Guest guest Posted May 18, 2001 Report Share Posted May 18, 2001 Even the most prestigious medical journals such as the Lancet are now saying that medical research has reached such a level of self interested results or rank fraud, that much of what masquerades as " good science " is suspect, even from the most " impeccable " sources. All this has really been either known or guessed at for years. Where does that leave us? As many before me have stated, we need to decide for ourselves after taking into account opinions and research which, even if we don't trust it, we're prepared to acknowledge that it might be relevant. Other people's opinions, such as we have in the Group, are also significant, but the same applies. Most importantly, it seems to me, everyone is different and so responds differently to the same medicine. This is just common sense. How do we work our way through this minefield? I reckon that the first thing is to question whether or not we can actually make a " mistake " in electing to do one thing or another. We're often fearful (and who could blame us) when it comes to choosing to take a remedy or undergo a treatment or attend a practitioner, but much of that fear comes from believing that there will be serious consequences if we make the wrong decision. One of the techniques used by doctors is to imply that we're in great danger should we not partake of their recommendations. That may not be correct, but makes us beholden to their expertise. Then there's the more esoteric concept perhaps of whether or not it's really us who's actually making the decision. Maybe we're just an organism responding to a set of circumstances in a pretty predictable way, should we be able to step far enough away from ourselves and see it...not easy I grant you. We like to imagine ourselves in control. Many pages of groups such as our bodymind group is devoted to individuals arguing back and forth about what is good for this or for that. Perhaps nothing or not much is universally good for anything, and its power to heal is given to it by us, the user. This is real mindbody medicine, where the attitude to the remedy is considered to be as important as the pharmacy of the remedy itself. Arjuna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 18, 2001 Report Share Posted May 18, 2001 Dear Arjuna: What a smart post. I really appreciate your uncommon common sense here. The old placebo effect is still got some of the best statistics of anything out there. Most of us know the benifit of the placebo effect, with that in mind what does it serve to give someone a nocebo effect? ie, if you believe something will hurt you, it just might, no matter haw benign. I used to have giggle rocks in my store, that we give to kids who come in with thier parents. ( they are just river stones I picked up and cleaned) but I give each child this special giggle rock when they leave my store, and tell them if the concentrate on it, it will make them giggle. They ALWAYS giggle. Give someone some good milk, and let them take a sip and then tell them is sour. They will immediatly taste it as sour. I experimented with this and it works. We as humans are much more powerful manifestors than we realize. And it is my belief that language is the first step in manifestation. You speak the thing. I try to make a conscious effot to not speak the fear, so as not to create the thing I could be afraid of. Not in a denial sort of way, but as a way of realizing the power of my thought. One of the most toxic things out there is chemo therapy, yet it is curing some people. If someone tells me they are on chemo, I would not dare tell them that it's toxic, I feel thats almost immoral. I tell them of the great advances in the world of cancer and chemo, and that I'm sure that they are going to do well. I call it chemo sabi, our friend. I've worked with cancer patients for years, and that one talk, makes a huge difference in how bad thier side effects are. They often report back about how much better they feel about thier disease and thier choosen cure. So I totally agree, the attitude toward the remedy is as important as the action, if not more important. love connie > levitron > > Fri, 18 May 2001 06:29:18 -0000 > > Medical research > > Even the most prestigious medical journals such as the Lancet are now > saying that medical research has reached such a level of self > interested results or rank fraud, that much of what masquerades > as " good science " is suspect, even from the most " impeccable " sources. > All this has really been either known or guessed at for years. > Where does that leave us? > As many before me have stated, we need to decide for ourselves after > taking into account opinions and research which, even if we don't > trust it, we're prepared to acknowledge that it might be relevant. > Other people's opinions, such as we have in the Group, are also > significant, but the same applies. Most importantly, it seems to me, > everyone is different and so responds differently to the same > medicine. This is just common sense. How do we work our way > through this minefield? > I reckon that the first thing is to question whether or not we can > actually make a " mistake " in electing to do one thing or another. > We're often fearful (and who could blame us) when it comes to > choosing to take a remedy or undergo a treatment or attend a > practitioner, but much of that fear comes from believing that there > will be