clogged arteries (was: egg recipes for arizona)

[Guest guest]

marianne2406 wrote:

 

> what most people head for when they go to the 'West

> Country' - they would all clog your arteries in no time at all but hope that

> clarifies our English cream for you.

> Marianne

 

Wow, will cream really clog arteries? I thought that partially

hydrogenated oils

were the only oils that did that...

 

Mindy, who *still* hasn't processed the info that coconut oil is

actually *good*

for you

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/1/02 22:54:31 GMT Standard Time, mindy

writes:

 

Don't they add sugar to cream? I don't like it so never eat it and have not

really studied it but next time I go to the supermarket I will check it out.

Marianne

 

> Wow, will cream really clog arteries? I thought that partially

> hydrogenated oils

> were the only oils that did that...

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/1/02 15:52:25 GMT Standard Time, joguest

writes:

 

I take it from your post that cream is in fact a saturated fat!! As I said,

I don't like the taste and never have eaten it so have not really studied it.

Thanks for the info JoAnn.

Marianne

 

 

> Saturated fats are said to contribute to artery plaque.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/1/02 17:58:28 GMT Standard Time, joguest

writes:

 

It is not something I have ever heard of and would be surprised if we can

purchase it here in the UK

Marianne

> . Have you ever tried the Meyenberg

> powdered goat milk? It is a very good substitute for traditional

> dairy and contains considerably less saturated fats.

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

--- Marianne & Mindy,

Saturated fats are said to contribute to artery plaque. I am of

the opinion that if one uses them wisely they can be incorporated

into the diet without the adverse effects that one gets from the

hydrogenated fats. Fats from natural sources such as Coconut oil,

Olive oil, Avocado oil and Organic butter are perfectly safe in my

estimation. I certainly would choose the Organic Dairy for my recipes

as the Bovine Growth Hormones are said to be the cause of much of the

prostate cancer that's so prevalent these days. Remember the article

I posted recently about Mayor Guiliani? That was thought provoking.

They seemed to have some hard evidence that BGH was the factor behind

prostate cancers. I think it can be a major contributing factor

behind breast cancer also and all the facts point in that direction.

The Horizon Organic creams that I buy usually don't have any added

sugars, thankfully! I suppose the processed ones such as Reddi-whip

would have tons!! :-) Yes, sugar has been proven to be a factor in

artery plaque, at least the processed kind. I get the organic

Turbinado sugar myself. It tastes similar to brown sugar.

Well this is about all I have to offer on the subject right at the

moment. I hope you are able to sort it all out. I am beginning to!

<grin> It is all so very different from the information you get in

the media, isn't it? I am searching for the truth and I'm so happy to

find some others who are also.

Regards, JoAnn

 

JoAnn Guest

joguest

Friendsforhealthnaturally

http://canceranswer.homestead.com/AIM.html

 

 

 

marianne2406@a... wrote:

> In a message dated 5/1/02 22:54:31 GMT Standard Time, mindy@l...

> writes:

>

> Don't they add sugar to cream? I don't like it so never eat it and

have not

> really studied it but next time I go to the supermarket I will

check it out.

> Marianne

>

> > Wow, will cream really clog arteries? I thought that partially

> > hydrogenated oils

> > were the only oils that did that...

> >

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

--- Marinne,

Oh yes, very much so! In fact all dairy products fall under that

classification. Americans love their dairy. Could be a reason why

heart attacks are the number one killer in this country. I cut way

back when I started experiencing problems. I only have a little goat

cheese occasionally at the moment. Seems to be much more nutritious

and less risky in the long run. Have you ever tried the Meyenberg

powdered goat milk? It is a very good substitute for traditional

dairy and contains considerably less saturated fats.

Regards, JoAnn

 

JoAnn Guest

joguest

Friendsforhealthnaturally

http://canceranswer.homestead.com/AIM.html

 

marianne2406@a... wrote:

> In a message dated 6/1/02 15:52:25 GMT Standard Time, joguest@m...

> writes:

>

> I take it from your post that cream is in fact a saturated fat!!

As I said,

> I don't like the taste and never have eaten it so have not really

studied it.

> Thanks for the info JoAnn.

> Marianne

>

>

> > Saturated fats are said to contribute to artery plaque.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Don't they add sugar to cream

 

Only the kind in the can...I've never seen sugar added to cream, only

whipped cream. and " whipping " cream on the package only means its

thick enough to whip not that it is already whipped.

