Guest guest Posted October 14, 2002 Report Share Posted October 14, 2002 Experiences in London Last few days have been very eventful. Last week I was invited to do a couple of assemblies at the famous Dulwich College based in South East London. The philosophy teacher was present and asked a great many questions on the Caste System. Even the Hindu youngsters present (16 to 18 year olds) seemed to think that Hinduism = 'Caste system'. No one has heard of 'Atman' or 'Brahman' or 'Samkhya or Vedanta'. What a poor and limited view of their religion. At some schools I visit, the Religious Education teachers immediately home in on the caste system. If I notice that there is an attempt to put down Hinduism I respond very sharply. I tell them, " If you were studying Greek philosophy, art, etc...would you focus on the social structure of ancient Greece that employed three bonded slaves for every one free person? All your lives you have been inundated with, " How this aspect of maths or how this physics and how this philosophy originated with the Greeks and yet you were never made aware of this simple fact? If you were studying Christianity would you focus on the fact that until 200 years these prim and proper Christian societies were sending 10 year old children to work down the mines? Why should a socio-economic system adopted by the Hindus in the middle ages somehow become the central tenet of Hinduism? " Even at some of the interfaith meetings people from the Buddhist or the Sikh tradition, somehow feel it necessary to say, " Our prophets moved away from Hinduism and its caste system! " At an Interfaith meeting on Sunday the Sikh participant was asked again and again, " How did Sikhism begin? " The participant just could not bring himself round to acknowledging the background of Guru Nanak as a Hindu. We just sat there and watched him as he did all sorts of verbal gymnastics to avoid saying this. I spent the whole of today at one of the best private schools for girls in Kensington. This was a wonderful experience! Every time concepts of 'Atman or Brahman' are introduced, a special sparkle appears in the eyes of western youngsters. Religion and spirituality come alive .... nobody has ever told them of such wonderful things enshrined in stodgy old religions. By the grace of our mentor I am able to introduce these concepts to them. One can clearly see the appreciation and love for religion resurfacing. A very satisfactory day. dilip Vivekananda Centre London Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2002 Report Share Posted October 16, 2002 you go dilip! I agree. But let us not be too defensive. Accept it as one of the blemishes and go on with the main message. Anup - " Vivekananda Centre " <vivekananda " list " <Ramakrishna >; " self-knowledge-list " <Self-knowledge >; " viv list " <vivekananda > Monday, October 14, 2002 4:00 PM [sri Ramakrishna] Experiences in London > Experiences in London > > Last few days have been very eventful. Last week I was invited to do a > couple of assemblies at the famous Dulwich College based in South > East London. The philosophy teacher was present and asked a great > many questions on the Caste System. Even the Hindu youngsters > present (16 to 18 year olds) seemed to think that Hinduism = 'Caste system'. > No one has heard of 'Atman' or 'Brahman' or 'Samkhya or Vedanta'. > What a poor and limited view of their religion. At some schools I visit, > the Religious Education teachers immediately home in on the caste > system. If I notice that there is an attempt to put down Hinduism I respond > very sharply. I tell them, " If you were studying Greek philosophy, art, > etc...would you focus on the social structure of ancient Greece that > employed three bonded slaves for every one free person? All your lives > you have been inundated with, " How this aspect of maths or how this > physics and how this philosophy originated with the Greeks and yet > you were never made aware of this simple fact? If you were studying > Christianity would you focus on the fact that until 200 years these prim > and proper Christian societies were sending 10 year old children to > work down the mines? Why should a socio-economic system adopted > by the Hindus in the middle ages somehow become the central tenet > of Hinduism? " > > Even at some of the interfaith meetings people from the Buddhist > or the Sikh tradition, somehow feel it necessary to say, " Our prophets > moved away from Hinduism and its caste system! " > > At an Interfaith meeting on Sunday the Sikh participant was asked > again and again, " How did Sikhism begin? " > The participant just could not bring himself round to