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Digest Number 344

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> I wish to respond to Jay's comments on Spirituality

 

It seems many a viewpoint is between the divide between Science and Spirtuality

and whether

science would eclipse spirtuality.

 

If we think of Spirituality as a seeking of the truth then science is also

spiritual.

As Swami Vivekananda would suggest, science uses outside objects,

experimentation and the mind

as instruments to deduce generalities from specifics. Religion uses one's own

mind as the

instrument to get at the truth. Science looks outward and religion inward. Now

this distinction

of inward and outward is just a matter of convenience.

 

Somedays ago there was a post by Ron arguing out his case against the beliefs of

religion in

general. To people with that temperament, Swamiji had lucidly calrified the

position of

religion and spirituality. It runs something like this :

 

Ron's stance is a prefectly valid one doubting the existence of all these

concepts of religion.

However as a scientist he is interested in the truth

 

(i) which is verifiable and

(ii) repeatable when the same conrolled conditions of an experiment are in place

 

If this is so, why don't people like Ron take up Spirituality as a scientific

quest?

They don't have to believe in anything.

 

But they have the uniform evidence from saints and god men over the years across

the world that

when they were able to still the mind they experienced higher truths.

 

They can test it out themselves if they would want the truth badly enough. But

with out testing

these truths for themselves how can people like Ron conclude that they are not

truths?

 

Sreedhar T Bharath

 

 

 

 

 

> Message: 5

> Mon, 7 Feb 2000 12:25:33 -0000

> " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda

> Science and spirituality

>

> The present day science is very much a pseudo-materialistic belief system.

> A vast majority of scientists today are quite satisfied with the ideas

> offered via

> say

> - the theory of creation as explained by the 'big bang model'

> - the theory of evolution as suggested by Darwin.

> - the theory of 'consciousness' as a by-product of a computer made of meat

> (brain).

> - the ideas of morality as expressed via 'social sciences' (group

> dynamics).

>

> All these ideas are strongly based on a 'materialistic' approach.

> They all fall back on trying to explain 'reality' by reductionism

> (mathematical approach).

> Explain everything via - matter (and the energies associated with this

> matter).

>

> 'Spirituality' as a subject has a difficult task ahead if it is to survive

> the next millennium.

>

> Any thoughts on this subject?

>

> jay

> Vivekananda Centre London

>

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Re: message 5 on Digest #344

 

Dear Jay,

Only suggestion I have is, recall that Swamiji in one place says that he

agrees with the scientists, in having an all-inclusive monism; but, what

they call " matter " , he calls " spirit " . I think we can point out that the

name itself makes a world of difference. All the connotations,

implications, mental climate etc. are vastly different. One is

reductionism, the other expansionism.

Yours, Yogeshananda

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-

Swami Yogeshananda <

09 February 2000 02:50

Re: Digest Number 344

 

 

> Swami Yogeshananda <yogeshananda

>

> Re: message 5 on Digest #344

>

> Dear Jay,

> Only suggestion I have is, recall that Swamiji in one place says that he

> agrees with the scientists, in having an all-inclusive monism; but, what

> they call " matter " , he calls " spirit " . I think we can point out that the

> name itself makes a world of difference. All the connotations,

> implications, mental climate etc. are vastly different. One is

> reductionism, the other expansionism.

> Yours, Yogeshananda

>

 

----response---------------------

 

 

Revered Maharaj

 

It is very interesting to see how far ahead of his time were some of Swami

Vivekananda's teachings. His talks were given in the pre-modern physics

days (pre Einstein's special relativity) and yet elsewhere he was able to

focus on the idea that what the scientists call 'matter' is nothing but a

dynamic principle called 'prana' (or energy) in its grossest expression.

 

There are many other aspects of his teachings which have great relevance for

the conceptual progress in science today. It is a matter of few years before

some of his ideas catch the attention of the scientists at large. (This is

no wishful thinking!).

 

jay

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Gokulmuthu N's story " The Guru's Miracle " reminded me of a quote from

Barbara Kingsolver's novel about the Congo: Illusions mistaken for truth

are the pavement under our feet.

edtipple

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Dear Jay,

 

I thought quantum physics had taken science beyond the Big Bang Theory

and to evolution/dissolution. And I thought it was hovering around Pure

Consciousness as distinct from brain consciousness. Am I incorrect?

 

What to do about morality!? Until and unless one has the conception of

true brotherhood/sisterhood, treatment of others is necessarily

contained in little boxes of prejudice and dogma. Which will always

remain. The best we can hope for is a larger percentage of those

interested in ego-eracing spirituality. Or so it seems to me... As

science dissolves outer boundaries, hopefully the same consciousness of

the microcosm will follow.

Edtipple

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Edith it's my Pujya Gurudev Paramhansa Swami Nikhileshwaranandaji or

Dr. Narayana Dutt Shrimali

 

 

 

On Wed, 9 Feb 2000, EDTipple wrote:

 

> EDTipple <edtipple

>

> Guru Vaani

> Anurag, I would like to know who " the enlightened ones " you are

> translated are.

> Edtipple

>

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