Guest guest Posted February 3, 2008 Report Share Posted February 3, 2008 I don't see any benefit from participating in this poll. It only serves to satisfy someone's need to find the truth. I've been a regular at the California ashram for the last 2.5 years, and not once have I found anyone to be rude, etc. Nor do I find or look for this elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, etc. It all has to do with how one colors the world. You can chose to see and look for faults anywhere you go and care more about it than the beauty and goodness that exists all around us constantly. One person's perspective culturally does not become another's truth. Maybe it's because I'm deaf and naive, but I think it's a good thing anyways. It allows me to always see the good and be at peace no matter what occurs around me. I count my blessings. Even if people do act rude, callious or arrogant whether at an ashram or elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something we have control over. If one constantly focuses on these negative qualities in people, there's no peace for the mind. Even if one finds fault in another, we still have faults within ourselves that aren't any better either. Didn't Amma say that before we can judge another, we have to first judge ourselves? And Jesus said that we need to walk a mile in another's shoes before making judgments. In order to always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we have to first clear those things within us. In the act of changing ourselves within, we end up changing others around us. Have any of you read " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield? In this book, this guy was in Tibet and was encountering negative behaviors in people around him. He tried to change something within himself and as a result people around him started behaving in more loving and peaceful ways. Soooo....if it were true that someone did encounter rude, callous, arrogant people, that is only because it was a mirror that reflected the disharmony within that person. We all create the environment that occurs around us based on what is going on within us. One person's truth of this matter is not going to become another's truth. Even a poll is not going to be based on reality regardless because one person's experiences or truth do not become another's own. Rather, if one experiences these disharmonic behaviors anywhere, it should be taken as an opportunity to focus on what we need to work on changing or improving within ourselves. Everything is a gift. Life is a guru. We are always given opportunities to grow and to become our fullest potential. It's a waste of time to bicker about what's wrong with other people. That does no one good on both sides. Rather the question should be, can we be at peace regardless of how people behave around us? Isn't that the goal of spirituality? Ever at Amma's Lotus Feet, Stacy ______________________________\ ____ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2008 Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 You either do not genuinely " see any benefit from participating in this poll " or you blithely do not want to see the Truth. By the way, by Amma's ashram, I mean the ashram in India, not elsewhere, about which, I regret to say, I have (at this moment) no knowledge of. You said, " not once have I found anyone to be rude... nor do I find or look for this elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, etc.... " One does not have to concertedly go in search of all these. They are there. You merely witness them. It is all well and good and speciously " spiritual " to claim, " It all has to do with how one colors the world. " We are neither Yudhistra (of the Mahabarath) nor Jeyadeva Swamigal (the author of Aishtapathy) to be able to choose " to see... the beauty and goodness that exists all around us constantly... " . It is, owing to their eons of sadhana, natural in them to see but the 'goodness' in others. To imitate them is just being a Western ostrich or an Indian cat! When facing the truth of a matter we are not talking about just " One person's perspective " --- the Truth is the Truth. In whatever way you look at it, it remains as it is -- that is why it is THE Truth. On this score, 'culture', 'political inclination' or 'religious affiliation' have no relation to what is seen. If you claim that " it allows (you) to always see the good and be at peace no matter what occurs around me... " then, why didn't you see the good(ness) in the poll that I created. What is so objectionable about that in your blessed vision? You, indeed, seem abysmally 'naive' when you said, " Even if people do act rude, callious (sic) or arrogant whether at an ashram or elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something we have control over... " If that is so, as we have no control over terrorism, rape, treachery, robbery, child-molestation, etc. why don't we just surrender to them, and don't complain about them. Don't we take up the cudgels against them? Or should we, like pseudo-spiritualists, resign