First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

[Guest guest]

Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

 

Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

they have no license value in California???

**********************************************************************

 

 

At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on " ACAOM

February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

 

Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions for

allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take classes

to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have yet to be

determined).

 

You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the Professional

Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

[Guest guest]

So then what's the difference between a Masters level and a Phd? Will the

Phd's get to make Western diagnoses? LOL.

 

 

 

 

 

-

" ValerieH " <hobbs.valeriehobbs

<Chinese Medicine >

Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:25 AM

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

> There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change

> with an advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards

> can be developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs

> can be developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before

> we will see what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments

> and students seeking degrees)

>

> We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether

> it is desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure

> criteria changes. There are models of professions that did not change

> entry level licensure criteria when they created optional advanced

> degrees. Why are we buying into some " either/or " philosophy?

>

> Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

>

> Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

> <singlewhip2001 wrote:

>>

>> Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

>>

>> Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

>> like California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

>> agreeing they have no license value in California???

>> **********************************************************************

>>

>>

>> At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

>> Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

>> standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

>> " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

>>

>> Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

>> provisions for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental

>> Medicine to take classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree

>> (these details have yet to be determined).

>>

>> You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

>> Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

>>

>

>

>

>

> ---

>

> Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times

> http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com

>

> Help build the world's largest online encyclopedia for Chinese medicine

> and acupuncture, click, http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/wiki/CMTpedia

>

>

> and adjust

> accordingly.

>

> Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group

> requires prior permission from the author.

>

> Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely

> necessary.

[Guest guest]

Yes I do.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

Chinese Medicine

singlewhip2001

Wed, 10 Mar 2010 00:45:47 +0000

First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

 

 

 

Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

they have no license value in California???

 

**********************************************************************

 

 

 

At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on " ACAOM

February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

 

 

 

Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions for

allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take classes

to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have yet to be

determined).

 

 

 

You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the Professional

Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

_______________

Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.

http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/

 

 

[Guest guest]

David,

why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

 

as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

 

Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

limitation or mandate,

but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

after the FPD programs start running.

 

K

 

 

 

 

 

On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

 

>

>

> Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

>

> Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

> California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

> they have no license value in California???

> **********************************************************************

>

> At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

> Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

> standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

> " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

>

> Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions

> for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take

> classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have

> yet to be determined).

>

> You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

> Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

>

>

>

 

 

 

--

 

 

""

 

 

www.tcmreview.com

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi John:

 

If CA Board does it then its a mandate, the legal requirement.

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , <johnkokko

wrote:

>

> David,

> why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

> It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

>

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

>

> as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

>

> Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

> limitation or mandate,

> but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

> after the FPD programs start running.

>

> K

>

>

>

>

>

> On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

> >

> > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

> > California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

> > they have no license value in California???

> > **********************************************************************

> >

> > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

> > Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

> > standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

> > " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

> >

> > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions

> > for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take

> > classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have

> > yet to be determined).

> >

> > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

> > Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

> --

>

>

> ""

>

>

> www.tcmreview.com

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I am also interested in looking at which schools with a current DAOM will pick

up the FPD or how it will change their program offerings.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

> Chinese Medicine

> johnkokko

> Thu, 11 Mar 2010 00:16:31 -0800

> Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

>

> David,

> why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

> It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

>

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

>

> as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

>

> Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

> limitation or mandate,

> but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

> after the FPD programs start running.

>

> K

>

>

>

>

>

> On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001

<singlewhip2001wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

> >

> > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

> > California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

> > they have no license value in California???

> > **********************************************************************

> >

> > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

> > Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

> > standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

> > " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

> >

> > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions

> > for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take

> > classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have

> > yet to be determined).

> >

> > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

> > Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

> --

>

>

> ""

>

>

> www.tcmreview.com

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Michael:

 

Isn't the goal to move to one degree, FPD, and have the licensing agencies match

it? There will be no choices.

 

So what will happen with the thousands of licensed practitioners? Will they have

to go back to school, get grandfathered in,etc.??? Anybody know the plan. I do

not believe licensing agencies can take away a license.

