <gbsub >Re: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMAom_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comMonday, 20 July, 2009, 1:55 AM Dear Namassivayam,Can you kindly provide an English translation for the Tamil verse. Also pl. state as to who drew this picture and who has written the Tamil Verse on it.G.Balasubramanian nama siva <nama_sivam >om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comSunday, July 19, 2009 1:01:36 PMRe: [om_namah_shivaya_ group] SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMA [1 Attachment] thirumoolar says atma has form pl look at the pic attached and thirumanthiram verse m.namasivayam--- On Sun, 19/7/09, G Balasubramanian <gbsub > wrote: G Balasubramanian <gbsub >[om_namah_shivaya_ group] SOME MORE THOUGHTS ON ATMAUSBrahmins@gro ups.comCc: om_namah_shivaya_ group@ s.comSunday, 19 July, 2009, 5:42 PM Hari OM We have been talking about Atma as Eternal, everlasting, immortal ,immutable, indestructable etc. etc. The word Nitya used in connection with Atma in the scriptures indicates that Atma was existing from the infinite past, is existing at present and will exist in the infinite future. Atma is said to be without any desire and thought or free from conditionings (Nirvikalpa) . Incidentally, the impersonal unconditioned stae is referred to as NIRVIKALPA SAMADHI in which state , the senses and mind stop their functions. Since Atma is mindless(Amaanaskah) it is also unconditioned and without thoughts ( Nirvikalpah) . Atma is also unsullied (NIranjanah). Anjanah means stain or dirt which refers to Vasanas , the inherent tendencies ,traits, or characteristics which define our personality. . . They enshroud the Atma in us. But Atma is beyond the Vasanas. Atma," though residing in body, does not get contaminated" , as declared by Lord Krishna in chapter 13 of the Gita ( Sareerasthopi Kaunteya na lipyate). The impurities of the mind constitute the obstructions to the knowledge of the ever-present, divine and immortal dimension of man. These impurities are centered in the ego, in its attachments and bondage to the organic system. Search for Truth calls for "elimination of these impurities which alone gives the mind the power to penetrate from the surface to the depths of nature, external or internal", as Swamy Vivekananda calls it. Atma is changeless or without modification(Nirvikarah) . The body, mind and Intellect are ever changing in us. A change is noticeable only with reference to a changeless entity. Since we are aware of the changes occuring in us ,there must be a changeless aspect or centre in us with respect to which these changes are cogniseable. This changeless substratum upon which the changes of the body, mind and intellect take place is that pure Self (ATMA). The Self is immutable. Atma is indicated as Avikaryah ie., immutable in the second chapter of the Gita. Moreover, Atma is formless. We know that an object assumes a form when there exists something other than it beyond its material boundary... For example, a ball has a particular form because there is something other than the material of the ball beyond its outline. If the material of the ball extends beyond its outline , the ball will lose its particular shape and form. Since Atma is all-pervading , there exists nothing other than it to define its outline. Hence Atma can not have a form (Aroopam as stated in Katopanishad) . (to be continued) G.Balasubramanian Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more. Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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