to the blueprint fate, and chant 'Om'? Once again, it is all 'spurious' to spout things like, " If one constantly focuses on these negative qualities in people, there's no peace for the mind. Even if one finds fault in another, we still have faults within ourselves that aren't any better either... " Come on, did Amma, whom you quoted here, advocate indifference to injustice and wrong-doing? Did the Gita, which Amma has often quoted in all Her nine volumes, talks of (in)action? Pointing out what is wrong, or praising what is right isn't passing judgement. If so, to say that I am wrong in posting the poll in itself IS being judgemental. To say what is right, that one should see only what is right IS judgemental. Try maintaining your equanimity in the face of the aforesaid injustice like child-molestation, rape, etc, and try preaching, " In order to always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we have to first clear those things within us... " I shall laud you. 'Changing ourselves' is not the same as 'keeping silent' about wrong-doings. That is not only criminal in some jursdictions, but also highly 'un-spiritual' and sinful even. Before reading " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield, (as Amma's followers and disciples [well, if you are]) read Amma's nine volumes FIRST. That SHALL do you more good! Quote me from any of Her words therein that my poll and posting are/were wrong. Remember, being 'loving' and 'peaceful' is not being complaisant. There is so much strength in being spiritual --- we see this in Amma too. Like I had explained in one of my previous postings, when I talk of the Truth, I am not referring to my 'truth' or your 'truth', but to THE Truth, the Truth which abides and endures despite anything. It is this Truth which was sought through the poll and my postings. Would you dare say, Stacy, " Everything is a gift.. " , when you lose your property to a thief or when you are accosted in a dark alley by a band of rapists? If what you say is from your heart, " We are always given opportunities to grow and to become our fullest potential... " , then, why shy away from the opportunities given in everything, including a poll? Or are you being judgemental? The goal of spiritual life, fundamentally, is " God-realisation " . Nothing less. Ammachi , Stacy Moskus <stacysgarage wrote: > > I don't see any benefit from participating in this poll. It only serves to satisfy someone's need to find the truth. I've been a regular at the California ashram for the last 2.5 years, and not once have I found anyone to be rude, etc. Nor do I find or look for this elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, etc. It all has to do with how one colors the world. You can chose to see and look for faults anywhere you go and care more about it than the beauty and goodness that exists all around us constantly. One person's perspective culturally does not become another's truth. Maybe it's because I'm deaf and naive, but I think it's a good thing anyways. It allows me to always see the good and be at peace no matter what occurs around me. I count my blessings. > > Even if people do act rude, callious or arrogant whether at an ashram or elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something we have control over. If one constantly focuses on these negative qualities in people, there's no peace for the mind. Even if one finds fault in another, we still have faults within ourselves that aren't any better either. Didn't Amma say that before we can judge another, we have to first judge ourselves? And Jesus said that we need to walk a mile in another's shoes before making judgments. > > In order to always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we have to first clear those things within us. In the act of changing ourselves within, we end up changing others around us. Have any of you read " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield? In this book, this guy was in Tibet and was encountering negative behaviors in people around him. He tried to change something within himself and as a result people around him started behaving in more loving and peaceful ways. Soooo....if it were true that someone did encounter rude, callous, arrogant people, that is only because it was a mirror that reflected the disharmony within that person. We all create the environment that occurs around us based on what is going on within us. One person's truth of this matter is not going to become another's truth. Even a poll is not going to be based on reality regardless because one person's experiences or truth do not become another's own. > > > Rather, if one experiences these disharmonic behaviors anywhere, it should be taken as an opportunity to focus on what we need to work on changing or improving within ourselves. Everything is a gift. Life is a guru. We are always given opportunities to grow and to become our fullest potential. It's a waste of time to bicker about what's wrong with other people. That does no one good on both sides. Rather the question should be, can we be at