Guest guest Posted October 25, 2000 Report Share Posted October 25, 2000 > Regarding celibacy, Sri Ramakrishna says that if we human beings can even be 1/20th of what he showed as the ideal, we will realise god in this very life. Do we have this longing for god as intense as a man who gasps for air under water? Regarding Tantra, Thakurji himself says that it is a left hand path. He said it was difficult and dangerous and that by the grace of the mother he came through unscathed - He compares it to walking on a tight rope or razor's edge on the successful culmination with the Shodasi Pooja in which he worships Sri Sarada devi as the divine mother. Thakurji also says that Tantra awakens the Kundalini (Life energy) by forceful and violent means. Thus even a little carelessness on the part of the sadhak will make this energy flow down to the sex center (muladhara) instead of making it ascend to sahasra. Flowing down (path of least resistance) is easier than making it go up and thus this practice has the danger of arousing violent lust in the individual according to Him regards Sreedhar > Whatever i learned from the teachings of My Pujya Gurudev. He himself has > been an expert in the field of Tantra. Pujya gurudev said that Bhayananda > and his followers corrupted Tantra by introducing sex, liquor, smoking, > Meat and Fish for their own selfish ends. And its after that Tantra got > this negative image. Pujya Gurudev has clearly said that Tantra is all > pure n pious. > > http://www.siddhasharam.org > > If one is interested in knowing about this then one can go the above site. > > I am also in doubt about the left hand path of Tantra. Is anything > true abt that path or not. > > Michelle any pleasure other than the feeling that " there is no two " will > lead to ones downfall sooner or later. > > If we take in to account the statement by Shri Ramakrishna Paramhansa that > " Every path we follow leads to Kundalini Awakening " . > > And the chakraas of kundalini can awaken only in the presence of > all pious feelings. And the one whos in all divine love is very far from > the sexual feelings. Love is said to be present in heart and heart is the > physical part in the body which corresponds to Anahat Chakra. > > > > > Message: 5 > > Thu, 19 Oct 2000 05:16:59 +0100 > > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > > Celibacy contd...... > > > > - > > michele <michele > > Vivekananda Centre <vivekananda > > 19 October 2000 00:38 > > Re: [selfknow-l] Fw: Celibacy... > > > > > > > How does that fit in with the practices of Tantra Yoga, in which the > > sexual > > > energy can be used for reaching altered states of awareness, and > > ultimately > > > attaining a moment of ONENESS (not just on the physical level, but on the > > > Divine level)? > > > > > > My understanding of Tantra is that celibacy is a matter of choice and not > > > absolutely necessary to spiritual growth. What is more important is the > > > intent behind being sexually active or abstaining. That is using our > > sexual > > > energies wisely, with the right people, and not just for physical pleasure > > > alone. > > > > > > OM Shanti > > > Michele > > > > ======Response======== > > > > Celibacy - is a difficult subject to promote in a world which is > > strongly driven by the 'sex impulse'. > > > > Let me first share with you some of the light hearted banter > > that followed my talk: - > > > > Q: 'What will happen to mankind if we all became celibate? > > R: If you do not procreate; don't worry there are many others out there > > who will happily take over your task. > > Q: Are YOU celibate? > > R: Yep. > > Q: What pleasure is left for us then? > > R: There is cash value - if you succeed then each follicle on your body > > will give as much pleasure as a sex organ. > > Q: What about following a system of 'Tantra' which involves sex > > R: That is 'Left hand method' - not recommended. > > Q: Can we not practice celibacy when we are older? > > R: With blanks in your pistol - it is no good saying I will not shoot! > > > > ======= > > Further comment:- > > > > There is a tendency to dilute ideas of celibacy. > > I told the meeting 'celibacy' is necessary for these reasons > > (a) It is a major distraction and needs to be put aside for serious > > practice of meditation. > > (b) It drains the energy needed for spiritual progress. We all have finite > > supply of this energy. > > © If one can master this most powerful natural instinct - that act of > > self-control itself generates tremendous self confidence and power. > > One then feels that there is no stopping now.. > > - Spirituality is attainable - It can be first hand experience. > > > > jay > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 9 > Wed, 25 Oct 2000 18:14:31 +0100 > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > Vivekananda on the Vedas (part 18) > > We are presenting the following work by Sister Gayatriprana. > Parts 1 to 17 were posted earlier. This is part 18. Your comments are welcome... Vivekananda Centre London > Earlier postings can be seen at http://www.vivekananda.btinternet.co.uk/veda.htm > > SWAMI VIVEKANANDA ON THE VEDAS AND UPANISHADS > By Sister Gayatriprana > part 18 > PART I, SECTION 1: DEFINITION AND EULOGY OF THE VEDAS AND VEDANTA > > Chapter 2: Some Preliminary Definitions > > a) The " Veda " Is the Sum Total of Eternal Truths > > Most of the great religions of the world owe allegiance to certain books which they believe are the words of God or some other supernatural beings, and which are the basis of their religion. Now, of all these books, according to the modern savants of the West, the oldest are the Vedas of the Hindus. A little understanding, therefore, is necessary about the Vedas. (1) > > The knowledge of God is what is meant by the Vedas (vid - to know). (2) > > Veda means the sum total of eternal truths. (3) > > Truth is of two kinds: (1) that which is cognizable