Guest guest Posted November 21, 2000 Report Share Posted November 21, 2000 ananta says: > Never think there is anything impossible for the soul. It is the > greatest heresy to think so. If there is sin, this is the only sin-to say that you are weak, or others are weak. Well, we know that the Soul is the Supreme Power, hence its easy to understand the idea that there is nothing impossible for the soul. But how do you conclude that it is a sin to say we are weak? It's clear as daylight that I am not the soul. I have innumerable weaknesses. Does ignoring them help? Shouldn't I accept them as they are and consciously try to correct them? It's just a doubt that I have - I don't mean to question Ananta. > ---------- > Ramakrishna [sMTP:Ramakrishna ] > Reply Ramakrishna > Monday, November 20, 2000 8:18 AM > Ramakrishna > [ramakrishna] Digest Number 618 > > > Sri Ramakrishnaye Namah > Vivekananda Centre London > http://www.vivekananda.co.uk > ------ > > There are 8 messages in this issue. > > Topics in this digest: > > 1. VML-11/18/00 > ananta <sarada > 2. Re: Mantra > kedars > 3. Re: Digest Number 617 > Swami Yogeshananda <yogeshananda > 4. A great Quote! > " jairam seshadri " <jairamseshadri > 5. Re: Digest Number 617 > " jairam seshadri " <jairamseshadri > 6. Avadhuta Gita > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > 7. VML-11/19/00 > ananta <sarada > 8. Vivekananda on the Vedas (part 22) > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 1 > Sat, 18 Nov 2000 07:54:44 -0500 > ananta <sarada > VML-11/18/00 > > Never think there is anything impossible for the soul. It is the > greatest heresy to think so. If there is sin, this is the only sin-to > say that you are weak, or others are weak. > -- > ________________________ > ______ > Today we end Swamiji's lecture called: > > PRACTICAL VEDANTA > > PART I > > (Delivered in London, November 10,1896) ( CW. II, 291-308) > > This is a part of a daily study of the lectures and writings of Swami > Vivekananda. All lectures are sent out in sequenced form, as he spoke > them. > > Please tell a friend about this Vivekananda Mailing (VML) list and study > group. > To or send a message to sarada. > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 2 > 18 Nov 2000 12:30:40 +0000 > kedars > Re: Mantra > > Hari Om!, > The Lord is known by infinite names and forms. > > Each and every name of the Lord has infinite potential and is enough to > make u perfect. > > What is needed is faith and devotion to a single mantra and the related > form of God. > > Chaitanya Mahaprabhu says :- > " Oh! Lord, I am so unfortunate that I fail to comprehend the true power of > ur name " > > The mantra must be chanted constantly, unconditionally, unmotivatedly, > offenselessly , > not only with devotion but with desperation. > > If practiced in this manner, soon u shall be free from all suffering. > > Jai Sri Krishna. > > > > I'm interested in knowing more about the efficacy of the holy Gayatri > > > Mantra. > > > It would be great if the list members come forward and recite their > > > experiences > > > after Gayatri Sadhana. > > > > > > pranams, > > > Hari > > > Chequemail.com - a free web based e-mail service that also pays!!! > http://www.chequemail.com > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 3 > Sat, 18 Nov 2000 09:39:19 -0400 > Swami Yogeshananda <yogeshananda > Re: Digest Number 617 > > _____________ > >Dear Jairam, > >Message: 4 > > Thu, 16 Nov 2000 23:09:10 EST > > " jairam seshadri " <jairamseshadri > >Re: Why one should be a Vegitarian? > > > >Can someone, anyone interpret these lines of Shakespeare for me and make > >them clear. They are so appealing and yet i do not know why they are. Can > >anyone help... > > > >what does " cummer " mean? Are you sure it isn't a misprint for " summer " ? > > >and " ow'st " " ownest " , abbreviated > >Nor lose possession of that fair...? what fair? Fair look, fair > complexion > >etc. > > > >i did not take Eng. Lit ..! > > > >++++++++++++++++++ > > > >But thy eternal cummer shall not fade, Nor lose possession of that fair > thou > >ow'st, Nor shall death brag thou wander'st in his shade, When in eternal > >lines to time thou grow'st; So long as men can breathe, or eyes can see, > So > >long lives this, and this gives life to thee. > > > > William Shakespeare, Sonnets > > > >_Best regards, > >Yogeshananda___________ > _______ > >____ > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 4 > Fri, 17 Nov 2000 20:31:35 EST > " jairam seshadri " <jairamseshadri > A great Quote! > > > > > Duties done and not done, as well as the pairs of opposites - when do they > > cease and for whom? Knowing thus, be desireless and intent on renunciation > > through complete indifference to the world. > > Ashtavakra Samhita I.X.I > _______________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 5 > Sat, 18 Nov 2000 18:34:15 EST > " jairam seshadri " <jairamseshadri > Re: Digest Number 617 > > > AH! It is made so much clearer just from the explanation of a few > words...Shakespeare could have been mouthing our words for Sri > Ramakrishna! > Now i know who to run to when i need a Shakespeare explained.. > thank you... > pranaams > > jairam > > ps. i was rereading your book " Six Lighted Windows " and the part where > Swami > Vivekananda ate the eggs immediately after Sri Ramakrishna's passing away, > > eggs that Sri Ramakrishna had requested for himself before His passing > on...and the incredulity of someone who stated that the Swami could have > felt hungry at a time like that > > somehow i do not feel amiss reading that...for i truly feel that Sri > Ramakrishna's spirit possessed the body of our Swami immediately and the > Master fulfilled His desires through the Swami after passing away. > i know i have told you this so many times...but that book occupies a pride > > of place in all of Ramakrishna literature. > > A book that gave so much joy to me personally...and continues to do so. > > Thank you for that. > > You, Swami, have so many incidents that we are all i am sure keen to > hear...surely there are other incidents that you still have not released > from your heart. Please do share them with us... > > But thy eternal Summer shall not fade, > Nor lose possession of that fair thou ow'st, > Nor shall death brag thou wander'st in his shade, > When in eternal lines to time thou grow'st; > So long as men can breathe, or eyes can see, > Solong lives this, and this gives life to thee. > William Shakespeare, Sonnets > > _______________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 6 > Sun, 19 Nov 2000 11:20:51 -0000 > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > Avadhuta Gita > > Song of the Ever free. > Avadhuta Gita > > Chapter six verse 27 > > Where the intellect cannot reach, > how can there be any form of composition? > The great Avadhuta, after purifying himself through > meditation and becoming absorbed in Infinite Bliss, > has sung spontaneously about Brahman. > > > Commentary:- > Intellect is sometimes defined as the > determining faculty of the mind. > If Brahman is beyond the limitations imposed > by the mind, how can the intellect grasp it? > > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 7 > Sun, 19 Nov 2000 10:30:42 -0500 > ananta <sarada > VML-11/19/00 > > THE OPEN SECRET > > (Delivered at Los Angeles, Calif., January 5th, 1900 > > Whichever way we turn in trying to understand things in their > reality, if we analyze far enough, we find that at last we come to a > peculiar state of things, seemingly a contradiction; something which > our reason cannot grasp and yet is a fact. > -- > ________________________ > ______ > Today we start Swamiji's lecture called: > > THE OPEN SECRET > > (Delivered at Los Angeles, Calif., January 5th, 1900) > > (CW II-pgs. 398-405) > > This is a part of a daily study of the lectures and writings of Swami > Vivekananda. All lectures are sent out in sequenced form, as he spoke > them. > > Please tell a friend about this Vivekananda Mailing (VML) list and study > group. > To or send a message to sarada. > > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > Message: 8 > Sun, 19 Nov 2000 23:48:07 -0000 > " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda > Vivekananda on the Vedas (part 22) > > We are presenting the following work by Sister Gayatriprana. > Parts 1 to 21 were posted earlier. This is part 22. Your comments are > welcome... Vivekananda Centre London > Earlier postings can be seen at > http://www.vivekananda.btinternet.co.uk/veda.htm > > SWAMI VIVEKANANDA ON THE VEDAS AND UPANISHADS > By Sister Gayatriprana > part 22 > > 2. The Authority of the Vedas Is the Eternal, Impersonal Truth > > All the other religions of the world claim their authority as being > delivered by a personal God or a number of personal beings, angels, or > special messengers of God, unto certain persons; while the claim of the > Hindus is that the Vedas do not owe their authority to