peace regardless of how people behave around us? Isn't that the goal of spirituality? > > Ever at Amma's Lotus Feet, > Stacy > > > > ______________________________\ ____ > Looking for last minute shopping deals? > Find them fast with Search. http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2008 Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 There is a huge difference between perceiving or seeing rude people as opposed to people committing criminal or very hurtful acts. The latter isn't what we are discussing here. Of course how we react to these two extreme spectrums are different. How I react towards minor behaviors such as people having a bad day, not being considerate, not being compassionate, being rude, arrogant etc. is not worth it; however, when it comes to injustice, when people are being hurt on purpose, of course I'm going to take a stand. So I don't know how you came up to the conclusion that my words also referred to hurtful and criminal behaviors as I never mentioned those things once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2008 Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 g461.... g..., it is unfortunate that you have had this experience and understandable that you would be angry about it and want to be heard. However, this conversation has spiraled down into bitter and murky depths which still are not useful to anyone. If you really want clarity on this, perhaps you should voice these concerns directly to Amma. Michele Ammachi , " g461 " <g461 wrote: > > You either do not genuinely " see any benefit from participating in > this poll " or you blithely do not want to see the Truth. By the way, > by Amma's ashram, I mean the ashram in India, not elsewhere, about > which, I regret to say, I have (at this moment) no knowledge of. > > You said, " not once have I found anyone to be rude... nor do I find or > look for this elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, > etc.... " One does not have to concertedly go in search of all these. > They are there. You merely witness them. > > It is all well and good and speciously " spiritual " to claim, " It all > has to do with how one colors the world. " We are neither Yudhistra (of > the Mahabarath) nor Jeyadeva Swamigal (the author of Aishtapathy) to > be able to choose " to see... the beauty and goodness that exists all > around us constantly... " . It is, owing to their eons of sadhana, > natural in them to see but the 'goodness' in others. To imitate them > is just being a Western ostrich or an Indian cat! > > When facing the truth of a matter we are not talking about just " One > person's perspective " --- the Truth is the Truth. In whatever way you > look at it, it remains as it is -- that is why it is THE Truth. On > this score, 'culture', 'political inclination' or 'religious > affiliation' have no relation to what is seen. > > If you claim that " it allows (you) to always see the good and be at > peace no matter what occurs around me... " then, why didn't you see the > good(ness) in the poll that I created. What is so objectionable about > that in your blessed vision? > > You, indeed, seem abysmally 'naive' when you said, " Even if people do > act rude, callious (sic) or arrogant whether at an ashram or > elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something we have > control over... " If that is so, as we have no control over terrorism, > rape, treachery, robbery, child-molestation, etc. why don't we just > surrender to them, and don't complain about them. Don't we take up the > cudgels against them? Or should we, like pseudo-spiritualists, resign > to the blueprint fate, and chant 'Om'? > > Once again, it is all 'spurious' to spout things like, " If one > constantly focuses on these negative qualities in people, there's no > peace for the mind. Even if one finds fault in another, we still have > faults within ourselves that aren't any better either... " Come on, did > Amma, whom you quoted here, advocate indifference to injustice and > wrong-doing? Did the Gita, which Amma has often quoted in all Her nine > volumes, talks of (in)action? > > Pointing out what is wrong, or praising what is right isn't passing > judgement. If so, to say that I am wrong in posting the poll in itself > IS being judgemental. To say what is right, that one should see only > what is right IS judgemental. > > Try maintaining your equanimity in the face of the aforesaid injustice > like child-molestation, rape, etc, and try preaching, " In order to > always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we have to first > clear those things within us... " I shall laud you. > > 'Changing ourselves' is not the same as 'keeping silent' about > wrong-doings. That is not only criminal in some jursdictions, but also > highly 'un-spiritual' and sinful even. > > Before reading " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield, (as Amma's > followers and disciples [well, if you are]) read Amma's nine volumes > FIRST. That SHALL do you more good! Quote me from any of Her words > therein that my poll and