forgiveness done incorrectly only makes it worse

[Guest guest]

Sandy,

 

Your comment on " Please forgive me " and " I am sorry " are phrases used only by

" losers... "

 

Could you please elaborate on this....are you talking about the impact they

have on the person saying it....when they really mean it...does it in someway

make them lose respect for themselves...??

 

thanks..

 

Susan

[Guest guest]

, shanna

<susanj324 wrote:

>

> Sandy,

>

> Your comment on " Please forgive me " and " I am sorry " are phrases

used only by " losers... "

>

> Could you please elaborate on this....are you talking about the

>impact they have on the person saying it....when they really mean

>it...does it in someway make them lose respect for themselves...??

 

Susan I think that Sandy was saying that many people who use those

two words use them as a way to get out of their responsibility for

the acts they say they are sorry for. They use those words as a

method of placating the people that are angry with them.

 

Your husband cheats on you. He says he's sorry. You catch him

cheating again. He says he's sorry. There is no validation to the

sorry part.

 

And there seems to be another part of making a mistake besides

saying " I'm sorry " .

 

The parts that are missing are the methods on changing behavior so

that the action they deeply regret becomes a launching point for

their own emotional and spiritual development.

 

Barbara Ann

 

> thanks..

>

> Susan

>

[Guest guest]

> Could you please elaborate on this....are you talking about the impact

> they have on the person saying it....when they really mean it...does it in

> someway make them lose respect for themselves...??

>

> thanks..

>

> Susan

-

Self demeaning language.

One could switch to a response that does not suggest there is any mea

culpa.

" Excuse me " works.

I prefer to give it a French twist... " skoo zay. "

 

rusty

 

-

" shanna " <susanj324

 

Friday, March 28, 2008 11:34 PM

forgiveness done incorrectly only

makes it worse

 

 

> Sandy,

>

> Your comment on " Please forgive me " and " I am sorry " are phrases used

> only by " losers... "

>

> Could you please elaborate on this....are you talking about the impact

> they have on the person saying it....when they really mean it...does it in

> someway make them lose respect for themselves...??

>

> thanks..

>

> Susan

[Guest guest]

rusty wrote:

 

Perhaps this is more personal than appropriate It may clarify the

concept for some.

When my mother ( a criminal ) said " I'm sorry " she meant, You are

supposed to accept and ignore abuse whatever its form and let me off

the hook for my actions see " forgive " .

The " I'm sorry " she wanted from others meant that they were to admit,

accept that they were worthless, pathetic inferiors ( sorry as a

description).

 

Peggy Jentoft

 

>> Could you please elaborate on this....are you talking about the impact

>> they have on the person saying it....when they really mean it...does it in

>> someway make them lose respect for themselves...??

>>

>> thanks..

>>

>> Susan

>>

> -

> Self demeaning language.

> One could switch to a response that does not suggest there is any mea

> culpa.

> " Excuse me " works.

> I prefer to give it a French twist... " skoo zay. "

>

> rusty

>

> -

> " shanna " <susanj324

>

> Friday, March 28, 2008 11:34 PM

> forgiveness done incorrectly only

> makes it worse

>

>

>

>> Sandy,

>>

>> Your comment on " Please forgive me " and " I am sorry " are phrases used

>> only by " losers... "

>>

>> Could you please elaborate on this....are you talking about the impact

>> they have on the person saying it....when they really mean it...does it in

>> someway make them lose respect for themselves...??

>>

>> thanks..

>>

>> Susan

>>

>

>

> ---

>

>

[Guest guest]

I never say I'm sorry.

 

I am not a " sorry " person.

 

I am, however, not perfect. (Much to my own amazement!) There may also

be the possibility that I am not a saint.

 

I do make mistakes. Yes, even *I* screw up.

 

When I do, I apologize. I will say something like, " I apologize. "

 

I'm NOT attempting to be facetious. Saying " I apologize " is only the

first part of the drill.

 

The second part, and the part that often gets startled reactions from

the person(s) I am making amends to, is the part that goes like this:

" What is there that I can do that will fix this mistake? " or " I take

full responsibility, what has do you perceive my part to have been,

and what may I do to make amends? " or an appropriate variation thereof.

 

The third part is taking action to do whatever must be done.

 

**************

a·mend (ə-měnd') Pronunciation Key

v. a·mend·ed, a·mend·ing, a·mends

 

1. To change for the better; improve

2. To remove the faults or errors in; correct.

 

v. intr.

To better one's conduct; reform.

***************

 

Of course, there is always the possibility for abuse by the unwitted

or by assholes. Calibration is necessary.

 

It's been my experience, however, that in the vast majority of cases,

this drill, applied immediately and with the apprehension of FULL

RESPONSIBILITY, has positive effects, the breadth and width if which

are beyond my ability to list here.

 

From A.A.'s Twelve Steps:

 

Step 8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing

to make amends to them all.

 

Step 9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except

when to do so would injure them or others.

 

Here's a funny thing. Partway through the chapter in the Big Book

where Step 9 is being discussed, and presupposing that the reader has

been taking the actions suggested, is a passage that goes like this:

 

****************

 

If we are painstaking about this phase of our development, we will be

amazed before we are half way through.

 

We are going to know a new freedom and a new happiness.

 

We will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it.

 

We will comprehend the word serenity and we will know peace.

 

No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our

experience can benefit others.

 

That feeling of uselessness and self-pity will disappear.

 

We will lose interest in selfish things and gain interest in our fellows.

 

Self-seeking will slip away.

 

Our whole attitude and outlook upon life will change.

 

Fear of people and of economic insecurity will leave us.

 

We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us.

 

We will suddenly realize that God is doing for us what we could not do

for ourselves.

 

 

 

Are these extravagant promises? We think not.

 

They are being fulfilled among us - sometimes quickly, sometimes slowly.

 

They will always materialize if we work for them.

 

Alcoholics Anonymous p83-84

*****************

 

Note the word " Always " .

 

Note the phrase " Work for them " .

 

Good stuff...

 

The AA framework is, of course, the first 12 Steps on the journey of a

thousand miles.

 

....Or is it the journey to touch the faces of the Gods...

 

-Mark