 

Any thoughts?

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , mike Bowser

<naturaldoc1 wrote:

>

>

> I am also interested in looking at which schools with a current DAOM will pick

up the FPD or how it will change their program offerings.

>

> Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

>

>

>

> > Chinese Medicine

> > johnkokko

> > Thu, 11 Mar 2010 00:16:31 -0800

> > Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

> >

> > David,

> > why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

> > It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

> >

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

> >

> > as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

> >

> > Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

> > limitation or mandate,

> > but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

> > after the FPD programs start running.

> >

> > K

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

> >

> > >

> > >

> > > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

> > >

> > > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

like

> > > California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

agreeing

> > > they have no license value in California???

> > > **********************************************************************

> > >

> > > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

> > > Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

> > > standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

> > > " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

> > >

> > > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

provisions

> > > for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to

take

> > > classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have

> > > yet to be determined).

> > >

> > > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

> > > Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> >

> >

> > ""

> >

> >

> > www.tcmreview.com

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change with an

advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards can be

developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs can be

developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before we will see

what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments and students seeking

degrees)

 

We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether it is

desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure criteria changes.

There are models of professions that did not change entry level licensure

criteria when they created optional advanced degrees. Why are we buying into

some " either/or " philosophy?

 

Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

 

Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001 wrote:

>

> Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

>

> Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

they have no license value in California???

> **********************************************************************

>

>

> At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on " ACAOM

February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

>

> Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions

for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take

classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have yet to

be determined).

>

> You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

>

[Guest guest]

David,

If the CA board approves of this, then it would be a green light for schools

to have the OPTION.

This is different from enforcing all schools to have the FPD in place.

 

K

 

On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 9:52 AM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

 

>

>

> Hi John:

>

> If CA Board does it then its a mandate, the legal requirement.

>

>

> --- In

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>,

> <johnkokko wrote:

> >

> > David,

> > why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

> > It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

> >

>

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

> >

> > as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

> >

> > Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

> > limitation or mandate,

> > but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

> > after the FPD programs start running.

> >

> > K

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

>

>

> >

> > >

> > >

> > > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

> > >

> > > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

> like

> > > California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

> agreeing

> > > they have no license value in California???

> > > **********************************************************************

> > >

> > > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture

> and

> > > Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with

> developing

> > > standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

> > > " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

> > >

> > > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

> provisions

> > > for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to

> take

> > > classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details

> have

> > > yet to be determined).

> > >

> > > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

> > > Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> >

> >

> > ""

> >

> >

> > www.tcmreview.com

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Nursing is not a good example for comparison. I would think that PT would be a

better comparison. We are forgetting that the non-Asian members (US) of the

profession are not a majority worldwide, whereas it appears that the Asian

membership is seeking the FPD. We need to seriously consider that this issue

may lead to fragmentation of our profession and a major step backwards. Also

keep in mind that CA was able to get a lot of political clout to create a better

acupuncture law because of the Asian community.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

hobbs.valeriehobbs

Thu, 11 Mar 2010 17:25:11 +0000

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change

with an advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards can

be developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs can be

developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before we will see

what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments and students seeking

degrees)

 

 

 

We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether it is

desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure criteria changes.

There are models of professions that did not change entry level licensure

criteria when they created optional advanced degrees. Why are we buying into

some " either/or " philosophy?

 

 

 

Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001 wrote:

 

>

 

> Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

 

>

 

> Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

they have no license value in California???

 

> **********************************************************************

 

>

 

>

 

> At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on " ACAOM

February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

 

>

 

> Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions

for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take

classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have yet to

be determined).

 

>

 

> You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

 

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

_______________

Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.

http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/

 

 

[Guest guest]

I also wonder if they plan to petition to have a separate licensing designation

that matches up with education, as Licensed Acupuncturist is a technician title

and not really keeping with what we are.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

> Chinese Medicine

> johnkokko

> Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:45:24 -0600

> Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

>

> David,

> If the CA board approves of this, then it would be a green light for schools

> to have the OPTION.

