Guest guest Posted October 20, 2008 Report Share Posted October 20, 2008 Kishore babu, can a Prakrit word/term emanate from Sanskrit ? db ===================================== - ODDISILAB Sunday, October 19, 2008 2:24 PM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). An prakrit phone arising out of sanskrit phone ? - kishore patnaik Sunday, October 19, 2008 10:48 AM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Sir, Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). You are trying to back form the word which is not acceptable. On the other hand, root of Raja is traced to Rex ( see my message archieved at /message/653) The main issue here is kingship was well formed by Rgvedic times, which is generallly accepted by all, except a handful leftist authors. The original meanings of Arya have got to do with 'stranger" (in south Indian langauges, Ari means enemy, which is not found in North Indian langauges) vis a vis the word Manu (refer certain Rg Vedic hymns where Manavas are addressed along with Asuras - here both being tribes, Manavas are a tribe derived from Manu, the name Manava for a human being might have been a later development) See how the South Indian languages attest this again - Mana stands for we ! The oldest societal dichotomy could be very well understood from these aspects - Arya vs Manu tribes which have to be very carefully understood in the Puranic contexts. regards, Kishore patnaik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2008 Report Share Posted October 22, 2008 To Shri Tiwari Ya and Ja are interchangeable (both ways)...Jajman is Yajaman in Tamil (the origin is certainly Skr) for example...many more to quote as the Tamil language does not have the akshara 'ja' and most of them change to either 'cha' or 'ya' which means that 'ya' is not always the one that changes to'ja' but vice-versa also is true. -- Riverine On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:49 PM, Sarvesh Tiwari <sarveshtiwari wrote: plus, those who suggested that " j " and " y " are " interchangeable " - have yet to substantiate it. " ya " becoming " ja " has several examples (yamunA/jamunA, yAchaka/jAchaka, yama/jama, yAdava/jAdava, yuga/juga), but " ja " becoming " ya " - please give examples. From: oddisilab1Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 21:36:13 +0530 Speed Cause Accidents. Kishore babu, can a Prakrit word/term emanate from Sanskrit ? db ===================================== - ODDISILAB Sunday, October 19, 2008 2:24 PM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). An prakrit phone arising out of sanskrit phone ? - kishore patnaik Sunday, October 19, 2008 10:48 AM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Sir, Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). You are trying to back form the word which is not acceptable. On the other hand, root of Raja is traced to Rex ( see my message archieved at /message/653) The main issue here is kingship was well formed by Rgvedic times, which is generallly accepted by all, except a handful leftist authors. The original meanings of Arya have got to do with 'stranger " (in south Indian langauges, Ari means enemy, which is not found in North Indian langauges) vis a vis the word Manu (refer certain Rg Vedic hymns where Manavas are addressed along with Asuras - here both being tribes, Manavas are a tribe derived from Manu, the name Manava for a human being might have been a later development) See how the South Indian languages attest this again - Mana stands for we ! The oldest societal dichotomy could be very well understood from these aspects - Arya vs Manu tribes which have to be very carefully understood in the Puranic contexts. regards, Kishore patnaik Get the latest buzz on outsourcing. Up to date information on mergers, acquisitions and deals on BPO Watch. Try it now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2008 Report Share Posted October 22, 2008 Shri Bhattacharya There is absolutely no 'Ja' in the Tamil Akshara. It is automatically changed to 'cha' or 'sa' or 'ya' as and when such a word is assimilated into Tamil. eg: Raja is Arasan here (Raja - Rasa - Rasan - Arasan) There are grammatical rules that do not allow the letter 'ra' to take lead in a word (eg. Ranganathan is Aranganathan in Tamil). Of course, you must be familiar with the 'an' ending of Tamil and Malayalam. I am not well versed in Tamil literature, but I am sure Arasan was quite in use during the Sangam period. This being the case, there should have also had some instances where 'ja' turned to 'ya'... On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 10:20 PM, ODDISILAB <oddisilab1 wrote: DO Ya AND Ja FLIP EITHER WAYs ALSO IN SANGAM PERIOD TAMIL LITERATURE ? Regards db ============= Dr. Deepak Bhattacharya C/o Radha Krishna Kedar Gouri Road Bhubaneswar-751002 - Yamuna Harshavardhana Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:32 PM Re: Speed Cause Accidents. To Shri Tiwari Ya and Ja are interchangeable (both ways)...Jajman is Yajaman in Tamil (the origin is certainly Skr) for example...many more to quote as the Tamil language does not have the akshara 'ja' and most of them change to either 'cha' or 'ya' which means that 'ya' is not always the one that changes to'ja' but vice-versa also is true. -- Riverine On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:49 PM, Sarvesh Tiwari <sarveshtiwari wrote: plus, those who suggested that " j " and " y " are " interchangeable " - have yet to substantiate it. " ya " becoming " ja " has several examples (yamunA/jamunA, yAchaka/jAchaka, yama/jama, yAdava/jAdava, yuga/juga), but " ja " becoming " ya " - please give examples. From: oddisilab1Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 