RE: Interstitial cystitis and teeth

June 2, 2004

What Gabriele says is very interesting. The 4 lower incisors are linked to

the bladder and kidney meridians. It would be interesting to know if any of

your lower incisors have root fillings. Root fillings are notorious for

harbouring infection and can be the cause of chronic disease.

There is a map of teeth to meridian links on

http://www.integratedhealthpractice.com/lljaw.asp I'm not sure where this

dentist got the map from, but I have seen it in other places. Other info on

this website related to TCM is a bit unreliable.

Susie

Message: 3

> Tue, 01 Jun 2004 09:16:44 -0000

> " heylaurag " <heylaurag

> Re: About Interstitial cystitis...

>

> Hi Gabriele

>

> Thanks for that information. I do in fact have dental problems. I

> smoked in my youth, and one of the ways that I quit was to replace

> the habit of smoking with chewing a lot of gum, thus I wound up with

> a lot of cavities, including a few root canals. But I've been to the

> dentist and from their perspective everything has been taken care of.

>

> Laura

>

June 2, 2004

Yes, if I understand the chart correctly, I do have a root canal

right where the tooth related to kid/UB is. From what I understand

the only option is to have the tooth removed....not a very good

option. Anyone know anything different?

Chinese Medicine , " Susie

Parkinson " <susie@p...> wrote:

> What Gabriele says is very interesting. The 4 lower incisors are

linked to

> the bladder and kidney meridians. It would be interesting to know

if any of

> your lower incisors have root fillings. Root fillings are

notorious for

> harbouring infection and can be the cause of chronic disease.

> There is a map of teeth to meridian links on

> http://www.integratedhealthpractice.com/lljaw.asp I'm not sure

where this

> dentist got the map from, but I have seen it in other places.

Other info on

> this website related to TCM is a bit unreliable.

>

> Susie

>

> Message: 3

> > Tue, 01 Jun 2004 09:16:44 -0000

> > " heylaurag " <heylaurag@h...>

> > Re: About Interstitial cystitis...

> >

> > Hi Gabriele

> >

> > Thanks for that information. I do in fact have dental problems.

I

> > smoked in my youth, and one of the ways that I quit was to replace

> > the habit of smoking with chewing a lot of gum, thus I wound up

with

> > a lot of cavities, including a few root canals. But I've been to

the

> > dentist and from their perspective everything has been taken care

of.

> >

> > Laura

> >

June 2, 2004

There is no basis for the idea in these dental 'meridian' charts that

each tooth relates to a separate channel or part of the body in Chinese

medicine, as far as I know. Perhaps has an idea about the

origin of these ideas, but clearly one should not take them literally

as part of the system of Chinese acupuncture. However, it is true that

the teeth as a whole do relate to the kidney, so that tooth removal can

weaken them in theory.

On Jun 2, 2004, at 7:55 AM, heylaurag wrote:

> Yes, if I understand the chart correctly, I do have a root canal

> right where the tooth related to kid/UB is. From what I understand

> the only option is to have the tooth removed....not a very good

> option. Anyone know anything different?

June 2, 2004

ap locally on tooth?

or micropoint on Dig III, distal phalang

H

2004-06-02 kl. 16.55 skrev heylaurag:

> Yes, if I understand the chart correctly, I do have a root canal

> right where the tooth related to kid/UB is. From what I understand

> the only option is to have the tooth removed....not a very good

> option. Anyone know anything different?

>

June 2, 2004

Its not a very good option to keep the tooth if it is causing your IC is it?

It is well documented that a dentist, in the early part of the 20th Century,

took teeth that had been root filled and placed them under the skin of

rabbits, the rabbits died of the same illnesses that the tooth owner had

had. If a non root filled tooth was put under the skin of a rabbit it was

still alive a year later. I am going to have my 4 lower incisors removed

this year because they were all root filled about 20 years ago. 5 years

after they were root filled I developed tumours on my spinal chord at

C3/4/5. I would rather lose my teeth and try and protect myself, than keep

the teeth. Modern bridges and false teeth are marvellous, its not such a

big deal if it stops/prevents chronic ill health. If I were you Laura, I

would do some research on this, irrespective of whether there is a

connection with meridians directly.

Susie

> Message: 4

> Wed, 02 Jun 2004 14:55:31 -0000

> " heylaurag " <heylaurag

> Re: Interstitial cystitis and teeth

>

> Yes, if I understand the chart correctly, I do have a root canal

> right where the tooth related to kid/UB is. From what I understand

> the only option is to have the tooth removed....not a very good

> option. Anyone know anything different?

>

___________________________

June 2, 2004

I had read that study too, and I was very, very reluctant to get the

most recent root canal that I got. Now I'm thinking that I shouldn't

have.....the thing is, I don't think that the trauma to Ren 4 would

have resulted in interstitial cystitis if I had not already had IC

when I was younger. So I'm really thinking that I should have them

removed. Your story is pretty compelling--and sad. I hope that you

are ok now. What a thing to go through. Do you know what's involved

with having them removed? Do the false teeth/bridges pretty much

stay in place or do you have to take them out and clean them often?