> This is different from enforcing all schools to have the FPD in place.

>

> K

>

> On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 9:52 AM, singlewhip2001

<singlewhip2001wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Hi John:

> >

> > If CA Board does it then its a mandate, the legal requirement.

> >

> >

> > --- In

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>,

> > <johnkokko wrote:

> > >

> > > David,

> > > why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

> > > It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

> > >

> >

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

> > >

> > > as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

> > >

> > > Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

> > > limitation or mandate,

> > > but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

> > > after the FPD programs start running.

> > >

> > > K

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

> >

> >

> > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

> > > >

> > > > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

> > like

> > > > California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

> > agreeing

> > > > they have no license value in California???

> > > > **********************************************************************

> > > >

> > > > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture

> > and

> > > > Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with

> > developing

> > > > standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

> > > > " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

> > > >

> > > > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

> > provisions

> > > > for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to

> > take

> > > > classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details

> > have

> > > > yet to be determined).

> > > >

> > > > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

> > > > Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --

> > >

> > >

> > > ""

> > >

> > >

> > > www.tcmreview.com

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

In the near future, we can co-exist and have a two tiered profession. We simply

license the newbies as having a FPD, according to new state statutes, and we are

fine. The issue should not be either or but how do we go about doing it right

and when do we.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

singlewhip2001

Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:32:39 +0000

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Michael:

 

 

 

Isn't the goal to move to one degree, FPD, and have the licensing agencies match

it? There will be no choices.

 

 

 

So what will happen with the thousands of licensed practitioners? Will they have

to go back to school, get grandfathered in,etc.??? Anybody know the plan. I do

not believe licensing agencies can take away a license.

 

 

 

Any thoughts?

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , mike Bowser

<naturaldoc1 wrote:

 

>

 

>

 

> I am also interested in looking at which schools with a current DAOM will pick

up the FPD or how it will change their program offerings.

 

>

 

> Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> > Chinese Medicine

 

> > johnkokko

 

> > Thu, 11 Mar 2010 00:16:31 -0800

 

> > Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

> >

 

> > David,

 

> > why would the CA acupuncture board not agree?

 

> > It has been endorsed by ACAOM (the national accreditation commission)

 

> >

http://www.acaom.org/PdfVersion/ACAOM%20First%20Professional%20Doctoral%20Standa\

rds%2010.pdf

 

> >

 

> > as well as AAAOM and CSOMA.

 

> >

 

> > Schools have the choice to go with the FPD or not, it's a CHOICE, not a

 

> > limitation or mandate,

 

> > but I'm interested to see what the licensure testing will look like in CA

 

> > after the FPD programs start running.

 

> >

 

> > K

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 4:45 PM, singlewhip2001 <singlewhip2001wrote:

 

> >

 

> > >

 

> > >

 

> > > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

 

> > >

 

> > > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

like

 

> > > California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

agreeing

 

> > > they have no license value in California???

 

> > > **********************************************************************

 

> > >

 

> > > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

 

> > > Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

 

> > > standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

 

> > > " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

 

> > >

 

> > > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

provisions

 

> > > for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to

take

 

> > > classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have

 

> > > yet to be determined).

 

> > >

 

> > > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

 

> > > Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

 

> > >

 

> > >

 

> > >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > --

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > ""

 

> >

 

> >

 

> > www.tcmreview.com

 

> >

 

> >

 

> >

[Guest guest]

John:

 

I think we should look at what appears to be the strategic objective, this

movement seems to be moving to one degree, a doctor degree, this will be the

entry level and the licensing level IMHO, how and when they get their I don't

know, but this appears to be the goal.

 

David

[Guest guest]

Whose strategic objective is it to change licensing requirements?

 

Valerie

 

Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001 wrote:

>

> John:

>

> I think we should look at what appears to be the strategic objective, this

movement seems to be moving to one degree, a doctor degree, this will be the

entry level and the licensing level IMHO, how and when they get their I don't

know, but this appears to be the goal.