 

 

> > Wow, will cream really clog arteries?

 

My current understanding of cream is that it will NOT clog the

arteries. Because NO fat/protein is turned to STORED fat UNLESS it

is eaten with ANY complex or simple carbo. Which means no sugar, not

pasta, no bread etc.

 

Diets like the Atkins, Protien Power, Somersize etc. (which all DO

talke about LOTS of veggies (just on carb veggies) all are positive

diets for the cardio vascular system. It's not because they deal so

much with cholesterol, but because if we have good fat in our diet,

and eat it separate from carbs, our arteries and veins will become

supple and healthy just as will hair, skin and nails. Therefore,

there will be no " scratches " on our arteries for the cholesterol to

stick to or to have the need to " patch " .

 

The current low fat, low choleserol - high grain, high carb diets are

fattening us up and killing us. What do you think they feed cattle

to fatten them up for market.....GRAINS which of course are carbs.

 

Blessings

Francie

[Guest guest]

-

" Mindy Behymer " <mindy

 

Sunday, January 06, 2002 9:24 AM

clogged arteries (was: egg recipes for arizona)

 

 

> Wow, will cream really clog arteries? I thought that partially

> hydrogenated oils

> were the only oils that did that...

>

> Mindy, who *still* hasn't processed the info that coconut oil is

> actually *good*

> for you

 

Hi Mindy,

 

What is bad for you is LDL carriers which contain free radical damaged fatty

acids.

 

VCNO has the lowest sensitivity to free radical attack of natural any oil / fat

you can eat. Only 35 % of the fatty

acids in natural coconut oil need LDL for transportation in the blood.

 

Add the two together and VCNO is by far the best fat / oil to eat.

 

Have a look at my analysis:

crsocietyVCO/OilAnalysis291201.gif

========================

Good Health & Long Life,

Greg Watson, http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au gowatson

USDA database (food breakdown) http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/

PubMed (research papers) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi

DWIDP (nutrient analysis) http://www.walford.com/dwdemo/dw2b63demo.exe

Patch file for above http://www.walford.com/download/dwidp67u.exe

KIM (omega analysis) http://ods.od.nih.gov/eicosanoids/KIM_Install.exe

[Guest guest]

---Marianne,

The Meyenberg goat milk was just a suggestion. I do know that you

have had to limit your dairy consumption and thought it might be a

good substitute. :-)

I'd just like to take a moment to clarify something. I know that

dairy cream, even the organic brands might be too much for you at

this time considering the fact that you have so much arterial plaque.

(If I remember correctly you stated that you have between 60 to 80

percent blockage?) Although the whipped cream might not be at all

dangerous for a healthy person I would recommend vastly limiting your

intake at this time.

Although dairy has no transfats, per se..., it is high in fat

content as evidenced by the fact that the countries of Denmark and

Finland who consume many high-fat dairy products rate second in heart

disease and are dead heat for close second to the U.S. in that

respect as we have the highest occurrence of heart and cardiovascular

disease in the entire world.

Another reason that I strongly suggest you limit your Dairy

intake...i.e. cream, etc. is that the first heart attack that I ever

experienced came the morning after I consumed two very large pieces

of pumpkin pie loaded with tons of whipped cream (

(Thanksgiving)...with no sugar whatsoever. Now that is strong

evidence that one should not load up on it if they already have a

problem in my mind! LOL However, I did not know I had a problem, so

you are considerably better off than I in that respect!!

It was the most horrible experience I have ever had needless to say.

At the moment my mind reverted back to what I had eaten the night

before. Wow,-- how I wished that I could have relived that evening!!

Just hope that you have better luck than I with it all!

 

Cheers, JoAnn

 

JoAnn Guest

joguest

Friendsforhealthnaturally

http://canceranswer.homestead.com/AIM.html

 

marianne2406@a... wrote:

> In a message dated 6/1/02 17:58:28 GMT Standard Time, joguest@m...

> writes:

>

> It is not something I have ever heard of and would be surprised if

we can

> purchase it here in the UK

> Marianne

> > . Have you ever tried the Meyenberg

> > powdered goat milk? It is a very good substitute for traditional

> > dairy and contains considerably less saturated fats.

