Guest guest Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Dear Friends, I would like to share an incident with you. Last Sunday when I had been to the temple of our Bhubaneswar Math I saw a strange sight. A teenaged couple were sitting in one of the benches. They were in a very romantic mood and the boy was repeatedly trying to embrace the girl. This was over and above their love talk. I was taken aback as such an incident has never taken place in the temple premises of the Math in its 75 year old history. I somehow finished my japam and came down in search of the Pujari Maharaj who is in charge of the temple. I told him everything. He felt very embarrassed and asked me to request the couple to vacate. I went up again and told them politely that such behaviour was not tolerated. They both looked at me and fell silent. However my anger did not subside at that and I informed the Head of the Math. He immediately gave orders that the couple be driven out of the Math premises. Later when my anger subsided I started thinking about the incident. The teenagers were obviously wrong but was driving them out the only answer? Was it the mistake of theirs or was today's environs responsible for such things? By driving them away did we not drive away Thakur from their lives? Would they ever visit the Math again with better intentions? Would it not have been better to counsel them lovingly? I was really troubled by the incident and the thoughts still rankle me. Is Thakur not for everybody? Are we so holy that we judge others? I would like to know the views of our list members. Regards, Jagannath. Tax Center - File online by April 15th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 yes, i think what you are retrospecting about is right. we are all often too judgemental in our life and whenever i have done the same i have felt ashamed later that being righteous or moralistic is perhaps too rigid and narrow an attitude to take in life. love is maybe the best way to deal with any situation. On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 Jagannath Chatterjee wrote : > >Dear Friends, > >I would like to share an incident with you. > >Last Sunday when I had been to the temple of our Bhubaneswar Math I saw a strange sight. A teenaged couple were sitting in one of the benches. They were in a very romantic mood and the boy was repeatedly trying to embrace the girl. This was over and above their love talk. I was taken aback as such an incident has never taken place in the temple premises of the Math in its 75 year old history. I somehow finished my japam and came down in search of the Pujari Maharaj who is in charge of the temple. I told him everything. He felt very embarrassed and asked me to request the couple to vacate. I went up again and told them politely that such behaviour was not tolerated. They both looked at me and fell silent. However my anger did not subside at that and I informed the Head of the Math. He immediately gave orders that the couple be driven out of the Math premises. > >Later when my anger subsided I started thinking about the incident. The teenagers were obviously wrong but was driving them out the only answer? Was it the mistake of theirs or was today's environs responsible for such things? By driving them away did we not drive away Thakur from their lives? Would they ever visit the Math again with better intentions? Would it not have been better to counsel them lovingly? I was really troubled by the incident and the thoughts still rankle me. Is Thakur not for everybody? Are we so holy that we judge others? > >I would like to know the views of our list members. > >Regards, >Jagannath. > Tax Center - File online by April 15th > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Dear Jaganath Ji , When anger subsides & when we start (re) thinking on an hindsight there are always some kind of correction factors which lead us think either we are guilty or gets us a different kind of answer . But we need to really draw a line as to which incidents requires a hindsight retrospection . Getting the romantic act at a place of worship certainly requires a get out order . Just as you kind thought had gone towards the couple thinking they missed an opportunity to get Sri Sri Thakurs grace or a 2nd visit to Math looks uncertain , why cant we think that it was through Thakur's order ( through your goodselves ) that they had to go out of the premises . Why cant we think that the act could have also affected certain weak minds who come to find solace at Math & blessing from the Holy Trinity ? Why shouldnt we think that if such things continue , for the sake of this couple few others who wouldnt like such sights would prefer to go to some other place ( moving away from Thakur ) Think what would happen if many couples take the holy environment of the Math in their own hand ? Its better we remove the bad weeds from the root so that the place is always healthy . Our scriptures provide the best answers , the old temples provide the best anwers . We are also not 100% pure in anyway ( sorry if I am a bit harsh ) , but we all attempt to move forward on the spiritual path by going into temples & get ourselves think of the Lord. lets not get into feeling so bad for an act which deserves it due place . Lets also not forget the new Brahmacharins who have sacrificed their family life & joined the Math & see such acts of romance . If Thakur wants to shower his grace on the couple , no one in the world can ever stop it . As Swamiji had said , " you get what you deserve " ...probably thats what the couple got !! Thanks Sanjeev Chennai Jagannath Chatterjee [jagchat01] 11 April 2004 13:27 Ramakrishna [sri Ramakrishna] An Incident. Dear Friends, I would like to share an incident with you. Last Sunday when I had been to the temple of our Bhubaneswar Math I saw a strange sight. A teenaged couple were sitting in one of the benches. They were in a very romantic mood and the boy was repeatedly trying to embrace the girl. This was over and above their love talk. I was taken aback as such an