Guest guest Posted July 26, 1999 Report Share Posted July 26, 1999 >>Earlier posting from jay................... >> " Advaita may be the crowning glory in spirituality - but it comes as the >>natural outcome; at the end of the spiritual journey (not at the start). The >>ideas of Advaita may excite us - may inspire us but the subject is truly >>beyond words and thoughts. There is very little we can discuss about advaita >>to the science community. Advaita to them appears like escapism. We define a >>system which is self consistent but seems to have little to do with this >>world. Hence we have to develop on the ideas that we have in common. " >Swami Yogeshananda <yogeshananda >Dear Jay, >On the other hand, Swami Vivekananda does say somewhere that the West can >understand and take only Advaita, because of its (the West's) preoccupation >with science; that it is only through Advaita that science will be able to >accept spirituality. And further, he says that he " is a materialist, in a >sense, because like the scientist he believes there is only one thing. The >scientist calls it Matter, he calls it Spirit. > Regards, Yogeshananda Developing this thread further:- My issue is really with the old school of advaita, which seems not too bothered with science. Swami Vivekananda can say 'Advaita is in step with science' because with him comes evolution in the ideas within Advaita. The Advaita that considered the concept of " Maya meaning illusion " has been superseded by him defining 'Maya as a statement of fact relating to the world. Definition of Maya is " the world as it is full stop. " This is not a minor or a trivial distinction - this definition of Maya would suit a scientist. He is encouraged to dig deeper into the nature of this reality that we experience as the world. (Not by-pass it, as would be implied with the older concept of illusion). There was nothing wrong with the earlier ideas of Maya as 'illusion' but we must be on guard. Mankind evolves - the thinking or grasping powers we possess evolve too. What appeared as the best way to convey the very important concept 'Maya' has to evolve too. Advaita is constant but the instruments we use to grasp it have to suit the requirement of the times. The requirements at the moment is 'be in step with science'. - Swami Vivekananda has given us better definition of Maya. Maya --- not the world as 'illusion' ----- but 'the world as it is' . A dramatic shift has taken place - a shift in line with the teachings of science. When we study physical sciences we are trying to get to grips with this world as it is. How wonderful! Reverence to the sincere scientist. jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 27, 1999 Report Share Posted July 27, 1999 Dear Jay, You say, " Maya, not the world as 'illusion', but the world 'as it is'. A dramatic shift has taken place, a shift in line with the teachings of science. When we study physical sciences we are trying to get to grips with this world as it is. " As I understand it, from the point of view of Knowers of Brahman, the world is still illusion. In other words, there is the One -- and there is multiplicity, whether that multiplicity is two or more. Where there is one, there is not and cannot be two. And so your scientific position is only a vantage point to approach Oneness. The line of demarcation is still a quantum leap. Edith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 27, 1999 Report Share Posted July 27, 1999 >EDTipple > >Dear Jay, > >You say, " Maya, not the world as 'illusion', but the world 'as it is'. >A dramatic shift has taken place, a shift in line with the teachings >of science. When we study physical sciences we are trying to get to >grips with this world as it is. " > >As I understand it, from the point of view of Knowers of Brahman, the >world is still illusion. In other words, there is the One -- and there >is multiplicity, whether that multiplicity is two or more. Where there >is one, there is not and cannot be two. And so your scientific >position is only a vantage point to approach Oneness. The line of >demarcation is still a quantum leap. > >Edith Continuing the thread:- For the enlightened there is but " one " but for the rest of us there is only multiplicity. For us " Advaita " is just an abstraction. Different sages in different ages have given us some inkling of this " One " by alluding to different examples. The sage of this age has given us an example more suited to our times:- " Maya not as an illusion " but " Maya as the world as it is " . A scientist would be put off by the idea of 'world as illusion'. -- The world is the only thing he has to work on! But a scientist would be keen to have a closer look at the world and try and see through it -- hence this approach is more in line with science. There has been a shift in approach. The first approach suited an earlier age and has served its purpose. This new approach is the approach suited to this age --the age of science. It says look more closely at the universe - work out what is it that we are really looking at. " Rub your eyes do not seek God - see God " (Swami Vivekananda) It is this very God who stands in front of us and appears as the universe. The important thing is to dig deeply and look more closely. The progress of science has been truly exponential. It is not too far off saying, " We see the unity that appears in all this diverse forms -as this varied universe " . The next batch of 'Knowers of Brahman' may come from the science world! Exciting stuff this science! jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 27, 1999 Report Share Posted July 27, 1999 Dear Friends, The first apparition (Ignorance) is to accept that Brahman changed into subatomic particles! This is Maya: Vivartavada. Subsequently it is all Parinamvada: Subatomic particles combining into atoms, atoms into molecules, molecules to form complexes and so on. The second situation -Parinamvada is what we call science, according to which everything can be nicely explained! The real Advaita is to *know* that Brahman as Immaterial Existence has or had never changed, and will never change!!! For more details do visit: http://members.xoom.com/drcsshah/neovedanta/a21.html http://members.xoom.com/drcsshah/neovedanta/a24.html dr c s shah --------------------- Vivekananda Centre wrote: > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > >EDTipple > >Dear Jay, > >You say, " Maya, not the world as 'illusion', but the world 'as it is'. > >A dramatic shift has taken place, a shift in line with the teachings > >of science. When we study physical sciences we are trying to get to > >grips with this world as it is. " > > > >As I understand it, from the point of view of Knowers of Brahman, the world is still illusion. In other words, there is the One -- and there is multiplicity, whether that multiplicity is two or more. Where there is one, there is not and cannot be two. And so your scientific position is only a vantage point to approach Oneness. The line of demarcation is still a quantum leap. > >Edith > Continuing the thread:- > For the enlightened there is but " one " but for the rest of us there is only multiplicity. > For us " Advaita " is just an abstraction. Different sages in different ages have given us some inkling of this " One " by alluding to different examples. > The sage of this age has given us an example more suited to our times:- > " Maya not as an illusion " but " Maya as the world as it is " . > A scientist would be put off by the idea of 'world as illusion'. -- The world is the only thing he has to work on! But a scientist would be keen to have a closer look at the world and try and see through it -- hence this approach is more in line with science. > > There has been a shift in approach. The first approach suited an earlier age and has served its purpose. This new approach is the approach suited to this age --the age of science. It says look more closely at the universe - work out what is it that we are really looking at. > " Rub your eyes do not seek God - see God " (Swami Vivekananda) > It is this very God who stands in front of us and appears as the universe. The important thing is to dig deeply and look more closely. The progress of science has been truly exponential. It is not too far off saying, " We see the unity that appears in all this diverse forms -as this varied universe " . > The next batch of 'Knowers of Brahman' may come from the science world! > Exciting stuff this science! > > jay > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > Create a list for FRIENDS & FAMILY... > ...and YOU can WIN $100 to Amazon.com. For details, go to > /info/onereachsplash3.html > > ------ > Sri Ramakrishnaye Namah > Vivekananda Centre London > http://www.btinternet.com/~vivekananda/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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