> >

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/1/02 19:19:43 GMT Standard Time, francies2

writes:

 

Cleared that up a treat Francie - although as I say my mother ate an

exceptionally good diet (proper food) and ate very little processed food all

her life but still died of heart disease at 72. Her diet was anything but low

in (good) fat - cream in every cup of tea, butter cut like cheese on her

wholemeal bread, I don't think she ever had margarine in the house once she

was on her own - it is quite scarey to think that she ate what is considered

a very good diet and still had angina from about 52!

Marianne

 

> The current low fat, low choleserol - high grain, high carb diets are

> fattening us up and killing us.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/1/02 02:12:15 GMT Standard Time, joguest

writes:

 

Hi JoAnn - thank you for all that info, I have made notes - I do have 60% and

80% blockage but thankfully I do not like the taste of any cream and have

never eaten it in my life. I am more careful as to what I eat than I ever

was but there is still room for improvement.

Marianne

 

> Another reason that I strongly suggest you limit your Dairy

> intake...i.e. cream, etc.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

-

" mrsjoguest " <joguest

 

Sunday, January 06, 2002 8:11 PM

Re: clogged arteries (was: egg recipes for arizona)

 

 

> Although dairy has no transfats, per se..., it is high in fat

> content as evidenced by the fact that the countries of Denmark and

> Finland who consume many high-fat dairy products rate second in heart

> disease and are dead heat for close second to the U.S. in that

> respect as we have the highest occurrence of heart and cardiovascular

> disease in the entire world.

 

It is interesting you mention Finland. Below is a quote relating to

a study done in Finland regarding diet.

 

> . . . a Finnish trial published in 1975. In the five years that the trial

> ran, cholesterol levels were lowered significantly, and the study was

> hailed as a success. But in December 1991 the results of a 10-year

> follow-up to that trial found that those people who continued to

> follow the carefully controlled, cholesterol-lowering diet were twice

> as likely to die of heart disease as those who didn't - some success!

> Professor Michael Oliver, writing in the British Medical Journal

> commenting on the results, writes

 

> " As multiple intervention against risk factors for coronary heart

> disease in middle aged men at only moderate risk seem to have failed

> to reduce both morbidity and mortality such interventions become

> increasingly difficult to justify. This runs counter to the

> recommendations of many national and international advisory bodies

> which must now take the recent findings from Finland into

> consideration. Not to do so may be ethically unacceptable. "

http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/cholesterol_myth_2.html

 

Alobar

[Guest guest]

This is very interesting I always thpought our fat problems were due to

hydrogenated fats

Donna

In a message dated 1/7/02 11:54:40 AM, joguest writes:

 

<<

> > Finland who consume many high-fat dairy products rate second in

heart

> > disease and are dead heat for close second to the U.S. in that

> > respect as we have the highest occurrence of heart and

cardiovascular

> > disease in the entire world.

> >>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/1/02 15:32:32 GMT Standard Time, joguest

writes:

 

Hi JoAnn, not only did my mother die of h/d at 72, my g'mother died of h/d in

her early 50's - so I do know NOW, that I was a prime candidate because of

the smoking - my sister who has never smoked seems to be ok and I pray that

continues. I cannot stand the taste of chamomile tea but am working on my

stress levels so that they are no longer a problem.

 

Marianne

> Marianne,

> on reading your post to Francie I notice you mentioned the fact

> that your mother also had angina early in life. I have found that

> heredity is a huge factor in determining any risk we might have. My

> mother died of heart disease also, which is the main reason I

> determined to go the natural route. I learned by her mistakes in much

> the same way as you.

> In regards to the stress factors that you mentioned earlier,

> Chamomile is excellent for all three. sounds as if you are what we

> call a " type A " individual in America. Type A is more susceptible to

> heart attack they say simply b/c of certain personality traits.

> Regards, JoAnn

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/1/02 18:09:25 GMT Standard Time, francies2

writes:

 

I think I am going to have to restrict myself to one thing per meal to get it

right - does this mean that I cannot eat 'starchy' veggies with meat - i.e.

no potatoes or parsnips with

> So, it seems, at least for now, (as in many things) it appears that,

> in my understanding of studies conducted, it's not always WHAT you

> eat, but what you eat it with.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/1/02 18:36:54 GMT Standard Time, Marianne2406 writes:

 

Sorry guys hit a wrong button and sent the first one before I had finished.