21:36:13 +0530 Speed Cause Accidents. Kishore babu, can a Prakrit word/term emanate from Sanskrit ? db ===================================== - ODDISILAB Sunday, October 19, 2008 2:24 PM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). An prakrit phone arising out of sanskrit phone ? - kishore patnaik Sunday, October 19, 2008 10:48 AM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Sir, Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). You are trying to back form the word which is not acceptable. On the other hand, root of Raja is traced to Rex ( see my message archieved at /message/653) The main issue here is kingship was well formed by Rgvedic times, which is generallly accepted by all, except a handful leftist authors. The original meanings of Arya have got to do with 'stranger " (in south Indian langauges, Ari means enemy, which is not found in North Indian langauges) vis a vis the word Manu (refer certain Rg Vedic hymns where Manavas are addressed along with Asuras - here both being tribes, Manavas are a tribe derived from Manu, the name Manava for a human being might have been a later development) See how the South Indian languages attest this again - Mana stands for we ! The oldest societal dichotomy could be very well understood from these aspects - Arya vs Manu tribes which have to be very carefully understood in the Puranic contexts. regards, Kishore patnaik Get the latest buzz on outsourcing. Up to date information on mergers, acquisitions and deals on BPO Watch. Try it now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2008 Report Share Posted October 23, 2008 To Shri Ravi There are many many words in use in Tamil today like the ones you mention, however, there is none in pure Tamil because the akshara is simply absent. SO, to write Jallikkattu, one has to use either the 'ja' of Grantham script or 'sa'. Jambulingam is a corrupt version of Shambhulingam (the 'Ja' used in TN here is surprising!!!). Jaalavidya of course, is Skr simply borrowed into usage but again, cannot be written. --Riverine On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 8:49 AM, Ravi <ravi7640 wrote: A doubt. What about 'Jallikettu' 'Jaalavidya' (magic) 'Jambulingam' etc? Do you mean the pronunciation of 'Ja' is always 'ya' etc? Ravi Yamuna Harshavardhana Wednesday, October 22, 2008 8:28 PM Re: Speed Cause Accidents. Shri Bhattacharya There is absolutely no 'Ja' in the Tamil Akshara. It is automatically changed to 'cha' or 'sa' or 'ya' as and when such a word is assimilated into Tamil. eg: Raja is Arasan here (Raja - Rasa - Rasan - Arasan) There are grammatical rules that do not allow the letter 'ra' to take lead in a word (eg. Ranganathan is Aranganathan in Tamil). Of course, you must be familiar with the 'an' ending of Tamil and Malayalam. I am not well versed in Tamil literature, but I am sure Arasan was quite in use during the Sangam period. This being the case, there should have also had some instances where 'ja' turned to 'ya'... On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 10:20 PM, ODDISILAB <oddisilab1 wrote: DO Ya AND Ja FLIP EITHER WAYs ALSO IN SANGAM PERIOD TAMIL LITERATURE ? Regards db ============= Dr. Deepak Bhattacharya C/o Radha Krishna Kedar Gouri Road Bhubaneswar-751002 - Yamuna Harshavardhana Wednesday, October 22, 2008 12:32 PM Re: Speed Cause Accidents. To Shri Tiwari Ya and Ja are interchangeable (both ways)...Jajman is Yajaman in Tamil (the origin is certainly Skr) for example...many more to quote as the Tamil language does not have the akshara 'ja' and most of them change to either 'cha' or 'ya' which means that 'ya' is not always the one that changes to'ja' but vice-versa also is true. -- Riverine On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 11:49 PM, Sarvesh Tiwari <sarveshtiwari wrote: plus, those who suggested that " j " and " y " are " interchangeable " - have yet to substantiate it. " ya " becoming " ja " has several examples (yamunA/jamunA, yAchaka/jAchaka, yama/jama, yAdava/jAdava, yuga/juga), but " ja " becoming " ya " - please give examples. From: oddisilab1Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 21:36:13 +0530 Speed Cause Accidents. Kishore babu, can a Prakrit word/term emanate from Sanskrit ? db ===================================== - ODDISILAB Sunday, October 19, 2008 2:24 PM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). An prakrit phone arising out of sanskrit phone ? - kishore patnaik Sunday, October 19, 2008 10:48 AM Re: Histo-Cultural Phonetics Sir, Raya (Prkt) is a dervied from Rajah (skt.). You are trying to back form the word which is not acceptable. On the other hand, root of Raja is traced to Rex ( see my message archieved at /message/653) The main issue here is kingship was well formed by Rgvedic times, which is generallly accepted by all, except a handful leftist authors. The original meanings of Arya have got to do with 'stranger " (in south Indian langauges, Ari means enemy, which is not found in North Indian langauges) vis a vis the word Manu (refer certain Rg Vedic hymns where Manavas are addressed along with Asuras - here both being tribes, Manavas are a tribe derived from Manu, the name Manava for a human being might have been a later development) See how the South Indian languages attest this again - Mana stands for we ! The oldest societal dichotomy could be very well understood from these aspects - Arya vs Manu tribes which have to be very carefully understood in the Puranic contexts. regards, Kishore patnaik Get the latest buzz on outsourcing. Up to date information on mergers, acquisitions and deals on BPO Watch. Try it now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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