Guest guest Posted December 22, 2008 Report Share Posted December 22, 2008 I have just posted the below on the 'new' tab of my website. Readers here need to be aware of what some of the members of that guild are doing and selling. Some of their members web site publicity goes way beyond the realms of fair trading. Martin Watt http://www.aromamedical.com ----------- Beware of assuming all members of the Natural Perfumers Guild are credible or honest traders - several are not: http://naturalperfumers.com/. One of their members http://www.profumo.it/ trades in animal extracts banned for importation to the USA and banned in Europe under CITES regulations. Therefore, if you live in the USA and import their animal extracts you could be fined and have your stock impounded. At least 3 other members of that guild make illegal medicinal claims (in the USA) for their products. There is also some evidence that some of their teachers buy and sell synthetic fragrance blends as the real thing. This is mainly due to many of their members being far from the experts their publicity suggests. It is a shame that some of the more respected people in this trade continue to be part of this disreputable organisation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2008 Report Share Posted December 22, 2008 I was going to answer you, Martin, but it's so obvious you have an agenda, and that you desire a back-and-forth with your unfounded allegations. I'll let folks read your post and make their own decisions. I will offer this bit: If this group is the extent of your audience, well, I invite anyone here to write me or any member of the group for clarification on any point. I have never received a stat on a " hit " from anyone who visits your site and clicks to the Guild site. Not once. So, it seems your only readers are here, and they are welcome to contact me. I know the owner and mods of ATFE don't want this to be an angry forum, but a nurturing one, and I respect that. I did compose a response, but I won't clutter up ATFE with it - if anyone desires to read it, email me and I'll send it to you. There is truth in numbers, and a lot of savvy people that I love and choose to align myself with are part of my huge community, so I'm happy with that. Thanks, Martin Watt wrote: > I have just posted the below on the 'new' tab of my website. Readers > here need to be aware of what some of the members of that guild are > doing and selling. Some of their members web site publicity goes way > beyond the realms of fair trading. > Martin Watt > http://www.aromamedical.com -- Sincerely, Anya - perfumes, aromatics, classes, consultation 1600+ member Natural Perfumery group - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2008 Report Share Posted December 22, 2008 I feel it's unfair to cast an entire organization in a poor light based on the behavior of a few members. I dare say that you would find similar unethical behavior in small groups and individuals of any professional organization. Granted, professional organizations do have a responsibility to investigate unethical behaviors and to follow up with whatever legal means are available--but it is unclear that you have reported this behavior to the organization or to any organization that might have stronger legal legs to stand on. We all like to get up on our soap boxes about things that we don't feel are right now and then, but if you really believe there is illegal activity here, why not take some meaningful action??! Meanwhile, because laws vary from one country to another, and because production of some of the rarest essential oils can be and is done ethically and legally, it's important that we know our sources, understand the ethical issues around production of certain oils and support one another to use fair trade oils. We need to give thought to what it means to purchase mill-run, organically grown or wildcrafted essential oils and what our role is in those economies. We also should consider the therapeutic effectiveness of these. Some extremists in this vein might only use essential oils that are native to our own countries and grown in the same region they are being used. While an admirable idea, it would certainly limit the palette of wonderful oils at our fingertips. This would leave me, for instance, with little more than a few pine, cedar and spruce oils currently in production but might help an industry crop up using witch hazel, native mints, ferns, spicebush, sassafras, and a few other aromatic native plants that aren't used at all. An interesting idea, but I'm not holding my breath for that to happen. Let's do keep this forum civil. It may take a few moments to explain your views in such a way that people do not feel attacked, but those moments are worthwhile. We all want to hear one another's opinions and ideas. I love that so many people on this forum have been here long enough and are familiar enough with each other that they share life's little celebrations with everyone. Let's keep that up--and move on! With love and holiday cheer for everyone from snowy New York, Deborah Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 23, 2008 Report Share Posted December 23, 2008 >dare say that you would find similar unethical behavior in small >groups and individuals of any professional organization. Agreed