>

> I think I am going to have to restrict myself to one thing per meal to get

> it right - does this mean that I cannot eat 'starchy' veggies with meat -

> i.e. no potatoes or parsnips with the meal? Sorry to be thick but this is

> all very new to me.

 

Marianne

>

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

--- Marianne,

on reading your post to Francie I notice you mentioned the fact

that your mother also had angina early in life. I have found that

heredity is a huge factor in determining any risk we might have. My

mother died of heart disease also, which is the main reason I

determined to go the natural route. I learned by her mistakes in much

the same way as you.

In regards to the stress factors that you mentioned earlier,

Chamomile is excellent for all three. sounds as if you are what we

call a " type A " individual in America. Type A is more susceptible to

heart attack they say simply b/c of certain personality traits.

Regards, JoAnn

 

JoAnn Guest

joguest

Friendsforhealthnaturally

http://www.geocities.com/mrsjoguest/Botanicals.html

 

arianne2406@a... wrote:

> In a message dated 7/1/02 02:12:15 GMT Standard Time, joguest@m...

> writes:

>

> Hi JoAnn - thank you for all that info, I have made notes - I do

have 60% and

> 80% blockage but thankfully I do not like the taste of any cream

and have

> never eaten it in my life. I am more careful as to what I eat than

I ever

> was but there is still room for improvement.

> Marianne

>

> > Another reason that I strongly suggest you limit your Dairy

> > intake...i.e. cream, etc.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Alobar,

I am aware of the Framingham study. I eat eggs without a problem,

but I am oh so leery of the creams even yet, although, I do use the

half and half. It's amazing how what one reads just sticks with you

over the years and although I am aware that the saturated fats, esp

the organic are better for you than the traditional dairy and

hydrogenated fats, I still look on the cream as an offender. Anything

that's labeled as fat I just would rather bypass. I have enough risk

factors w/o taking any additional chances. I seem to have good

results with the Meyenberg goat powders. I tried the whey powder

originally. I think the Meyenberg provides more nutrition than the

whey. Then again whey brings up the question of whether it also has

the BGH. It seems that doesn't require labeling either. If we only

knew exactly what goes into our foods, it would help immensely in

making the right choices. The FDA could help us out in that area, but

where are they when you need them? LOL

Oh, BTW, I never did fall for the cholesterol scare! My Dad ate an egg

(poached) morning and night for many many years and lived to be

97!! :-)

JoAnn

 

JoAnn Guest

joguest

http://www.geocities.com/mrsjoguest/Fats.html

 

> > Although dairy has no transfats, per se..., it is high in fat

> > content as evidenced by the fact that the countries of Denmark and

> > Finland who consume many high-fat dairy products rate second in

heart

> > disease and are dead heat for close second to the U.S. in that

> > respect as we have the highest occurrence of heart and

cardiovascular

> > disease in the entire world.

>

> It is interesting you mention Finland. Below is a quote

relating to

> a study done in Finland regarding diet.

>

> > . . . a Finnish trial published in 1975. In the five years that

the trial

> > ran, cholesterol levels were lowered significantly, and the study

was

> > hailed as a success. But in December 1991 the results of a 10-year

> > follow-up to that trial found that those people who continued to

> > follow the carefully controlled, cholesterol-lowering diet were

twice

> > as likely to die of heart disease as those who didn't - some

success!

[Guest guest]

> Cleared that up a treat Francie - although as I say my mother ate an

> exceptionally good diet (proper food) and ate very little processed

food all her life but still died of heart disease at 72. Her diet was

anything but low in (good) fat - cream in every cup of tea, butter cut

like cheese on her wholemeal bread, I don't think she ever had

margarine in the house once she was on her own - it is quite scarey to

think that she ate what is considered a very good diet and still had

angina from about 52!

> Marianne

 

 

Hi Marianne, here are some clues according to information I am

currently studying.....Cream with coffee....coffee sparks the pancreas

to release insulin. Insulin tells the body to store any fats consumed

with the insulin-sparking component as fat in the system.

 

clue two: butter cut like cheese on wholemeal bread.....bread, no

matter how whole the grain is, is still a carbo, even tho it's a

complex carbo, it turns to what the body recognizes as sugar and tells

the pancreas to secrete insulin. Same as above, insulin tells the

body to store the carbs as fat.