posting are/were wrong. > > Remember, being 'loving' and 'peaceful' is not being complaisant. > There is so much strength in being spiritual --- we see this in Amma too. > > Like I had explained in one of my previous postings, when I talk of > the Truth, I am not referring to my 'truth' or your 'truth', but to > THE Truth, the Truth which abides and endures despite anything. It is > this Truth which was sought through the poll and my postings. > > Would you dare say, Stacy, " Everything is a gift.. " , when you lose > your property to a thief or when you are accosted in a dark alley by a > band of rapists? If what you say is from your heart, " We are always > given opportunities to grow and to become our fullest potential... " , > then, why shy away from the opportunities given in everything, > including a poll? Or are you being judgemental? > > The goal of spiritual life, fundamentally, is " God-realisation " . > Nothing less. > > Ammachi , Stacy Moskus <stacysgarage@> wrote: > > > > I don't see any benefit from participating in this poll. It only > serves to satisfy someone's need to find the truth. I've been a > regular at the California ashram for the last 2.5 years, and not once > have I found anyone to be rude, etc. Nor do I find or look for this > elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, etc. It all has to do > with how one colors the world. You can chose to see and look for > faults anywhere you go and care more about it than the beauty and > goodness that exists all around us constantly. One person's > perspective culturally does not become another's truth. Maybe it's > because I'm deaf and naive, but I think it's a good thing anyways. It > allows me to always see the good and be at peace no matter what occurs > around me. I count my blessings. > > > > Even if people do act rude, callious or arrogant whether at an > ashram or elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something we > have control over. If one constantly focuses on these negative > qualities in people, there's no peace for the mind. Even if one finds > fault in another, we still have faults within ourselves that aren't > any better either. Didn't Amma say that before we can judge another, > we have to first judge ourselves? And Jesus said that we need to walk > a mile in another's shoes before making judgments. > > > > In order to always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we > have to first clear those things within us. In the act of changing > ourselves within, we end up changing others around us. Have any of you > read " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield? In this book, this > guy was in Tibet and was encountering negative behaviors in people > around him. He tried to change something within himself and as a > result people around him started behaving in more loving and peaceful > ways. Soooo....if it were true that someone did encounter rude, > callous, arrogant people, that is only because it was a mirror that > reflected the disharmony within that person. We all create the > environment that occurs around us based on what is going on within us. > One person's truth of this matter is not going to become another's > truth. Even a poll is not going to be based on reality regardless > because one person's experiences or truth do not become another's own. > > > > > > Rather, if one experiences these disharmonic behaviors anywhere, it > should be taken as an opportunity to focus on what we need to work on > changing or improving within ourselves. Everything is a gift. Life is > a guru. We are always given opportunities to grow and to become our > fullest potential. It's a waste of time to bicker about what's wrong > with other people. That does no one good on both sides. Rather the > question should be, can we be at peace regardless of how people behave > around us? Isn't that the goal of spirituality? > > > > Ever at Amma's Lotus Feet, > > Stacy > > > > > > > > > ____________________ ______________ > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? > > Find them fast with Search. > http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php? category=shopping > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 What are " criminal " and " hurtful " acts? Aren't they just one's perception, one's own cognitive understanding of actions? Independent of those perceptions, 'acts' remain acts --- woefully neutral. Setting a bomb, blowing up trains, massacring children, assassinations could all be criminal, but to the adherents of some beliefs, they are holy --- wholly holy! Someone's wounding our religious feeling can be classed 'hurtful acts', but to the proselyte, it is spreading the 'Word of God'. They are mere perceptions, essentially. The aforesaid indifferences are mere extension of seeing " the beauty and goodness that exists all around us constantly " , and of your ability to " see the good and be at peace no matter WHAT occurs around (you), and of course of understanding that " ...Everything IS a gift " . (emphasis added by this author). Isn't the fault of