incident has never taken place in the temple premises of the Math in its 75 year old history. I somehow finished my japam and came down in search of the Pujari Maharaj who is in charge of the temple. I told him everything. He felt very embarrassed and asked me to request the couple to vacate. I went up again and told them politely that such behaviour was not tolerated. They both looked at me and fell silent. However my anger did not subside at that and I informed the Head of the Math. He immediately gave orders that the couple be driven out of the Math premises. Later when my anger subsided I started thinking about the incident. The teenagers were obviously wrong but was driving them out the only answer? Was it the mistake of theirs or was today's environs responsible for such things? By driving them away did we not drive away Thakur from their lives? Would they ever visit the Math again with better intentions? Would it not have been better to counsel them lovingly? I was really troubled by the incident and the thoughts still rankle me. Is Thakur not for everybody? Are we so holy that we judge others? I would like to know the views of our list members. Regards, Jagannath. Tax Center - File online by April 15th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Dear Sri Jagannath and all, --- Jagannath Chatterjee <jagchat01 wrote: > > Dear Friends, > > I would like to share an incident with you. > > Last Sunday when I had been to the temple of our > Bhubaneswar Math I saw a strange sight. A teenaged > couple were sitting in one of the benches. They were > in a very romantic mood and the boy was repeatedly > trying to embrace the girl. This was over and above > their love talk. I was taken aback as such an > incident has never taken place in the temple > premises of the Math in its 75 year old history.... > By driving them away > did we not drive away Thakur from their lives? Would > they ever visit the Math again with better > intentions? Would it not have been better to counsel > them lovingly? I was really troubled by the incident > and the thoughts still rankle me. Is Thakur not for > everybody? Are we so holy that we judge others? > Dear Jagannath, Don't be too hard on yourelf. Your efforts to correct these young people has now resulted in you correcting your own self. All is the SELF. When we see wrong in others then we are actually seeing it in our own SELF. Remove all wrong from your own life and you will have removed it from ALL. Let others be as they are. Forgive them, forgive yourSELF. I offer a brief quote from the Christian Bible, The Gospel of Luke, Chapter 6, verses 36-38: " Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. " Warmest regards, michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2004 Report Share Posted April 13, 2004 Haribol to all: I'm occidental but a few years ago I was in the Hare Krishna farm in Brazil and I saw the similar scene and the Spiritual Master (occidental too) that was near to me, order to somebody told to the young couple stopped, I was remember that I was in total agree with the Master because I was feeling that these teenagers was offended to the Divinity in the Temple. Now I'm thinking that the teenagers sometimes to be things wrongs, this is normal, and always is very good to have near somebody that to show them the correct path, certainly the God's Blessing came them in the just time. Thanks and sorry for my english, Padmavati Jagannath Chatterjee <jagchat01 wrote: Dear Friends, I would like to share an incident with you. Tax Center - File online by April 15th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2004 Report Share Posted April 13, 2004 dear sir, Maa said once if one of my child comes to me wallowed in dirt will i stop loving him?. We are taught to love everyone. mamta - Jagannath Chatterjee Ramakrishna Sunday, April 11, 2004 1:26 PM [sri Ramakrishna] An Incident. Tax Center - File online by April 15th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2004 Report Share Posted April 13, 2004 " M A, Sanjeev (M.A.) " <msanjeev wrote:Dear Jaganath Ji , When anger subsides & when we start (re) thinking on an hindsight there are always some kind of correction factors which lead us think either we are guilty or gets us a different kind of answer . But we need to really draw a line as to which incidents requires a hindsight retrospection . Getting the romantic act at a place of worship certainly requires a get out order . Just as you kind thought had gone towards the couple thinking they missed an opportunity to get Sri Sri Thakurs grace or a 2nd visit to Math looks uncertain , why cant we think that it was through Thakur's order ( through your goodselves ) that they had to go out of the premises . Why cant we think that the act could have also affected certain weak minds who come to find solace at Math & blessing from the Holy Trinity ? Why shouldnt we think that if such things continue , for the sake of this couple few others who wouldnt like such sights would prefer to go to some other place ( moving away from Thakur ) Think what would happen if many couples take the holy environment of the Math in their own hand ? Its better we remove the bad weeds from the root so that the place is always healthy . Our scriptures provide the best answers , the old temples provide the best anwers . We are also not 100% pure in anyway ( sorry if I am a bit harsh ) , but we all attempt to move forward on the spiritual path by going into temples & get ourselves think of the Lord. lets not get into feeling so bad for an act which deserves it due place . Lets also not forget the new Brahmacharins who have sacrificed their family life & joined the Math & see such acts of romance . If Thakur wants to shower his grace on the couple , no one in the world can ever stop it . As Swamiji had said , " you get what you deserve " ...probably thats what the couple got !! Thanks Sanjeev Chennai Jagannath Chatterjee [jagchat01] 11 April 2004 13:27 Ramakrishna [sri Ramakrishna] An Incident. Dear Friends, I would like to share an incident