 

Conversely, when one eats these fat/protein foods with NO carbs, they

are not stored in the body at all. The body is forced to use stored

fat for fuel. When stored fat is used, not only does weight reduction

occur, when needed, but the body seems to react differently and

arteries and veins are more healthy. Also, it seems that many things

we do blocks the bodies ability to pick up and use CoEnzymeQ10. That

enzyme is imparative for a healthy heart as well as other muscles.

 

So, it seems, at least for now, (as in many things) it appears that,

in my understanding of studies conducted, it's not always WHAT you

eat, but what you eat it with.

 

Blessings

Francie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/1/02 21:03:28 GMT Standard Time, francies2

writes:

 

francie you are obviously following the 'combination diet' - have you had

really good results from it and have you lost a lot of weight following it?

Marianne

 

> I am not eating ANY carbs with it.

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

--- Donna,

Well actually I agree!!

I firmly believe that the majority of problems Americans experience

are due to a diet high in hydrogenated fats. All one has to do is

look around...it's everywhere!! On the other hand, although many of

the European countries have placed a ban on the hydrogenated fats,

i.e. Germany, Netherlands, etc... many of these same countries still

have a myriad of heart problems. There are those who attribute this

to many high-fat dairy products.

I wonder about these ethnic studies.:-) I try to follow the

Mediterranean Diet myself. Lots of olives, olive oil, veggies and

fish! Their incidence of cancer (any type) is basically nil!

JoAnn

JoAnn Guest

joguest

Friendsforhealthnaturally

http://canceranswer.homestead.com/AIM.html

 

the Finnish people dfnewman@a... wrote:

> This is very interesting I always thpought our fat problems were

due to

> hydrogenated fats

> Donna

> In a message dated 1/7/02 11:54:40 AM, joguest@m... writes:

>

> <<

> > > Finland who consume many high-fat dairy products rate second in

> heart

> > > disease and are dead heat for close second to the U.S. in that

> > > respect as we have the highest occurrence of heart and

[Guest guest]

-

" mrsjoguest " <joguest

 

Monday, January 07, 2002 9:52 AM

Re: clogged arteries (was: egg recipes for arizona)

 

 

> Alobar,

> I am aware of the Framingham study. I eat eggs without a problem,

> but I am oh so leery of the creams even yet, although, I do use the

> half and half. It's amazing how what one reads just sticks with you

> over the years and although I am aware that the saturated fats, esp

> the organic are better for you than the traditional dairy and

> hydrogenated fats, I still look on the cream as an offender. Anything

> that's labeled as fat I just would rather bypass. I have enough risk

> factors w/o taking any additional chances. I seem to have good

> results with the Meyenberg goat powders. I tried the whey powder

> originally. I think the Meyenberg provides more nutrition than the

> whey. Then again whey brings up the question of whether it also has

> the BGH. It seems that doesn't require labeling either. If we only

> knew exactly what goes into our foods, it would help immensely in

> making the right choices. The FDA could help us out in that area, but

> where are they when you need them? LOL

> Oh, BTW, I never did fall for the cholesterol scare! My Dad ate an egg

> (poached) morning and night for many many years and lived to be

> 97!! :-)

> JoAnn

 

Diet is a hard one. With so many " experts " in disagreement, I sure

can't say I am an expert. But thru my reading I have found threads of

similarity which seem to make sense. Cholesterol is needed by the body.

It is the basis for making many different hormones. If the body is

deprived of cholesterol thru diet, the body makes more cholesterol. When

the body makes its own cholesterol, it sometimes makes more than it needs

according to Dr.Schwarzbein.

 

From Dr.Pauling & Rath I found out that cholesterol is put down in

arteries due to damage. Now damage can come from eating the wrong kind of

fats so our cell membranes are composed of fats our cells were never

designed to be made of (like vegetable oils). Just how much corn would one

have to eat in a day to get a cup of corn oil anyway??? So I try to avoid

most oils I feel are not made from good quality fats.

 

I have read (Rath & Pauling, again) that arterial damage can be

repaired thru use of lysine, proline, lots of Vitamin C, and co-enzyme Q10.

Let me quote from Dr.Jon here:

> Recently I read Pauling's research involving heart disease. I had

> never seen it published. I have a 70% occlusion of my carotid

> arteries, which made the data of great interest to me. I wanted to

> share this with you. As this is written (7-2-01) I am going on

> Pauling's formula as well as taking 300mg of CoQ-10 daily.

