Guest guest Posted August 7, 2004 Report Share Posted August 7, 2004 Dear Friends, As Jay has pointed out while answering to the question of Srikanth that often we find it difficult to believe that God, the perfect one, has created this imperfect world. In thus criticising God we often make the assumption that this world ,as we know it, is the centre of the universe. It is not. Moreover every creation requires a process and our world is just that, a process. This world is imperfect, yes. But in the midst of that imperfection is the quest for perfection. It is important to realise that. It is the dissatisfaction within us that drives us towards perfection. All this unhappiness, this misery is Gods gift to man so that he may seek the absolute and not remain satisfied with mundane pleasures. This world is an oppurtunity to evolve from a lower state to a higher state. The end product is perfect but the process may not be to our liking. Everybody resents the process of studying and the need to face an examination but after having passed the examination nobody questions the process or feels it to be imperfect. Not only do human beings evolve but also plants and minerals. As the statement of poet Rumi points out; By dying as a mineral I became a plant, by dying as a plant I became an animal, by dying as an animal I became human..... The world is never static, it is constantly changing, both at the macro and micro levels. As per Sri Aurobindo all this flux is the attempt of matter to evolve into the spirit. It is a tremendous struggle and very painful but it is worth it. Sri Ramakrishna put it in a different way. He identified the world as God. Therefore he concluded that it was God himself who is suffering. For those seeking a more rational answer this suffering may be equated to the suffering of a mother who totally identifies herself with her struggling child. Therefore we need not harp upon the imperfections to deny a perfect God. It is only after our struggles culminate into divinity shall we understand the real reason for this seemingly unnecessary turmoil. Do the spiritual seekers not become serene and radiate peace after having obtained a glimpse of the absolute? Love & regards, Jagannath. New and Improved Mail - Send 10MB messages! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2004 Report Share Posted August 7, 2004 Dear Jagannath, I accept your openion with respect to the stand point I am in(the material world).But, philosophically,I am a believer of Sripada Shankaracharya's theories(Maya theories).My question is why should God create imperfection and if you describe it to be his passtime, why should he have past times at all(after all he is some times defined as the perfect satisfaction/supreme satisfaction)?I eager to know others openions in the group too. Regards Srikanth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2004 Report Share Posted August 7, 2004 The Sufis say that God in the abstract is perfect satisfaction and lacks for nothing. But abstraction is not actuality. The Sufis see all planes of existence, including the earth plane, as real instead of various densities of illusion as it is held in some yoga philosophy. So God manifested Itself through the planes in order to know Itself, not just in potential but in florid and messy concreteness, because that is the only way to really know in all detail. The Sufis quote a Holy Tradition to support this: " I (God speaking) was a Hidden Treasure and longed to be known, so I created the worlds that I could be known. " This is not obvious if your path is one of transcendence only, but the Sufis also trace the descent of Spirit to Matter, and in so doing see purposefulness in creation. God is Divine Perfection, and manifestation is Divine Limitation. Our karma is God's gift to us and what we make of it -- what we do towards the fulfillment of the purpose of our life -- is our gift to God. It is said that God lacks for nothing, but there is one thing we can offer God that God does not have: our longing. Hafizullah @)->--- srikanth eeswara chandra pulugurta [tistuff] Saturday, August 07, 2004 10:45 am Ramakrishna Re: [sri Ramakrishna]This imperfect (?) world. Dear Jagannath, I accept your openion with respect to the stand point I am in(the material world).But, philosophically,I am a believer of Sripada Shankaracharya's theories (Maya theories). My question is why should God create imperfection and if you describe it to be his passtime, why should he have past times at all (after all he is some times defined as the perfect satisfaction/supreme satisfaction)? I eager to know others openions in the group too. Regards Srikanth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2004 Report Share Posted August 8, 2004 Dear All The answer to the question " why should God create