the crime that you see in others, and even your putting an act down as 'hurtful' mere judgements that arise from your OWN understanding of what is right and wrong? Some of the ashramites' callous behaviour can become (going strictly by the Indian Penal Code) 'criminal', much of their rude conduct is but 'hurtful'. Should we put down the Gaandiba like Arjuna in chapter 1 (of the Gita) and " see the good and be at peace no matter WHAT occurs " , or should we be 'fearless' (as the way the Gita says in Chapter 16) and call the spade the spade? Which of these Amma advocate? Ammachi , " Stacy " <stacysgarage wrote: > > There is a huge difference between perceiving or seeing rude people as > opposed to people committing criminal or very hurtful acts. The latter > isn't what we are discussing here. Of course how we react to these two > extreme spectrums are different. How I react towards minor behaviors > such as people having a bad day, not being considerate, not being > compassionate, being rude, arrogant etc. is not worth it; however, > when it comes to injustice, when people are being hurt on purpose, of > course I'm going to take a stand. So I don't know how you came up to > the conclusion that my words also referred to hurtful and criminal > behaviors as I never mentioned those things once. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 It is not the cry in me to be heard. In faith, far from it. It is to bring about an awareness in every one of us. Amma doesn't have to be told. As I type this here, She knows what it. Amma knows what is happening in the ashram. Sadly, She knows. Ammachi , " Michele " <creator wrote: > > g461.... > g..., it is unfortunate that you have had this experience and > understandable that you would be angry about it and want to be heard. > However, this conversation has spiraled down into bitter and murky > depths which still are not useful to anyone. If you really want > clarity on this, perhaps you should voice these concerns directly to > Amma. > Michele > > Ammachi , " g461 " <g461@> wrote: > > > > You either do not genuinely " see any benefit from participating in > > this poll " or you blithely do not want to see the Truth. By the way, > > by Amma's ashram, I mean the ashram in India, not elsewhere, about > > which, I regret to say, I have (at this moment) no knowledge of. > > > > You said, " not once have I found anyone to be rude... nor do I find > or > > look for this elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, > > etc.... " One does not have to concertedly go in search of all these. > > They are there. You merely witness them. > > > > It is all well and good and speciously " spiritual " to claim, " It all > > has to do with how one colors the world. " We are neither Yudhistra > (of > > the Mahabarath) nor Jeyadeva Swamigal (the author of Aishtapathy) to > > be able to choose " to see... the beauty and goodness that exists all > > around us constantly... " . It is, owing to their eons of sadhana, > > natural in them to see but the 'goodness' in others. To imitate them > > is just being a Western ostrich or an Indian cat! > > > > When facing the truth of a matter we are not talking about just " One > > person's perspective " --- the Truth is the Truth. In whatever way > you > > look at it, it remains as it is -- that is why it is THE Truth. On > > this score, 'culture', 'political inclination' or 'religious > > affiliation' have no relation to what is seen. > > > > If you claim that " it allows (you) to always see the good and be at > > peace no matter what occurs around me... " then, why didn't you see > the > > good(ness) in the poll that I created. What is so objectionable > about > > that in your blessed vision? > > > > You, indeed, seem abysmally 'naive' when you said, " Even if people > do > > act rude, callious (sic) or arrogant whether at an ashram or > > elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something we have > > control over... " If that is so, as we have no control over > terrorism, > > rape, treachery, robbery, child-molestation, etc. why don't we just > > surrender to them, and don't complain about them. Don't we take up > the > > cudgels against them? Or should we, like pseudo-spiritualists, > resign > > to the blueprint fate, and chant 'Om'? > > > > Once again, it is all 'spurious' to spout things like, " If one > > constantly focuses on these negative qualities in people, there's no > > peace for the mind. Even if one finds fault in another, we still > have > > faults within ourselves that aren't any better either... " Come on, > did > > Amma, whom you quoted here, advocate indifference to injustice and > > wrong-doing? Did the Gita, which Amma has often quoted in all Her > nine > > volumes, talks of (in)action? > > > > Pointing out what is wrong, or praising what is right isn't passing > > judgement. If so, to say that I am wrong in posting the poll in > itself > > IS being judgemental. To say what is right, that one should see only > > what is right IS judgemental. > > > > Try maintaining your equanimity in the face of