I think its a tough choice for people to make. For me it brings up

thoughts of being elderly and having dentures. I have four root

canals, one on each level. A part of me wants to believe that TCM

can save me from being one of the people that is made ill by the root

canals...but then, maybe I already am!

Chinese Medicine , " Susie

Parkinson " <susie@p...> wrote:

>

> Its not a very good option to keep the tooth if it is causing your

IC is it?

> It is well documented that a dentist, in the early part of the 20th

Century,

> took teeth that had been root filled and placed them under the skin

of

> rabbits, the rabbits died of the same illnesses that the tooth

owner had

> had. If a non root filled tooth was put under the skin of a rabbit

it was

> still alive a year later. I am going to have my 4 lower incisors

removed

> this year because they were all root filled about 20 years ago. 5

years

> after they were root filled I developed tumours on my spinal chord

at

> C3/4/5. I would rather lose my teeth and try and protect myself,

than keep

> the teeth. Modern bridges and false teeth are marvellous, its not

such a

> big deal if it stops/prevents chronic ill health. If I were you

Laura, I

> would do some research on this, irrespective of whether there is a

> connection with meridians directly.

>

> Susie

>

> > Message: 4

> > Wed, 02 Jun 2004 14:55:31 -0000

> > " heylaurag " <heylaurag@h...>

> > Re: Interstitial cystitis and teeth

> >

> > Yes, if I understand the chart correctly, I do have a root canal

> > right where the tooth related to kid/UB is. From what I

understand

> > the only option is to have the tooth removed....not a very good

> > option. Anyone know anything different?

> >

> ___________________________

June 2, 2004

>

> I think its a tough choice for people to make. For me it brings up

> thoughts of being elderly and having dentures. I have four root

> canals, one on each level. A part of me wants to believe that TCM

> can save me from being one of the people that is made ill by the root

> canals...but then, maybe I already am!

guess what

we are dying

all of us

and you can't be saved, sorry

not even with TCM.

TCM may get you even older

so you can have more bridges

Getting a bridge is a sure sign that you're still alive

and if it is just a bridge, you can still dance!

:-)

Holger

June 2, 2004

Hi Laura!

By now you are starting to see that the Ren 4 incident *may possibly* have

had *nothing* to do with the worsening/recurrence of the Interstitial cystitis.

At 05:22 PM 6/2/2004, you wrote:

>I had read that study too, and I was very, very reluctant to get the

>most recent root canal that I got. Now I'm thinking that I shouldn't

>have.....the thing is, I don't think that the trauma to Ren 4 would

>have resulted in interstitial cystitis if I had not already had IC

>when I was younger. <snip>

Regards,

Pete

June 3, 2004

A more pragmatic version of teeth and gum relevance:

Locational:

Upper teeth - LI [LI 19 and 20]

Lower teeth - ST [sT 5 and 6]

4 incisors lower - Ren branch

4 incisors upper - Du [Du 26]

Molars bilateral - ST [sT 7]

Canine bilateral - ST [sT 4]

Bicuspids bilateral - SI [track between last two points]

Origin:

Associated with K, as born of Bone

Associated with LU, as color is white

By 5 E bonds:

LU nurtures [white color]

SP erodes [sweets causing caries]

Can't think of anything else.

Dr. Holmes Keikobad

MB BS DPH Ret. DIP AC NCCAOM LIC AC CO & AZ

www.acu-free.com - 15 CEUS by video.

NCCAOM reviewed. Approved in CA & most states.

June 3, 2004

Years ago I had what I call " the tooth from hell " . It had a calcified root

and was done 3 times and eventually lost. The area has never felt right

although I never gave it much thought until recently. I had facial pain and

eventually discovered I had an abscess 2 spaces forward and above the gap

that reminds me of the tooth I lost. I reluctantly went to the dentist and

he informed me I needed a root canal. I told him to pull the tooth and he

told me that would be a bad thing to do.

This answer doesn't make sense to me. It would seem that if I am still

having problems in the same area, its not the tooth, its internal. It's

right on LI 19!

I have tried acupuncture and NAET for this and although the infection has

gone down some, its uncomfortable and I feel like I have an infection.

Reluctantly, I went to the local dental school's faculty practice and spoke

to the professors there. His explanation was that the root is dead and is

feeding this infection and it will continue to feed it until the root is

extracted. I told him to just pull the tooth and he said that it would not

be a good idea because it still holds the sinuses and nerves in place and

although implants and dentures are not horrible, they do not perform these

tasks as well as the real thing.

My conclusion is that I will go get the root canal tomorrow since all the

choices are bad, I am choosing the least bad. I will work in that channel

and try to find the root of the problem after the infection and tooth are

taken care of.

Unless anyone has any better ideas! Oh how I hate the dentist!

----Original Message-----

heylaurag [heylaurag]

Wednesday, June 02, 2004 5:22 PM

Chinese Medicine

Re: Interstitial cystitis and teeth