acknowledging > the background of Guru Nanak as a Hindu. We just sat there and > watched him as he did all sorts of verbal gymnastics to avoid saying this. > > I spent the whole of today at one of the best private schools for girls > in Kensington. This was a wonderful experience! > Every time concepts of 'Atman or Brahman' are introduced, a > special sparkle appears in the eyes of western youngsters. Religion > and spirituality come alive .... nobody has ever told them of such > wonderful things enshrined in stodgy old religions. By the grace > of our mentor I am able to introduce these concepts to them. One > can clearly see the appreciation and love for religion resurfacing. > A very satisfactory day. > > dilip > Vivekananda Centre London > Sri Ramakrishnaye Namah > Vivekananda Centre London > http://www.vivekananda.co.uk > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2002 Report Share Posted October 17, 2002 Dear Mr. Brad: Thank you very much for your interest in Vedanta. Hope, you will inculcate this subject more and more. Here I have some small points for you to consider. (a) While studying Vedanta, should we brand ourselves as "Westerner" or "Easterner"? Do we ever adopt such demarcations (even as a matter of discussion) while studying any other departments of knowledge (like: science, engineering, history, economics and so on)? Whenever any human being discovers any truth, won't it at once become the property of entire mankind? Can anybody ever dare to attach a Jewish tag on "Theory of Relativity"? If Vedanta is to be considered as a mere system of belief, one may think of such groupings. If Vedanta has to survive as a Science (in fact, it is Science of Human Being in Depth--as proclaimed by Rev. Swami Ranganathanandaji Maharaj whom I consider the greatest exponent of Vedanta of our time), all of us should approach it with a trained scientific mind. That is the only prerequisite (a perfect scientific mindset) to study Vedanta Philosophy. Caste, creed, colour, costume--no bar! (b) What you have understood and expressed about "the caste system issue" is true. But, if you study the Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda (hope, you must have done), you will find that Swamiji has already discussed this issue with his characteristic style, clarity and authority. At the same time, he (the greatest enemy of caste system himself) has also explained the underlying idea of genesis of this caste system. It was not with all that bad intention that this system was introduced by the ancient Indian thinkers. And Swamiji, with his keen intellect and scientific insight, drew our attention to that point too (which most of us fail to notice). But, as per the inevitable rule of nature, every lofty ideas and customs degenerate over the passage of time; so did caste system too. But, just by seeing the ruins of a building can one (or should one) ever appreciate the majesty of its original shape? At least, anyone with a scientific mind won't do that. He/she would like to understand and analyse all aspects of it before coming to any conclusion. © Please do not misunderstand me. I am not advocating this evil by any means. But if you notice little carefully, you may find that the ghost of "caste system" dwells in almost every society in some form or the other! That is the human tragedy. We try to congregate together and form small groups for our own survival and growth and then try to fight with other such groups in the name of many silly issues. And thus the "caste system" continues to dominate in our society. This peculiar contradiction of human nature can also be explained by Vedanta. But that is a different topic altogether. Thank you again. Wish you all the best. Regards TP Bagchi. - Brad Stephan The Ramakrishna List Wednesday, October 16, 2002 8:12 PM [sri Ramakrishna] Experiences in London Dear Jay: Thanks again for sharing! As a Westerner I can relate to the "special sparkle" that appeared to the Western youngsters when learning of Hindu concepts - as if awakening memories from a previous life. For me, it was "Autobiography of a Yogi." It was my first exposure to Vedanta and it just struck me as being so true. Interestingly, it also awakened the truth of Christ in me, as well. Regarding the caste system issue, you handled it well. Another idea: did not all the great ones reject it? I.e., Sankara, Jnanesvara, Chaitanya, Tukarama, Ramakrishna, etc.? If so, maybe that would be something to point out, as well. God Bless, BradSri Ramakrishnaye NamahVivekananda Centre Londonhttp://www.vivekananda.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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