serious consequences if we make the wrong decision. One of > the techniques used by doctors is to imply that we're in great danger > should we not partake of their recommendations. That may not be > correct, but makes us beholden to their expertise. > Then there's the more esoteric concept perhaps of whether or not it's > really us who's actually making the decision. Maybe we're just an > organism responding to a set of circumstances in a pretty predictable > way, should we be able to step far enough away from ourselves and see > it...not easy I grant you. We like to imagine ourselves in control. > Many pages of groups such as our bodymind group is devoted to > individuals arguing back and forth about what is good for this or for > that. Perhaps nothing or not much is universally good for anything, > and its power to heal is given to it by us, the user. This is real > mindbody medicine, where the attitude to the remedy is considered to > be as important as the pharmacy of the remedy itself. > Arjuna > > > **************************************** > Visit the community page: > For administrative problems -owner > To , - > > All messages, files and archives of this forum are copyright of the > group and the individual authors. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 18, 2001 Report Share Posted May 18, 2001 Arjuna: I agree, that there is a blindered one-sidedness in the nature of most research, no matter where it emerges. That is a problem, trying to remain objective... and in fact, the research process as we know it encourages the researcher to theorize the outcome beforehand, so there is an element of prejudice built into it, even when the results refute the initial theory. I imagine that a lot of research ends up " on the cutting room floor " so to speak, as things are tried again and again, in different ways, until they support the researcher's theory. Like statistics, the study group and results of many research projects can be open to interpretation, as well. I was interested to read a study will be posted in JAMA about a supposed correlation between breast feeding and obesity, basically saying that if a child is breast fed he/she is less likely to be an obese adult, and the longer they are breast fed, the greater the likelihood they will be thin. My mother breast fed all three of her children for at least a year (I was breast fed until I was three) and two of us would be considered obese. So I am wondering who they studied, and under what circumstances. I am thinking this could be 'dangerous' research, in that a mother with an obese child who was bottle fed may feel guilt and responsibility for not breast feeding, or an adult who is obese that was not breast fed could feel that their mother was responsible because she denied her breasts to them. Guilt. Resentment. False suppositions from research. I really encourage people to get as much information as they can about things, pro and con, and then work from their own perceptual framework, intuition and reasoning capabilities to decide what resonates for them. Writing a book or doing research doesn't make someone an authority any more than wearing a white jacket makes someone a doctor. Your comments about mistakes and control are right on target; and perhaps is one of the keys to understanding how we limit ourselves through our beliefs. I understand how people can become enmeshed in the rituals of diet and behavior to the point that they become fearful and superstitious. If a person does something out of fear rather than out of desire, they are allowing themselves to be held hostage rather than finding their way to personal freedom through proactive decisions. I occasionally see a program about the fundamentalist groups that handle snakes. Without buying into their reasons, I find it interesting that the people who seem to suffer ill effects from the snake bites are unable to achieve the ecstatic state because of fear, shame or guilt... in their nomenclature, their " sin " kills them. So, is it possible, that it is our own fear, shame and guilt may block our ecstacy, and with it our ability to transform the poisons that lead to dis-ease in our systems? Looking at ego (seems to be a good thing to look at this week)... how much ego do we need to pay attention to our intuition, our internal locus of control and motivation, and where is the line that crosses over into hubris? What do you think comprises the balance between the physical realities of the body and the boundless potential of the mind? Blessings, Crow > Perhaps nothing or not much is universally good for anything, and its power to > heal is given to it by us, the user. This is real mindbody medicine, where the > attitude to the remedy is considered to be as important as the pharmacy of the > remedy itself. > Arjuna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 18, 2001 Report Share Posted May 18, 2001 Dear Caroline: Whats a hubris? love connie > Caroline Abreu <carocrow > > Looking at ego (seems to be a good thing to look at this week)... how much ego > do > we need to pay attention to our intuition, our internal locus of control and > motivation, and where is the line that crosses over into hubris? What do you > think comprises the balance between the physical realities of the body and the > boundless potential of the mind? > > Blessings, > Crow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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