>

> David

>

[Guest guest]

The supporters of the " First Professional Doctorate Degree " , we already have a

DAOM, why the need for this new degree if not to replace the Masters? They will

lobby for this to be the new standard for licensing.

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " ValerieH "

<hobbs.valeriehobbs wrote:

>

> Whose strategic objective is it to change licensing requirements?

>

> Valerie

>

> Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001@> wrote:

> >

> > John:

> >

> > I think we should look at what appears to be the strategic objective, this

movement seems to be moving to one degree, a doctor degree, this will be the

entry level and the licensing level IMHO, how and when they get their I don't

know, but this appears to be the goal.

> >

> > David

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Michael

 

Do tell what the current program is equivalent to in your opinion?

 

By many who count......it is WAY passed even a PhD at least in terms of

college credits or clock hours.

 

60 college credits to get into an acupuncture school and by today's

so-called Masters program another 200 credits (3,000 hours divided by the

standard 15 hrs per credit). That TOTALS 260 credits.

 

BS = 120 to 128 credits

MS = 32

PhD = 32

Totals approximately 192 credits

 

So we are apparently ALREADY completing 68 college credits BEYOND a PhD.

 

Hmmmmmmmm.....I know you will have something interesting to contradict

these FACTS.

 

Oh...and by the way......WHERE is ACAOM's CONSENSUS on the FPD?

How are they pushing the FPD through without CONSENSUS?

They NEED to PROVE the CONSENSUS.

 

I am sure Mr Dort Bigg (ED of ACAOM) can shed some light..... if he is

still within lurking distance.

 

Richard

 

 

 

In a message dated 3/12/2010 9:53:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

naturaldoc1 writes:

 

Not sure where this misinfo is coming from. We are not talking about a

PhD but more then likely a clinical doctorate. I am sure that there will be

more western medicine in an expanded education, like a doctorate (similar

to the DAOM programs I would hope). Your ability to utilize western medical

theory is limited by your state laws. For example, the chiropractors

rely upon orthopedic and neurological exams, which are also part of western

medicine. It is how you use them that matters. So, the big difference is

more knowledge and hopefully more rigor in the curriculum. We tend to covet

the foreign trained practitioners for their expanded knowledge base in both

WM and CM, so now it is up to us to become better.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Michael

 

This BS -> MS -> PhD is also te common route here in the US.

Sure there is no discussion because no one wants to address the pink

elephant....(all the credits & hours which already exist).

As to the OM profession - its all over the place requiring 60 credits from

a regionally accredited institution to GET INTO a school but what one comes

out with is utter nonsense as far as a degree title..... which is not

recognized by the regional accreditation system overall.

Yes....the so-called Masters is WAY to bloated for what it should have

been.

Swap out what is dropped out with what would make it an FPD and guess what?

No increase in overall hours.

If you haven't been paying attention most schools are already upwards

around 3200 hours.

Way more than enough for the FPD.

 

Richard

 

 

 

 

In a message dated 3/12/2010 11:32:21 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

naturaldoc1 writes:

 

 

Richard,

 

Not sure what " current program " you are talking about as we do not yet

have any FPD in operation. Are you asking about the FPD? Not sure that your

numbers are relevant as the OM profession tends to create its own separate

educational reality.

 

BTW, there is no discussion of going this route (BS > MS > PhD), that I

recall. Even though this is the common route in China and possibly in

Korea.

 

I see no real issue with adding in a few more classroom hours, more

clinical internship and adjusting the Master's to become a doctorate. I agree

that the master's is way too bloated as such. Would also like to see more

rigor in the courses and a higher educational requirement for entry. That is

just me, though.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

CC: habeas_1

acudoc11

Fri, 12 Mar 2010 10:03:14 -0500

Re: Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Michael

 

 

 

Do tell what the current program is equivalent to in your opinion?

 

 

 

By many who count......it is WAY passed even a PhD at least in terms of

 

college credits or clock hours.

 

 

 

60 college credits to get into an acupuncture school and by today's

 

so-called Masters program another 200 credits (3,000 hours divided by the

 

standard 15 hrs per credit). That TOTALS 260 credits.