with you. Last Sunday when I had been to the temple of our Bhubaneswar Math I saw a strange sight. A teenaged couple were sitting in one of the benches. They were in a very romantic mood and the boy was repeatedly trying to embrace the girl. This was over and above their love talk. I was taken aback as such an incident has never taken place in the temple premises of the Math in its 75 year old history. I somehow finished my japam and came down in search of the Pujari Maharaj who is in charge of the temple. I told him everything. He felt very embarrassed and asked me to request the couple to vacate. I went up again and told them politely that such behaviour was not tolerated. They both looked at me and fell silent. However my anger did not subside at that and I informed the Head of the Math. He immediately gave orders that the couple be driven out of the Math premises. Later when my anger subsided I started thinking about the incident. The teenagers were obviously wrong but was driving them out the only answer? Was it the mistake of theirs or was today's environs responsible for such things? By driving them away did we not drive away Thakur from their lives? Would they ever visit the Math again with better intentions? Would it not have been better to counsel them lovingly? I was really troubled by the incident and the thoughts still rankle me. Is Thakur not for everybody? Are we so holy that we judge others? I would like to know the views of our list members. Regards, Jagannath. Tax Center - File online by April 15th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2004 Report Share Posted April 13, 2004 Dear List Following message from Babu ....We had to edit the tail ends out. We request the members to ensure that they remove tail end of earlier message before forwarding them to the whole list...............jay - " Babu " <baburoy <Ramakrishna > Tuesday, April 13, 2004 04:59 Re: [sri Ramakrishna] An Incident. One does go through a phase in life when an action is taken, and one feels regretful about that. Now, how could one have dealt with this situation? a) Compassion, and this case it would have been to advise them, to make them aware that what they were doing was wrong, seeing the circumstances. b) Ignorance, a 'who cares' attitude c) Action, which was taken. Generally, people would have followed the second path. Now, I have a question? Was the action taken really wrong? A couple (I am assuming they were mature adults) would definately realize that what they did was wrong. They may come back, if they want to. And another question - wouldn't Swamiji (Swami Vivekananda also have reacted similarly) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2004 Report Share Posted April 14, 2004 Dear Jagannath ji, Here is an excerpt from " Sri Ramakrishna and His Divine Play " - a translation of the Lilaprasanga by Swami Chetananda. This is from Page 815. The advice that the Master gave to women devotees was similar to what he told men. We remember that he once cautioned an extremely soft-hearted woman in this way : " Suppose a man you know takes great pains to help you on every occasion. However, you feel that this is because he's enchanted by your beauty and is too weak to break the spell. In that case would you be gentle to him? Wouldn't you instead give him a hard kick and stay away from him forever? So you see, you can't always treat everyone kindly under all conditions. There is a limit to showing kindness; one should consider time, place and person. " On page 814, Thakur is saying to Swami Yogananda : " That man spoke ill of me without any cause, and you sat in silence and did nothing! Do you know what the scriptures say? A disciple should cut off the head of anyone who speaks ill of his guru, or should leave the place at once. You didn't protest against these false accusations? " best wishes, ashish Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes./filing.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2004 Report Share Posted April 14, 2004 Dear jagannathji, I don't find anything wrong in your reaction. But when u told the couple that what they were doing is wrong at a spiritual place, u should have asked them to leave the place, in a polite manner. If they still continued their intolerable behavior, then u should have involved the head of the Math. Since u were angry with their behavior, u wanted to see them punished. When my kid does not behave, I try to correct by reasoning. Inspite of this, if she does it again, I will punish her. But I do this not in a fit of anger, but in the spirit of correcting her behavior. If u had done all the actions in the spirit of correcting the couple, there is nothing wrong. As ur a spiritually advanced person, and that u did those actions in a fit of anger, ur feeling bad. If I were u, I would have asked them to leave the premises even without consulting anyone at the Math. If they didn't listen, then I would have involved authorities. With Pranams, Prasad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2004 Report Share Posted April 14, 2004 Dear Jagannath ji, what a typical dilemma! me too have faced it numerous times especially when i had had a lot of sinful thoughts and felt very guilty about it when i was in the math premises. however, i found solace in M's literature where he portrayed succinctly the acceptance and blessings of Thakur granted to one of his inner circle members, whose name i cannot recall correctly (is it Mathur babu? Pardon me if mistaken.) It seems that the gentleman had enjoyed life's temptations thoroughly and yet was a favoured devotee of the master. Perhaps his acceptance by Thakur is a beacon. I will watch keenly what the other members of this group would have to say on your topic. Namasthe. --- Jagannath Chatterjee <jagchat01 wrote: > > Dear Friends, > > I would like to share an incident with you. >> > ===== Madhu Kommaraju Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes./filing.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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