Mai Men Dong Tang-dosage variation--one additional thought

[Guest guest]

I had another thought relative to " Chen and Chen's comments on the use of the

Dui Yao--Mai Men Dong and Ban Xia:  In Bensky and Barolet's commentary on the

formula Bei Mu Gua Lou San, they say, " This formula can be regarded as a

variation of Er Chen Tang with the substitution of herbs that moisten and

transform phlegm, such as Bei Mu and  Tian Hua Fen for the acrid warming Ban

Xia "

 

But based upon Chen and Chen's comments, why not just use a large dose of Mai

Men Dong (or for that matter larger doses of Chuan Bei Mu, Gua Lou and/or Tian

Hua Fen and still use Ban Xia?)

 

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--- On Sun, 12/21/08, wrote:

 

 

Mai Men Dong Tang-dosage variation

" TCM " <Chinese Traditional Medicine >,

Traditional Chinese Herbal Medicine

Sunday, December 21, 2008, 12:48 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear collegues,

 

Last week I received the new Chen and Chen " Chinese Herbal Formulas and

Applications. "   It's quite a book--all 1600+ pages of it!    It is very readable

and covers formulas that heretofore I was not aware of.  As with their earlier

book,  " Chinese Medical Herbology and Pharmacology, "   the is extensive biomedical

research and application as well.   

 

Specifically, I happened to notice that on the listing of ingredients and

dosages for Mai Men Dong Tang, they list a dosages of 60-70g of Mai Men Dong and

10-18g of Ban Xia.  In the section of Author's comments they explain, " Because

Mai Dong is mild in potency, a large amount (60-70g) is needed or the effects

will not be realized. "   Has anyone heard of this before?

 

To compare: in Bensky and Barolet the doses listed are:15-18g and 4.5-9g

respectively, (though they mention in their analysis that " some sources

recommend a doseage of as much as 45 g of this herb " ).

                 In Yeung  the doses listed are:  15-20g and 6-9g

respectively,        

In Wiseman and Ellis the doses listed are:    9-18g and 5-6g       "

       and in Maciocia  the doses listed are:       60g and   9g        "

 

Obviously there are differences of opinion as to whether MMD is effective only

in larger doses in cases of vacuity.  Chen and Chen also point out that the

relatively large dose of Ban Xia ( which no one else mentions!) serves as a

check and balance with Mai Men Dong, to quote them, " These two herbs also

provide mutual checks and balances, as MMD controls the drying nature of

BX while BX checks the cloying nature of MMD. "

 

Comments?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I had another thought relative to " Chen and Chen's comments on the use of the

Dui Yao--Mai Men Dong and Ban Xia:  In Bensky and Barolet's commentary on the

formula Bei Mu Gua Lou San, they say, " This formula can be regarded as a

variation of Er Chen Tang with the substitution of herbs that moisten and

transform phlegm, such as Bei Mu and  Tian Hua Fen for the acrid warming Ban

Xia "

 

But based upon Chen and Chen's comments, why not just use a large dose of Mai

Men Dong (or for that matter larger doses of Chuan Bei Mu, Gua Lou and/or Tian

Hua Fen and still use Ban Xia?)

 

                                                                                \

                                                                                \

                                                                                \

                                      

 

 

 

 

--- On Sun, 12/21/08, wrote:

 

 

Mai Men Dong Tang-dosage variation

" TCM " <Chinese Traditional Medicine >,

Traditional Chinese Herbal Medicine

Sunday, December 21, 2008, 12:48 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear collegues,

 

Last week I received the new Chen and Chen " Chinese Herbal Formulas and

Applications. "   It's quite a book--all 1600+ pages of it!    It is very readable

and covers formulas that heretofore I was not aware of.  As with their earlier

book,  " Chinese Medical Herbology and Pharmacology, "   the is extensive biomedical

research and application as well.   

 

Specifically, I happened to notice that on the listing of ingredients and

dosages for Mai Men Dong Tang, they list a dosages of 60-70g of Mai Men Dong and

10-18g of Ban Xia.  In the section of Author's comments they explain, " Because

Mai Dong is mild in potency, a large amount (60-70g) is needed or the effects

will not be realized. "   Has anyone heard of this before?

 

To compare: in Bensky and Barolet the doses listed are:15-18g and 4.5-9g

respectively, (though they mention in their analysis that " some sources

recommend a doseage of as much as 45 g of this herb " ).

                 In Yeung  the doses listed are:  15-20g and 6-9g

respectively,        

In Wiseman and Ellis the doses listed are:    9-18g and 5-6g       "

       and in Maciocia  the doses listed are:       60g and   9g        "

 

Obviously there are differences of opinion as to whether MMD is effective only

in larger doses in cases of vacuity.  Chen and Chen also point out that the

relatively large dose of Ban Xia ( which no one else mentions!) serves as a

check and balance with Mai Men Dong, to quote them, " These two herbs also

provide mutual checks and balances, as MMD controls the drying nature of

BX while BX checks the cloying nature of MMD. "

 

Comments?