Guest guest Posted November 5, 1999 Report Share Posted November 5, 1999 Dear everybody I loath getting into such discussions but I just want to place a few facts before sri Om Tat Sat while clarifying that there is no defending the caste system that prevailed in India. I would also like to confine my comments to India and not venture into the Church's past record outside India. 1. We consider everybody in India to be Hindus. We only have to read the story of Kannappa Nayanar, who belonged to one of the " outcastes " mentioned and is now worshipped as one among the 63 Nayanars or Saivite saints. 2. What is the logic for the church in India to ask for reservations (India's equivalent of affirmative action for blacks in the US) for " low caste christians " ? Does the term " low caste christian " have any meaning? 3. I have personally come across the use of economic incentives like job in a missionary run school , free/subsidised education for children etc being offered to poor families if they convert and only if they convert. Is this the way of Christ? Please, I am not trying to run a political campaign here, nor am I trying to paint all christians with the same brush. But I have had a few unpleasant personal experiences with missionaries in India as a boy. How, for instance,would you feel if, in the name of " exposing the superstition that is Hindusim " , you come across a pamphlet from Christian missionaries, where they plan to give a lecture on the day of Ganesh Chaturthi, before which they would do pooja to a coconut and break Ganesha idols before it? Swami > >Friends, > >If you have not read the following article, please do read it: > >http://www.rediff.com/news/1999/nov/04pope1.htm > >Regards, >Mohan Dadlani > __________ > >Comment: >Namaste Mohan, > >I went and checked out that article, as you so kindly suggested >and found the following quote: > > > > " The Pope is coming to India to promote the cause of Catholicism, >which means the conversion of Hindus. " > >This is the 'height of stupidity' > >The vast majority of people on the Indian Subcontinent, who have been >'converted' to Catholicism over the last 500 years, >have been NON-HINDUS; in other words, people OUTSIDE the Hindu caste >system. >No self respecting 'Brahmin' would be caught dead, giving instruction to >those unfortunate members of the 'scheduled castes', for the simple reason, >that he would 'lose caste' himself. > >So...what shall we do ? Let these poor souls 'rot in ignorance' of the >sublime fact that GOD LOVES THEM TOO ? > >OM SHANTHI OM > >+OM > > >____ >123India - India's Premier Search Engine >Get your Free Email Account at http://www.123india.com > > > >------ >Sri Ramakrishnaye Namah >Vivekananda Centre London >http://www.btinternet.com/~vivekananda/ ><< text3.html >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 1999 Report Share Posted November 5, 1999 RE: Message: 8 4 Nov 99 19:24:18 EST mohan dadlani <viveknivas Re: Pope's visit to India Friends, If you have not read the following article, please do read it: http://www.rediff.com/news/1999/nov/04pope1.htm Regards, Mohan Dadlani __________ Comment: Namaste Mohan, I went and checked out that article, as you so kindly suggested and found the following quote: " The Pope is coming to India to promote the cause of Catholicism, which means the conversion of Hindus. " This is the 'height of stupidity' The vast majority of people on the Indian Subcontinent, who have been 'converted' to Catholicism over the last 500 years, have been NON-HINDUS; in other words, people OUTSIDE the Hindu caste system. No self respecting 'Brahmin' would be caught dead, giving instruction to those unfortunate members of the 'scheduled castes', for the simple reason, that he would 'lose caste' himself. So...what shall we do ? Let these poor souls 'rot in ignorance' of the sublime fact that GOD LOVES THEM TOO ? OM SHANTHI OM +OM ____ 123India - India's Premier Search Engine Get your Free Email Account at http://www.123india.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 7, 1999 Report Share Posted November 7, 1999 Let me too share some of the experiences Ppl were screening a movie on the life of Jesus Christ back here. I just went to see it. Evrything was fine unless in the end came an ad saying Jesus Christ has so many followers. Later i saw even the posters of such a thing being displayed in the city too. It seems just too cheap. People going in van with ad's on them see the miracle getting healed. I have even heard frm my friends that tribals r being bribed n tortured if they refuse frm being converted to christians. I remember i once studied in christian school n there we had no holiday for any of the festivals of this land rather we were having christmas holidays. Once