 

> 12-20-01 A scan of my carotid arteries revealed a 20% improvement on

> my left carotid artery. My cardiologist was astonished for such

> blockage (stenosis) very rarely improves. I told him of the two

> nutrients I was taking. He just scoffed as nonsense! Alas, many of

> my colleagues have been well brain washed into believing that

> something cheap, and harmless, can possibly replace a dangerous

> $25,000.00 angioplasty or a $60,000.00 heart bypass surgery.

http://cat007.com/pauling.htm

 

Here is another quote from the same site:

> Lipoprotein(a) " small a " or Lp(a) is a variant of the so called " bad "

> LDL cholesterol. Lp(a) is " sticky " substance in the blood that

> Pauling and Rath believe is the lipid that begins the process of

> forming atherosclerotic plaques in heart disease. The 1985 Nobel

> prize in medicine was awarded for the discovery of the cholesterol

> binding sites. The so-called Lysine Binding Sites. We now know that

> it is Lp(a) and not ordinary cholesterol which binds to form plaque.

> Briefly, Lp(a) has lysine (and proline) receptors. You can think of

> a chemical receptor as a simple lock and key. Only one key (e.g.

> lysine) will fit into the lock (receptor on the Lp(a) molecule.)

> There may be multiple receptors on the molecule, but once they are all

> filled up with keys (lysine or proline) the Lp(a) molecule looses its

> ability to bind with any more " keys. " When all the Lp(a) locks have

> keys, Lp(a) will no longer be able to create plaque.

 

> Once Linus Pauling learned that Lp(a) has receptors for lysine, he

> knew how to counter the atherosclerosis process chemically. His

> invention, the Pauling Therapy, is to increase the concentration of

> this essential and non-toxic amino acid (and proline) in the blood

> serum. Lysine and proline supplements increase the concentration of

> free lysine and proline in the blood. The higher the concentration

> of the free lysine (and proline) in the blood, the more likely it is

> that Lp (a) molecules will bind with this lysine, rather than the

> lysine strands that have been exposed by cracks in blood vessels, or

> the other lysine that has been attracted to the Lp(a) already

> attached to the blood vessel wall.

 

> According to Pauling, a high concentration of free lysine can destroy

> existing plaques. It is important to keep all this in perspective

> using the Pauling/Rath Unified theory. If you are not getting enough

> vitamin C to produce collagen, and your blood vessels are wearing

> down, then the Lp(a) plaque is of great benefit to you. Simply

> removing plaque without restoring the vein or artery to health is

> like tearing a scab off a wound. You do not want to remove the scab

> until after the tissue underneath has started healing. Your body

> needs sufficient vitamin C so your veins and arteries can heal.

 

> The Unified Theory blames mechanical stresses (high blood pressures,

> stretching and bending, etc.) on the blood vessels for exposing

> lysine that Lp(a) is attracted to. This explains why plaque doesn't

> always form. Atherosclerosis is a healing process. Like a scab,

> plaques form after a lesion or injury to the blood vessel wall.

> There is an awesome elegance that these binding inhibitors (vitamin

> C/lysine) are completely non-toxic. They are also the basic building

> blocks of collagen. The unified theory blames poor collagen

> production for the entire problem of heart disease. Therefore, the

> Pauling Therapy not only melts plaque, but it attacks the root cause

> by stimulating the bodies' production of collagen.

 

> With enough collagen, arteries remain strong and plaque free. The

> Pauling and Rath theory postulates that the root cause of

> atherosclerotic plaque deposits is a chronic vitamin C deficiency

> which limits the collagen our bodies can make. A surprising body of

> experimental research supports the Pauling/Rath view. Careful

> studies with animals that do not make their own endogenous vitamin C

> prove that when the dietary intake of the vitamin is low, collagen

> production is limited, and blood vessels tend to become thinner and

> weaker from wear and tear. Plaque deposits then form to compensate

> for this weakness. Such animals are rare.

 

> Large population studies also support the view that increased vitamin

> C intake results in lower incidence of cardiovascular disease and

> lower death rates.