by the five ordinary senses of man and by reasonings based thereon; (2) that which is cognizable by the subtle, supersensuous power of yoga. > > Knowledge acquired by the first means is called science; and knowledge acquired by the second is called the Vedas. (4) > > Our own realization is beyond the Vedas, because even they depend upon that. The highest Vedas is the philosophy of the Beyond. (5) > > With regard to the whole Vedic collection of truths discovered by the Aryan race, this also has to be understood that those portions alone which do not refer to purely secular matters and which do not merely record tradition or history, or merely provide incentives to duty form the Vedas in the real sense. > > Although the supersensuous vision of truths is to be met with in some measure in our Puranas and Itihasas and in the religious scriptures of other races, still the fourfold scripture known among the Aryan race as the Vedas being the first, the most complete, and the most undistorted collection of spiritual truths, deserves to occupy the highest place among all scriptures, command the respect of all nations of the earth, and furnish the rationale of their respective scriptures. (6) > > b) The Upanishads Are the " New Testament " of the Vast, Traditional Vedic Literature > > The Vedas are, in fact, the oldest sacred books in the world. Nobody knows anything about the time they were written, or by whom. They are contained in many volumes, and I doubt that any one person ever read them all. (7) > > The Sanskrit in which the Vedas were written is not the same Sanskrit in which books were written about a thousand years later than the Vedas - the books that you read in your translations of poets and other classical writers of India. The Sanskrit of the Vedas was very simple, archaic in its composition, and possibly it was a spoken language. (8) > > That branch of the Aryan race which spoke the Sanskrit language was the first to become civilized and the first to begin to write books and literature. So they went on for thousands of years. How many thousands of years they wrote no one knows. There are various guesses - from 3,000 to 8,000 BC - but all of these dates are more or less uncertain. (9) > > This Sanskrit has undergone very much change as a matter of course, having been spoken and written through thousands of years. It necessarily follows that in other Aryan languages, as in Greek and Roman, the literature must be of much later date than Sanskrit. Not only so, but there is this peculiarity, that of all regular books that we have in the world, the oldest are in Sanskrit - and that is the mass of literature called the Vedas. There are very ancient pieces in the Babylonian or Egyptian literature, but they cannot be called literature or books, but just a few notes, a short letter, a few words, and so on. But as finished, cultured literature, the Vedas are the oldest. (10) > > The Vedas existed as a mass of literature, and not as a book - just as you find the Old Testament, the Bible. Now, the Bible is a mass of literature of different ages; different persons are the writers, and so on. It is a collection. [in the same way], the Vedas are a vast collection. I do not know whether, if all the texts were found - nobody has found all the texts; nobody, even in India, has seen all the books - if all the books were known, this room would contain them. It is a huge mass of literature, carried down from generation to generation from God, who gave the scriptures. (11) > > The Vedas are divided into four parts. One is called the Rig Veda, another Yajur Veda, another Sama Veda, and the fourth, Atharva Veda. Each one of these, again, was divided into many branches. For instance, the Sama Veda had one thousand branches, of which only about five or six remain; the rest are all lost. So with the others. The Rig Veda had 108, of which only one remains; and the rest are all lost. (12) > > This vast mass of literature - the Vedas - we find in three groups. The first group is the Samhitas, a collection of hymns. The second group is called the Brahmanas, or the [group dealing with different kinds of] sacrifice. The word brahmana [by usage] means [what is achieved by means of] the sacrifice. And the other group is called the Upanishads (sittings, lectures, philosophic books). Again, the first two parts together - the hymns and the rituals - are called the Karma Kanda, the work portion; and the second, or philosophic portion (the Upanishads), is called the Jnana Kanda, the knowledge portion. This is the same word as your English word knowledge and the Greek word gnos - just as you have the word in agnostic, and so on. (13) > > The Upanishads are the Bible of India. [in relation to the Vedas] they occupy the same place as the New Testament does [to the Old]. There are [more than] a hundred books comprising the Upanishads, some very small and some big, each a separate treatise.... They are [as it were] shorthand notes taken down of discussions in [learned assemblies], generally in the courts of kings. The word Upanishad may mean " sittings " [or " sitting near a teacher " ]. Those of you who may have studied some of the Upanishads can understand how they are condensed shorthand sketches. After long discussions had been held, they were taken down, possibly from memory.... The origin of ancient Sanskrit is 5,000 BC; the Upanishads [are at least] two thousand years before that. Nobody knows exactly how old they are. (14) > > It is the aim of the modern scholar to restore [the sequence of the Vedic compositions]. The old, orthodox idea is quite different, as your orthodox idea of the Bible is quite different from the modern scholar’s. (15) > > To be Continued....... > > [This message contained attachments] > > ______________________ > ______________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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