and i am one of a handful of individuals who have exposed their wrong doings over the years. If Anya's group was a democratic organisation I would of course complain to them. I and others know it is not. Everything is censored. It seems most people on oils-herbs and similar groups just do not care that their mails are manipulated, barred or deleted by the groups mods. I care, and that is why I have left all groups but this one. Clearly most people in this trade are lemmings and will follow con artists to the death. Not me. >but it is unclear that you have reported this behavior to the >organization or to any organization that might have stronger legal >legs to stand on. Yes this has been done, but i won't hold my breath for any action. I have given up warning on the newsgroups over many years about the businesses who choose to flout the laws in their own countries. Now instead I will just bounce complaints to the enforcement agencies. > Let's do keep this forum civil. Oh how many times have I heard that over the years! That policy allows the confidence tricksters to continue pulling the wool over the eyes of the majority. Martin ATFE2 , " deborah_layton " <dlayton wrote: > > I feel it's unfair to cast an entire organization in a poor light > based on the behavior of a few members. I dare say that you would > find similar unethical behavior in small groups and individuals of > any professional organization. Granted, professional organizations > do have a responsibility to investigate unethical behaviors and to > follow up with whatever legal means are available--but it is unclear > that you have reported this behavior to the organization or to any > organization that might have stronger legal legs to stand on. We all > like to get up on our soap boxes about things that we don't feel are > right now and then, but if you really believe there is illegal > activity here, why not take some meaningful action??! > > Meanwhile, because laws vary from one country to another, and because > production of some of the rarest essential oils can be and is done > ethically and legally, it's important that we know our sources, > understand the ethical issues around production of certain oils and > support one another to use fair trade oils. We need to give thought > to what it means to purchase mill-run, organically grown or > wildcrafted essential oils and what our role is in those economies. > We also should consider the therapeutic effectiveness of these. Some > extremists in this vein might only use essential oils that are native > to our own countries and grown in the same region they are being > used. While an admirable idea, it would certainly limit the palette > of wonderful oils at our fingertips. This would leave me, for > instance, with little more than a few pine, cedar and spruce oils > currently in production but might help an industry crop up using > witch hazel, native mints, ferns, spicebush, sassafras, and a few > other aromatic native plants that aren't used at all. An interesting > idea, but I'm not holding my breath for that to happen. > > Let's do keep this forum civil. It may take a few moments to explain > your views in such a way that people do not feel attacked, but those > moments are worthwhile. We all want to hear one another's opinions > and ideas. I love that so many people on this forum have been here > long enough and are familiar enough with each other that they share > life's little celebrations with everyone. Let's keep that up--and > move on! > > With love and holiday cheer for everyone from snowy New York, > Deborah Layton > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 23, 2008 Report Share Posted December 23, 2008 >and that you desire a back-and-forth with your unfounded > allegations. OK, so list what allegations I have made that are unfounded. Martin ATFE2 , Perfumes <anya wrote: > > I was going to answer you, Martin, but it's so obvious you have an > agenda, and that you desire a back-and-forth with your unfounded > allegations. I'll let folks read your post and make their own decisions. > I will offer this bit: > > If this group is the extent of your audience, well, I invite anyone here > to write me or any member of the group for clarification on any point. > > I have never received a stat on a " hit " from anyone who visits your site > and clicks to the Guild site. Not once. So, it seems your only readers > are here, and they are welcome to contact me. I know the owner and mods > of ATFE don't want this to be an angry forum, but a nurturing one, and I > respect that. > > I did compose a response, but I won't clutter up ATFE with it - if > anyone desires to read it, email me and I'll send it to you. There is > truth in numbers, and a lot of savvy people that I love and choose to > align myself with are part of my huge community, so I'm happy with that. > > Thanks, > Anya > > Martin Watt wrote: > > I have just posted the below on the 'new' tab of my website. Readers > > here need to be aware of what some of the members of that guild are > > doing and selling. Some of their members web site publicity goes way > > beyond the realms of fair trading. > > Martin Watt > > http://www.aromamedical.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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