the aforesaid > injustice > > like child-molestation, rape, etc, and try preaching, " In order to > > always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we have to first > > clear those things within us... " I shall laud you. > > > > 'Changing ourselves' is not the same as 'keeping silent' about > > wrong-doings. That is not only criminal in some jursdictions, but > also > > highly 'un-spiritual' and sinful even. > > > > Before reading " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield, (as > Amma's > > followers and disciples [well, if you are]) read Amma's nine volumes > > FIRST. That SHALL do you more good! Quote me from any of Her words > > therein that my poll and posting are/were wrong. > > > > Remember, being 'loving' and 'peaceful' is not being complaisant. > > There is so much strength in being spiritual --- we see this in > Amma too. > > > > Like I had explained in one of my previous postings, when I talk of > > the Truth, I am not referring to my 'truth' or your 'truth', but to > > THE Truth, the Truth which abides and endures despite anything. It > is > > this Truth which was sought through the poll and my postings. > > > > Would you dare say, Stacy, " Everything is a gift.. " , when you lose > > your property to a thief or when you are accosted in a dark alley > by a > > band of rapists? If what you say is from your heart, " We are always > > given opportunities to grow and to become our fullest potential... " , > > then, why shy away from the opportunities given in everything, > > including a poll? Or are you being judgemental? > > > > The goal of spiritual life, fundamentally, is " God-realisation " . > > Nothing less. > > > > Ammachi , Stacy Moskus <stacysgarage@> wrote: > > > > > > I don't see any benefit from participating in this poll. It only > > serves to satisfy someone's need to find the truth. I've been a > > regular at the California ashram for the last 2.5 years, and not > once > > have I found anyone to be rude, etc. Nor do I find or look for this > > elsewhere in the public such as grocery stores, etc. It all has to > do > > with how one colors the world. You can chose to see and look for > > faults anywhere you go and care more about it than the beauty and > > goodness that exists all around us constantly. One person's > > perspective culturally does not become another's truth. Maybe it's > > because I'm deaf and naive, but I think it's a good thing anyways. > It > > allows me to always see the good and be at peace no matter what > occurs > > around me. I count my blessings. > > > > > > Even if people do act rude, callious or arrogant whether at an > > ashram or elsewhere, what's the point anyways? That's not something > we > > have control over. If one constantly focuses on these negative > > qualities in people, there's no peace for the mind. Even if one > finds > > fault in another, we still have faults within ourselves that aren't > > any better either. Didn't Amma say that before we can judge another, > > we have to first judge ourselves? And Jesus said that we need to > walk > > a mile in another's shoes before making judgments. > > > > > > In order to always have peace and cease to see such behaviors, we > > have to first clear those things within us. In the act of changing > > ourselves within, we end up changing others around us. Have any of > you > > read " The Secret of Shambhala " by James Redfield? In this book, this > > guy was in Tibet and was encountering negative behaviors in people > > around him. He tried to change something within himself and as a > > result people around him started behaving in more loving and > peaceful > > ways. Soooo....if it were true that someone did encounter rude, > > callous, arrogant people, that is only because it was a mirror that > > reflected the disharmony within that person. We all create the > > environment that occurs around us based on what is going on within > us. > > One person's truth of this matter is not going to become another's > > truth. Even a poll is not going to be based on reality regardless > > because one person's experiences or truth do not become another's > own. > > > > > > > > > Rather, if one experiences these disharmonic behaviors anywhere, > it > > should be taken as an opportunity to focus on what we need to work > on > > changing or improving within ourselves. Everything is a gift. Life > is > > a guru. We are always given opportunities to grow and to become our > > fullest potential. It's a waste of time to bicker about what's wrong > > with other people. That does no one good on both sides. Rather the > > question should be, can we be at peace regardless of how people > behave > > around us? Isn't that the goal of spirituality? > > > > > > Ever at Amma's Lotus Feet, > > > Stacy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________ > ______________ > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? > > > Find them fast with Search. > > http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php? > category=shopping > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.