 

 

 

BS = 120 to 128 credits

 

MS = 32

 

PhD = 32

 

Totals approximately 192 credits

 

 

 

So we are apparently ALREADY completing 68 college credits BEYOND a PhD.

 

 

 

Hmmmmmmmm.....I know you will have something interesting to contradict

 

these FACTS.

 

 

 

Oh...and by the way......WHERE is ACAOM's CONSENSUS on the FPD?

 

How are they pushing the FPD through without CONSENSUS?

 

They NEED to PROVE the CONSENSUS.

 

 

 

I am sure Mr Dort Bigg (ED of ACAOM) can shed some light..... if he is

 

still within lurking distance.

 

 

 

Richard

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In a message dated 3/12/2010 9:53:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

 

naturaldoc1 writes:

 

 

 

Not sure where this misinfo is coming from. We are not talking about a

 

PhD but more then likely a clinical doctorate. I am sure that there

will be

 

more western medicine in an expanded education, like a doctorate (similar

 

to the DAOM programs I would hope). Your ability to utilize western

medical

 

theory is limited by your state laws. For example, the chiropractors

 

rely upon orthopedic and neurological exams, which are also part of

western

 

medicine. It is how you use them that matters. So, the big difference

is

 

more knowledge and hopefully more rigor in the curriculum. We tend to

covet

 

the foreign trained practitioners for their expanded knowledge base in

both

 

WM and CM, so now it is up to us to become better.

 

 

 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times

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[Guest guest]

David

 

I believe you are correct.

And I STILL want to know WHERE is the CONSENSUS.

Mr. Bigg.....you out there to comment?

 

Richard

 

 

In a message dated 3/12/2010 11:39:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

singlewhip2001 writes:

 

 

 

 

Hi Richard:

 

I think your point is critical to understand and maybe most people do not

understand.

 

My understanding is ACOM is not pursuing the FDP, nor did it pursue the

DAOM. Its role is to review proposals, to see if they meet the standards for

a degree. It is others in our profession that initiate the process of

review and approval by ACOM. It is AAAOM and others that initiate the process

and in a sense control the process.

 

If my understanding is not correct can someone clarify?

 

thanks,

david

 

_Traditional_Traditional_<WBRTraditional_Tra_

(Chinese Medicine ) , acudoc11 wrote:

>

> Michael

>

> Do tell what the current program is equivalent to in your opinion?

>

> By many who count......it is WAY passed even a PhD at least in terms of

> college credits or clock hours.

>

> 60 college credits to get into an acupuncture school and by today's

> so-called Masters program another 200 credits (3,000 hours divided by

the

> standard 15 hrs per credit). That TOTALS 260 credits.

>

> BS = 120 to 128 credits

> MS = 32

> PhD = 32

> Totals approximately 192 credits

>

> So we are apparently ALREADY completing 68 college credits BEYOND a PhD.

>

> Hmmmmmmmm... Hmmmmmmmm...<WBR>..I know you will have something interest

> these FACTS.

>

> Oh...and by the way......WHERE is ACAOM's CONSENSUS on the FPD?

> How are they pushing the FPD through without CONSENSUS?

> They NEED to PROVE the CONSENSUS.

>

> I am sure Mr Dort Bigg (ED of ACAOM) can shed some light..... if he is

> still within lurking distance.

>

> Richard

>

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

It makes sense to have a doctorate, as we are independent providers and act as

doctors. It also makes sense to have an FPD as we need to have a licensing

designation that reflects our education. LAc is a technician and therefore

inappropriate for a doctor. Lastly, it simplifies and reduces the designations

that follow ones name. I routinely notice that many practitioners will post all

of their education and licensing designations making for a long read. Please

note how long and unwieldy it looks when one uses all these different

designations.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, MTOM, BS (zoology), HHP, LAc, Dipl Ac (NCCAOM)

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

singlewhip2001

Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:36:26 +0000

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The supporters of the " First Professional Doctorate Degree " , we already

have a DAOM, why the need for this new degree if not to replace the Masters?