 

> Heart Disease is Chronic Scurvy

 

So I am not so much worried about how many saturated fats I eat, as

I am abiout overall arterial health. Plaque does not seem to deposit from

eating fatty foods (lamb fat congealing on one's dinner plate) as it does

from internal damage which prompts the body to deposit cholesterol as an

attempt to heal the damage. So I figure my best bet is to repair damage,

rather than try to minimize cholesterol & animal fats. I take the

Rath/Pauling formula of lysine & proline. I also take 8,000-16,000 mg of

Vitamin C each day. I used to take small amounts of co-enzyme Q-10, but I

increased my dose to 60mg/day when I located a much less inexpensive source,

and am about to up that again to 120mg/day because from reading various

posts on this list, I realize I do have some shortness of breath & that may

indicate some arterial blockage.

 

It would seem that the people who make money from sick people do not

like Vitamin C. They keep issuing warnings of diverse dangers from using

too much. The post a while back about " Americans will believe almost

anything " (http://mercola.com/2001/aug/15/perception.htm) clearly defined

this phenomenon. Lots of dysinformation out there -- not just about

vitamin C. We have been trained to believe the dysinformation & disbelieve

the " quack " & " fringe-science " material. So now we must un-learn some

things & re-learn how to learn. Not real easy sometimes. I find myself

reading a website which seems to be making sense, then the author starts

taking about stuff I know is wrong. I used to just discard the whole essay

as being garbage. Now I keep reading. Some I believe in, some I discard.

Other stuff I have to put into a third category. Then I keep reading more &

more different websites. Over time, I accumulate more evidence and much of

what I had originally placed into te third category gets re-filled into

stuff I believe to be tru, or I disgard it as false. Some of the things I

now beleve to be true would amaze & horrify me 20 years ago! Likewise some

of the things I now find to be false.

 

A long time ago, I joined a metaphysical society & as part of my

initiation I was asked " In times of difficulty and danger in whom do you

place your trust? " Only one correct answer was accepted & each candidate had

to keep guessing until they got it right. It may seem a small little game,

but the lesson impressed itself on me & has formed the basis of all my

inquiries into any quagmire of dysinformation.

 

Alobar

 

 

 

 

 

> JoAnn Guest

> joguest

> http://www.geocities.com/mrsjoguest/Fats.html

>

> > > Although dairy has no transfats, per se..., it is high in fat

> > > content as evidenced by the fact that the countries of Denmark and

> > > Finland who consume many high-fat dairy products rate second in

> heart

> > > disease and are dead heat for close second to the U.S. in that

> > > respect as we have the highest occurrence of heart and

> cardiovascular

> > > disease in the entire world.

> >

> > It is interesting you mention Finland. Below is a quote

> relating to

> > a study done in Finland regarding diet.

> >

> > > . . . a Finnish trial published in 1975. In the five years that

> the trial

> > > ran, cholesterol levels were lowered significantly, and the study

> was

> > > hailed as a success. But in December 1991 the results of a 10-year

> > > follow-up to that trial found that those people who continued to

> > > follow the carefully controlled, cholesterol-lowering diet were

> twice

> > > as likely to die of heart disease as those who didn't - some

> success!

>

>

>

>

> Getting well is done one step at a time, day by day, building health

> and well being.

>

> To learn more about the Gettingwell group,

> Subscription and list archives are at:

> Gettingwell

>

>

[Guest guest]

--- Alobar,

I too believe the Linus-Pauling theory that most heart disease

occurs from a lack of antioxidants. Although I agree in that respect,

I just think that diet plays a large part as to whether the existing

plaque formation forms in the beginning or not.

Hydrogenated fats are listed among the free radicals in recent

literature. Also mayo is listed as an omega-6. We all know that an

abundance of the omega-6s without the protection of many omega-3s

spells trouble. This proves to me that one's foods are implicated in

much of the free radical damage that occurs within our arteries.

Although this is just one of the risks, it is not to be taken

lightly. Environmental factors, such as air, water and soil pollution

play a huge role in free radical damage,I agree, but our dietary risk

is the only variable.

At the last report, there are about 70,000 chemicals that are

circulating around in our space and prevalent in our foodstuffs. How

can one's body tolerate this on a daily basis without an

overabundance of antioxidants? The amino acids, C with flavonoids and

COQ10 are very good for reversing artery damage I agree. These should

be taken on a daily basis, I agree.

Those who are depending on their nutrient-depleted foods for their

protection are in for a rude-awakening, esp. in regards to the fact

that any drugs one might be taking results in a depletion of many of

the nutrients which our bodies have managed to assimilate in spite of

these environmental insults.