i went with a friend to Church on Christamas to experience the glory of this day n see the divine gathering. My friend is very opposed to hinduism. He has all hate towards hinduism that he can express. Then there we came across a person who started asking us if we were protestants or catholics something like this for i don't know for sure in which groups r christians divided. Something was being offered to devotees after prayers. He said u r not allowed to come here n have this. My friend was shocked to have such a experience for his family favours christanity. I was rather thanking Lord for that such an act has occured. In every religion we have persons who hate other religions for some reason or the other. Yes i too have heard abt things like free education, job incentives for the ppl who become christians. Long time back i attended a lecture by a lady she is realted to Ramakrishan Mission. Talk was abt education in India in an era prior to East India Company came to India. There she said that East India Company themselves did a survey on the education system prevalent in India at that time n the findings were written down in a book. Later someone started to dig up the things n came out with that book. The lady went on to say that almost 60% or more of the teachers in " GuruKulaas " (Schools) were frm so called lower caste. The farmers used to send money for the proper functioning of Schools. Britishers messed up with farmers taxes n all n the result was deterioration in schools. Britishers saw that Brahmins was the most respected class n they started exploiting it n created a wide gap btw the classes. I am not saying that the lower castes were not looked down by high castes. Just few days back i saw the hate towards low caste by a brahmin girl. Though she herself doesn't know wat does being a brahmin means. Caste sytem really has gone in to very depths but change of religion is not a solution. On Fri, 5 Nov 1999, Swaminathan Venkataraman wrote: > " Swaminathan Venkataraman " <nachiketas > > Dear everybody > > I loath getting into such discussions but I just want to place a few facts > before sri Om Tat Sat while clarifying that there is no defending the caste > system that prevailed in India. I would also like to confine my comments to > India and not venture into the Church's past record outside India. > > 1. We consider everybody in India to be Hindus. We only have to read the > story of Kannappa Nayanar, who belonged to one of the " outcastes " mentioned > and is now worshipped as one among the 63 Nayanars or Saivite saints. > > 2. What is the logic for the church in India to ask for reservations > (India's equivalent of affirmative action for blacks in the US) for " low > caste christians " ? Does the term " low caste christian " have any meaning? > > 3. I have personally come across the use of economic incentives like job in > a missionary run school , free/subsidised education for children etc being > offered to poor families if they convert and only if they convert. Is this > the way of Christ? > > Please, I am not trying to run a political campaign here, nor am I trying to > paint all christians with the same brush. But I have had a few unpleasant > personal experiences with missionaries in India as a boy. How, for > instance,would you feel if, in the name of " exposing the superstition that > is Hindusim " , you come across a pamphlet from Christian missionaries, where > they plan to give a lecture on the day of Ganesh Chaturthi, before which > they would do pooja to a coconut and break Ganesha idols before it? > > Swami > > > > > >Friends, > > > >If you have not read the following article, please do read it: > > > >http://www.rediff.com/news/1999/nov/04pope1.htm > > > >Regards, > >Mohan Dadlani > > __________ > > > >Comment: > >Namaste Mohan, > > > >I went and checked out that article, as you so kindly suggested > >and found the following quote: > > > > > > > > " The Pope is coming to India to promote the cause of Catholicism, > >which means the conversion of Hindus. " > > > >This is the 'height of stupidity' > > > >The vast majority of people on the Indian Subcontinent, who have been > >'converted' to Catholicism over the last 500 years, > >have been NON-HINDUS; in other words, people OUTSIDE the Hindu caste > >system. > >No self respecting 'Brahmin' would be caught dead, giving instruction to > >those unfortunate members of the 'scheduled castes', for the simple reason, > >that he would 'lose caste' himself. > > > >So...what shall we do ? Let these poor souls 'rot in ignorance' of the > >sublime fact that GOD LOVES THEM TOO ? > > > >OM SHANTHI OM > > > >+OM > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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