anybody; they are > themselves the authority, being eternal - the knowledge of God. They were > never written, never created, they have existed throughout time; just as > creation is infinite and eternal, without beginning or end, so is the > knowledge of God without beginning and without end. (20) > > The idea is that the Vedas were never written; the idea is they never came > into existence. I was once told by a Christian missionary that their > scriptures have a historical character and therefore are true, to which I > replied, " Mine have no historical character and therefore they are true; > yours being historical, they were evidently made by some man the other > day. Yours are man-made and mine are not; their non-historicity is in > their favor. " Such is the relation of the Vedas with all the other > scriptures at the present day. (21) > > If you tell [the orthodox Hindus who defend the Vedas] that the Vedas must > have been pronounced by man first, [they will simply laugh]. You never > heard of any [man uttering them for the first time]. Take Buddha's words. > [There is a tradition that he lived and spoke these words] many times > before. If the Christian stands up and says, " My religion is a historical > religion and therefore yours is wrong and ours is true " , the mimamsaka > [orthodox Hindu] replies, " Yours being historical, you confess that a man > invented it nineteen hundred years ago. That which is true must be > infinite and eternal. That is the one test of truth. It never decays, it > is always the same. You confess your religion was created by such-and-such > a man. The Vedas were not. By no prophets or anything.... Only infinite > words; infinite by their very nature, from which the whole universe comes > and goes. " In the abstract, it is perfectly correct. (22) > > Our religion preaches an impersonal personal God. It preaches any amount > of impersonal laws plus any amount of personality, but the very > fountainhead of our religion is the Shrutis, the Vedas, which are > perfectly impersonal; the persons all come in the Smritis and Puranas - > the great avataras, the incarnations of God, prophets, and so forth. And > this ought also to be observed that, except our religion, every other > religion in the world depends upon the life or lives of some personal > founder or founders. Christianity is built upon the life of Jesus Christ, > Islam upon Muhammad, Buddhism upon Buddha, Jainism upon the Jinas, and so > on. It naturally follows that there must be in all these religions a good > deal of fight about what they call the historical evidences of these great > personalities. If at any time the historical evidences about the existence > of these personages in ancient times becomes weak, the whole building of > the religion tumbles down and is broken to pieces. We Hindus escaped this > fate because our religion is not based upon persons, but upon principles. > (23) > > > 3. The Primary Allegiance of the Vedantist Is Always to Principles, Not > Persons > > Religions divide themselves equally into three parts. There is the first > part, consisting of philosophy, the essence, the principles of every > religion. These principles find expression in mythology - the lives of > saints or heroes, demigods, or gods, or divine beings; and the whole idea > of this mythology is that of power. And in the lower class of mythologies > - the primitive - the expression of this power is in the muscles; their > heroes are strong, gigantic. One hero conquers the whole world. As man > advances, he must find expression for his energy higher than in the > muscles; so his heroes also find expression in something higher. The > higher mythologies have heroes who are gigantic moral men. Their strength > is manifested in becoming moral and pure. They can stand alone, they can > beat back the surging tide of selfishness and immorality. The third > portion of all religions is symbolism, which you call ceremonials and > forms. Even the expression through mythology, the lives of heroes, is not > sufficient for all. There are minds still lower. Like children they must > have their kindergarten of religion, and these symbologies are evolved - > concrete examples which they can handle and grasp and understand, which > they can see and feel as material somethings. > > So, in every religion you find there are the three stages: philosophy, > mythology, and ceremonial. There is one advantage that can be pleaded for > the Vedanta: that, in India, fortunately, these three stages have been > sharply defined. In other religions the principles are so interwoven with > the mythology that it is very hard to distinguish one from the other. The > mythology stands supreme, swallowing up the principles; and in the course > of centuries the principles are lost sight of. The explanation, the > illustration of the principle, swallows up the principle and the people > see only the explanation, the prophet, the preacher, while the principles > have gone out of existence almost - so much so that today, if a man dares > to preach the principles of Christianity apart from Christ, they will try > to attack him and think he is wrong and dealing blows at Christianity. In > the same way, if a man wants to preach the principles of Islam, Muslims > will think the same; because concrete ideas, the lives of great men and > prophets, have entirely overshadowed the principles. > > In Vedanta the chief advantage is that it was not the work of one single > man; and therefore, naturally, unlike Buddhism, or Christianity, or Islam, > the prophet or teacher did not entirely swallow up or overshadow the > principles. The principles live; and the prophets, as it were, form a > secondary group, unknown to Vedanta. The Upanishads speak of no particular > prophet, but they speak of prophets and prophetesses. The old Hebrews had > something of that idea; yet we find Moses occupying most of the space of > the Hebrew literature. Of course, I do not mean that it is bad that these > prophets should take hold of a nation; but it certainly is very injurious > if the whole field of principles is lost sight of. (24) > > Persons are but the embodiment, the illustrations of the principles. If > the principles are there, the persons will come by the thousands and > millions. If the principle is safe, persons like Buddha will be born by > the hundreds and thousands. But if the principle is lost and forgotten and > the whole of national life tries to cling round a so-called historical > person, woe unto that religion, danger unto that religion! Ours is the > only religion that does not depend on a person or persons; it is based > upon principles. At the same time, there is room for millions of persons. > There is ample ground for introducing persons; but each one of them must > be an illustration of the principles. We must not forget that. These > principles of our religion are all safe, and it should be the lifework of > every one of us to keep them safe, to keep them free from the accumulating > dirt and dust of ages. It is strange, that in spite of the degradation > that seized upon the race again and again, these principles of Vedanta > were never tarnished. No one, however wicked, ever dared to throw dirt > upon them. Our scriptures are the best preserved in the world. Compared to > other books, there have been no interpolations, no text-torturing, no > destroying of the essence of thought in them. It is there just as it was > at first, directing the human mind towards the ideal, the goal. (25) > > to be continued...... > > > > > > [This message contained attachments] > > > > ______________________ > ______________________ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 21, 2000 Report Share Posted November 21, 2000 - Harihara_K <Harihara_K <Ramakrishna > 21 November 2000 07:41 RE: [ramakrishna] Digest Number 618 > ananta says: > > Never think there is anything impossible for the soul. It is the > > greatest heresy to think so. If there is sin, this is the only sin-to > say that you are weak, or others are weak. > > Well, we know that the Soul is the Supreme Power, hence its easy to > understand the idea that there is nothing impossible for the soul. But how > do you conclude that it is a sin to say we are weak? It's clear as daylight > that I am not the soul. I have innumerable weaknesses. Does ignoring them > help? Shouldn't I accept them as they are and consciously try to correct > them? It's just a doubt that I have - I don't mean to question Ananta. Dear Harihar 'Ananta' is just quoting from a talk given by Swami Vivekananda (the latest talk being 'Open Secret' ) Swami Vivekananda was very much like 'Hanuman' of our times. He personifies strength -- many of his talks deal with the theme of strength. Do not forget he had to stir up a nation steeped in inertia. jay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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