imperfection " goes like this Perfection and imperfection are relative terms. They are in tune with the perceiver as well as with that of the observer and the creator. Having accepted the fact that its a materialistic world, Imperfection is a self-created word, which keeps one on the move , nurishes his or her quest to achieve and to see the ULTIMATE, which in plain words means GOD. The creator did not create these diversifications, nor do these words exist in his dictionary. They are created by us , for us to understand and strive to achieve the limits of excellence and for us (human beings) to LEARN TO LOOK BEYOND! I don't really think i gave a right answer but whatever came to my mind, i wrote. Regards Taposhri srikanth eeswara chandra pulugurta <tistuff wrote: Dear Jagannath, I accept your openion with respect to the stand point I am in(the material world).But, philosophically,I am a believer of Sripada Shankaracharya's theories(Maya theories).My question is why should God create imperfection and if you describe it to be his passtime, why should he have past times at all(after all he is some times defined as the perfect satisfaction/supreme satisfaction)?I eager to know others openions in the group too. Regards Srikanth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2004 Report Share Posted August 8, 2004 Om Namah Sivaya Dear Srikanth Rishi Tirumular who composed Tirumantiram 3000 years ago said the followings: Tirumantirum : verses 411–430 The totality of creation is for the evolution of jiva, that they may, through experience, learn of and realise their final destiny of uniting in the Pure Spirit. Why do souls, who inwardly share Siva’s eternal perfections of Satchidananda and Parasivam, need this evolution? Because each individual jiva, being temporally created as a divine soul-body that evolves from immaturity to maturity, from divine ignorance to divine sapience, is slowly gaining and maturing the faculties to realize its IDENTITY WITH SIVA’S PERFECTIONS. This evolution is effected through Siva’s purposeful imposing of veils – Anava (individualizing ignorance), Maya (subtle and material from), and Karma. The nature of jiva is one of ENVIRONMENTAL DEPENDENCE. When he is in the company of impurities, he is impure spirit. When he is with pure spirit, he becomes pure spirit. This body, the senses, the phenomenal world, and the power of sense enjoyment are created for the jiva, so that he may by experience learn how PAINFUL it is to be tainted by the triple impurities, and recurring birth and death, and so be liberated to MERGE in the Pure Spirit. The evolution of individual jivas is the primary reason for all the convoluted forms of creation. Why should the Supreme One engage Himself in it? Because of His infinite love for His most special creation, the jiva, who cannot mature into divine fulfilment without the impetuses of the triple malam, just as a baby cannot mature into a great and productive adulthood without the appropriate and necessary experiences. Each jiva is given all the time, experience and opportunities it needs to unfold its DIVINITY, to REALIZE GOD, and eventually to serve God and the Gods in helping other souls in their evolution. Rishi Tirumular's work included in the Saiva Siddhanta Philosophy, which is midway between Sankara’s Advaita and Ramanuja’s Visishtadvaita. This philosophy is followed by Saivites in both South Indian and Sri Lanka. The Saiva Siddhanta Philosophy : http://www.divinelifesociety.org/EBOOKS/swami_sivanandaji/downnload/all_about_hi\ nduism.html#_VPID_101 Sri Ramakrishnaya Namah Vivekananda Centre London http://www.vivekananda.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2004 Report Share Posted August 8, 2004 Namaste Srikanth, God did not create imperfection, this sense comes from a feeling of separation from Him, our own self, it only looks that way from a distance. The closer we get to the truth the more we see our own self in all things, then no imperfection appears. We long to know ourself, we look everywhere, finally we look where it is, then we are alone and again we long. Love, Bob srikanth eeswara chandra pulugurta [tistuff] Saturday, August 07, 2004 1:45 PM Ramakrishna Re: [sri Ramakrishna]This imperfect (?) world. Dear Jagannath, I accept your openion with respect to the stand point I am in(the material world).But, philosophically,I am a believer of Sripada Shankaracharya's theories(Maya theories).My question is why should God create imperfection and if you describe it to be his passtime, why should he have past times at all(after all he is some times defined as the perfect satisfaction/supreme satisfaction)?I eager to know others openions in the group too. Regards Srikanth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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