Digest Number 948

[Guest guest]

The Astragalus monograph from American Herbal Pharmacopoeia lists a

couple of animal studies that deal with its effect on the heart. One

reports " a mild hypotensive effect occurred following iv administration

of an undefined astragalus preparation to anesthetized rats. The

magnitude of hypotensive effect was reported to be qualitative and

quantitative although exact decline in BP was not reported. "

Another study says " Dose-dependent inotropic effects on coronary flow

have also been reported for saponin fractions of astragalus. Extracts

were shown to exhibit a negative inotropic effect on the working hearts

of rats at 30 micrograms/mL and a positive inotropic effect at

concentrations of 50-200 micrograms/mL. The authors suggested that the

inotropic action was due to a modulation of Na/K ATPase and worked in a

manner similar to strophonthin K (0.75 micrograms/mL). "

 

Perhaps someone who knows more about heart physiology can tell us if a

drug or herb makes the heart have more efficient contractions if that

will lower the blood pressure.

 

Another study said that the " use of astragalus was reported to be

superior to the use of the calcium channel blocker verapamil and the

corticosteroid dexamethasone in the treatment of acute viral

mycarditis. "

 

Yet another study says that Astragalus can break down freshly formed

clots.

 

 

Colleen

 

 

 

Message: 1

Thu, 28 Mar 2002 15:35:25 -0000

" pemachophel2001 " <pemachophel2001

Astragalus & hypertension

 

All,

 

Recently I was talking with a Chinese doctor trained in Chengdu.

Seemed pretty knowledgable. Definitely was into pattern discrimination

and was not into disease-based prescribing. We were talking about qi

vacuity hypertension. I have never seen a case of a pure qi vacuity

hypertension. However, there can be a liver-spleen disharmony with

depressive heat, can be a heart-gallbladder qi timidity with or

without depressive heat, can be a qi and yin vacuity, can be a spleen

qi vacuity with phlegm turbidity. In any case, she uses Radix

Astragali Membranacei (Huang Qi) to treat the qi vacuity part of these

mixed vacuity/repletion patterns if the patient is fatigued as one of

their symptoms.

 

Ok, that did not surprise me. I have seen other Chinese doctors also

use Huang Qi for/with hypertension in qi vacuity patients, and there

are a number of hypertension protocols in the Chinese research

literature that include Huang Qi. The thing that I would like to ask

others on this discussion group is this: According to this young woman

(at least she was younger than me), Huang Qi raises the BP if used in

amounts of less than 30g p.d. but lowers the BP when used at 30g and

more (up to 60g p.d.). Has anyone else ever heard/read this? Does

anyone have any experience with this? If this is true, it seems like

an important thing to know. In my personal experience, other Chinese

docs I have worked with have used 15g p.d. for the qi vacuity

component of hypertension.

 

Bob

[Guest guest]

Colleen,

This is interesting and reminds me that I need to read

the Blue Poppy monographs on hypertension.

What do we know about the effects of ACE inhibitors

(Zestril, Ramipril) and calcium channel blockers? I hear from my

patients that ACE inhibitors have some side effects, e.g., itchy hives

on the upper chest and back, cough and phlegm blockage in the throat at

night. I see quite a few on b.p. medications; while I don't like

what I hear and feel, they are very apprehensive about trying herbs.

It's a little scary for me, too.

Frances

Colleen Morris wrote:

The Astragalus monograph

from American Herbal Pharmacopoeia lists a

couple of animal studies that deal with its effect

on the heart. One

reports "a mild hypotensive effect occurred following

iv administration

of an undefined astragalus preparation to anesthetized

rats. The

magnitude of hypotensive effect was reported to be

qualitative and

quantitative although exact decline in BP was not

reported."

Another study says "Dose-dependent inotropic effects

on coronary flow

have also been reported for saponin fractions of

astragalus. Extracts

were shown to exhibit a negative inotropic effect

on the working hearts

of rats at 30 micrograms/mL and a positive inotropic

effect at

concentrations of 50-200 micrograms/mL. The authors

suggested that the

inotropic action was due to a modulation of Na/K

ATPase and worked in a

manner similar to strophonthin K (0.75 micrograms/mL).

"

Perhaps someone who knows more about heart physiology

can tell us if a

drug or herb makes the heart have more efficient

contractions if that

will lower the blood pressure.