These cardiologists would tend to scoff at vitamin therapy

as they are simply not taught anything regarding it in medical

school. One article I read stated that they get a maximum of 10 hours

total on nutrition and it's benefits! What can you really learn in

that period of time.

As for the corn oil. I've heard that it is one of the very worst oils

on the market. And that was before GMO's!! It's in the same rank with

Canola (rapeseed) oils.

I rarely touch corn, unless it has the organic label printed in very

large print on the front of the packaging. I did get some organic

popcorn...doubt that it has very much oil included though. :-)

Very tasty prepared in olive oil with some organic butter sprinkled

on. :-)

Cheers, JoAnn

 

JoAnn Guest

joguest

Friendsforhealthnaturally

http://canceranswer.homestead.com/AIM.html

 

 

" Alobar " <alobar@b...> wrote:

>

> -

> " mrsjoguest " <joguest@m...>

> <Gettingwell>

> Monday, January 07, 2002 9:52 AM

> Re: clogged arteries (was: egg recipes for

arizona)

 

> Diet is a hard one. With so many " experts " in

disagreement, I sure

> can't say I am an expert. But thru my reading I have found

threads of

> similarity which seem to make sense. Cholesterol is needed by the

body.

> It is the basis for making many different hormones. If the body is

> deprived of cholesterol thru diet, the body makes more

cholesterol. When

> the body makes its own cholesterol, it sometimes makes more than it

needs

> according to Dr.Schwarzbein.

>

> From Dr.Pauling & Rath I found out that cholesterol is put

down in

> arteries due to damage. Now damage can come from eating the wrong

kind of

> fats so our cell membranes are composed of fats our cells were never

> designed to be made of (like vegetable oils). Just how much corn

would one

> have to eat in a day to get a cup of corn oil anyway??? So I try

to avoid

> most oils I feel are not made from good quality fats.

>

> I have read (Rath & Pauling, again) that arterial damage

can be

> repaired thru use of lysine, proline, lots of Vitamin C, and co-

enzyme Q10.

> Let me quote from Dr.Jon here:

> > Recently I read Pauling's research involving heart disease. I had

> > never seen it published. I have a 70% occlusion of my carotid

> > arteries, which made the data of great interest to me. I wanted

to

> > share this with you. As this is written (7-2-01) I am going on

> > Pauling's formula as well as taking 300mg of CoQ-10 daily.

>

> > 12-20-01 A scan of my carotid arteries revealed a 20% improvement

on

> > my left carotid artery. My cardiologist was astonished for such

> > blockage (stenosis) very rarely improves. I told him of the two

> > nutrients I was taking. He just scoffed as nonsense! Alas, many

of

> > my colleagues have been well brain washed into believing that

> > something cheap, and harmless, can possibly replace a dangerous

> > $25,000.00 angioplasty or a $60,000.00 heart bypass surgery.

> http://cat007.com/pauling.htm

[Guest guest]

AWESOME!!!!!

 

That is the kind of information that makes sence to me.

Francie

>

>

> From Dr.Pauling & Rath I found out that cholesterol is put

down in

> arteries due to damage. Now damage can come from eating the wrong

kind of

> fats so our cell membranes are composed of fats our cells were never

> designed to be made of (like vegetable oils). Just how much corn

would one

> have to eat in a day to get a cup of corn oil anyway??? So I try to

avoid

> most oils I feel are not made from good quality fats.

>

[Guest guest]

Alobar wrote:

 

> I take the

> Rath/Pauling formula of lysine & proline. I also take 8,000-16,000 mg of

> Vitamin C each day.

 

Alobar,

Wow, you take in a lot of Vit C each day!! Do you take in tablet/capsule form

or in powder form? The most I've found in tablet form is 500mg per pill.... I

did find some ascrobic acid which says there is 2.5g in each teaspoon, but then

I read somewhere else that Ascorbic acid isn't *really* Vitamin C... confusing.

Help?!

 

 

> A long time ago, I joined a metaphysical society & as part of my

> initiation I was asked " In times of difficulty and danger in whom do you

> place your trust? " Only one correct answer was accepted & each candidate had

> to keep guessing until they got it right.

 

Hmm...okay, so what was the right answer? I hope the right answer wasn't

" myself " 'cause I sure as heck don't know...

 

Mindy