Another study said that the "use of astragalus was

reported to be

superior to the use of the calcium channel blocker

verapamil and the

corticosteroid dexamethasone in the treatment of

acute viral

mycarditis."

Yet another study says that Astragalus can break down

freshly formed

clots.

 

Colleen

 

 

Message: 1

Thu, 28 Mar 2002 15:35:25 -0000

"pemachophel2001" <pemachophel2001

Astragalus & hypertension

All,

Recently I was talking with a Chinese doctor trained

in Chengdu.

Seemed pretty knowledgable. Definitely was into pattern

discrimination

and was not into disease-based prescribing. We were

talking about qi

vacuity hypertension. I have never seen a case of

a pure qi vacuity

hypertension. However, there can be a liver-spleen

disharmony with

depressive heat, can be a heart-gallbladder qi timidity

with or

without depressive heat, can be a qi and yin vacuity,

can be a spleen

qi vacuity with phlegm turbidity. In any case, she

uses Radix

Astragali Membranacei (Huang Qi) to treat the qi

vacuity part of these

mixed vacuity/repletion patterns if the patient is

fatigued as one of

their symptoms.

Ok, that did not surprise me. I have seen other Chinese

doctors also

use Huang Qi for/with hypertension in qi vacuity

patients, and there

are a number of hypertension protocols in the Chinese

research

literature that include Huang Qi. The thing that

I would like to ask

others on this discussion group is this: According

to this young woman

(at least she was younger than me), Huang Qi raises

the BP if used in

amounts of less than 30g p.d. but lowers the BP when

used at 30g and

more (up to 60g p.d.). Has anyone else ever heard/read

this? Does

anyone have any experience with this? If this is

true, it seems like

an important thing to know. In my personal experience,

other Chinese

docs I have worked with have used 15g p.d. for the

qi vacuity

component of hypertension.

Bob

 

 

 

 

 

Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization

of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate

academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of

professional services, including board approved online continuing education.

 

 

[Guest guest]

, " Colleen Morris " <colleen@d...> wrote:

 

> Perhaps someone who knows more about heart physiology can tell us

if a

> drug or herb makes the heart have more efficient contractions if

that

> will lower the blood pressure.

>

>

 

Colleen:

 

Digitalis, the prototype inotropic agent in Western pharmacology will

decrease heart rate in patients with atrial fibrillation and possibly

do the same in patients with congestive heart failure. Theoretically

it has no effect on heart rate, resting BP or exercise BP in patients

in normal sinus rhythm. (American College of Sports Medicine)

 

The reason is that BP is a product of cardiac output (heart rate X

stroke volume) and peripheral vascular resistance. With only stroke

volume being effected by the inotropic agent, the other variables

will be intrinsically regulated to maintain homeostasis. In the

absence of this intrinsic regulation, the BP would increase.

 

Further, the Western treatment of hypertension focuses primarily on

reduction of peripheral vascular resistance. All the major catagories

of antihypertensive medications focus on reducing peripheral

resistance rather than on cardiac output. Most focus on vasodilation

(ACE inhibitors, angiotensin receptor antagonists, calcium channel

blockers, and alpha blockers). Others reduce resistance by other

mechanisms (diuretics by reducing total fluid volume). Only beta

blockers focus on cardiac output - and they reduce it, actually a

negative inotropic effect.

 

It also seems that the reductions in BP that occur with exercise

training and weight loss are as a result of reduction of peripheral

resistance, not increases in cardiac output.

 

Therefore the mechanism of lower blood pressure cannot be attributed

to the positive inotropic effect nor can one expect that a positive

inotropic agent will reduce blood pressure...at least not by virtue

of the inotropic effect.

 

Hope that is helpful.

 

Mike Buyze

(Former Cardiac Rehab Exercise Physiologist)

[Guest guest]

At 08:51 AM 8/1/03 +0000, you wrote:

>Yes, I would be interested in this information also , as I have a large

>amount of the tea tree, also, clove bud. I have kept it in a closed

>cupboard, but I do not think I will be using it all up any time soon. It's

>in metal cans. (came in).

 

 

I would do two things...

 

1. decant it into colored glass

 

2. top it off with nitrogen... that will totally prevent oxidation...since

the oxygen in the air has no contact with the oil.

 

 

 

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