They will lobby for this to be the new standard for licensing.

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " ValerieH "

<hobbs.valeriehobbs wrote:

 

>

 

> Whose strategic objective is it to change licensing requirements?

 

>

 

> Valerie

 

>

 

> Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001@> wrote:

 

> >

 

> > John:

 

> >

 

> > I think we should look at what appears to be the strategic objective, this

movement seems to be moving to one degree, a doctor degree, this will be the

entry level and the licensing level IMHO, how and when they get their I don't

know, but this appears to be the goal.

 

> >

 

> > David

 

> >

 

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

_______________

Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your

inbox.

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-US:WM_HMP:032010_2

 

 

[Guest guest]

M,

 

Not sure where this misinfo is coming from. We are not talking about a PhD but

more then likely a clinical doctorate. I am sure that there will be more

western medicine in an expanded education, like a doctorate (similar to the DAOM

programs I would hope). Your ability to utilize western medical theory is

limited by your state laws. For example, the chiropractors rely upon orthopedic

and neurological exams, which are also part of western medicine. It is how you

use them that matters. So, the big difference is more knowledge and hopefully

more rigor in the curriculum. We tend to covet the foreign trained

practitioners for their expanded knowledge base in both WM and CM, so now it is

up to us to become better.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

Chinese Medicine

magisterium_magnum

Wed, 10 Mar 2010 13:27:54 -0800

Re: Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So then what's the difference between a Masters level and a Phd? Will the

 

Phd's get to make Western diagnoses? LOL.

 

 

 

-

 

" ValerieH " <hobbs.valeriehobbs

 

<Chinese Medicine >

 

Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:25 AM

 

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

> There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change

 

> with an advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards

 

> can be developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs

 

> can be developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before

 

> we will see what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments

 

> and students seeking degrees)

 

>

 

> We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether

 

> it is desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure

 

> criteria changes. There are models of professions that did not change

 

> entry level licensure criteria when they created optional advanced

 

> degrees. Why are we buying into some " either/or " philosophy?

 

>

 

> Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

 

>

 

> Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

 

> <singlewhip2001 wrote:

 

>>

 

>> Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

 

>>

 

>> Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

 

>> like California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

 

>> agreeing they have no license value in California???

 

>> **********************************************************************

 

>>

 

>>

 

>> At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

 

>> Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

 

>> standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

 

>> " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

 

>>

 

>> Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

 

>> provisions for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental

 

>> Medicine to take classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree

 

>> (these details have yet to be determined).

 

>>

 

>> You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

 

>> Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

 

>>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> ---

 

>

 

> Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times

 

> http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com

 

>

 

> Help build the world's largest online encyclopedia for Chinese medicine

 

> and acupuncture, click, http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/wiki/CMTpedia

 

>

 

>

 

> and adjust

 

> accordingly.

 

>

 

> Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group

 

> requires prior permission from the author.

 

>

 

> Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely

 

> necessary.

[Guest guest]

V,

 

That is part of their process toward a DPT profession. They also need this for

their own autonomy and to be able to provide limited diagnosis. The legal entry

is another issue as that needs to change in the legislature of each state.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

hobbs.valeriehobbs

Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:03:27 +0000

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Even in PT, the entry level for licensure never changed. You can get a

license in PT at a bachelor, master or doctorate level. When PTs transitioned

their educational degrees (and remember there are still two degrees in the

field), not a single licensing board increased the standard to enter practice.

 

 

 

Valerie

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , mike Bowser

<naturaldoc1 wrote:

 

>

 

>

 

> Nursing is not a good example for comparison. I would think that PT would be

a better comparison. We are forgetting that the non-Asian members (US) of the

profession are not a majority worldwide, whereas it appears that the Asian

membership is seeking the FPD. We need to seriously consider that this issue

may lead to fragmentation of our profession and a major step backwards. Also

keep in mind that CA was able to get a lot of political clout to create a better

acupuncture law because of the Asian community.

 

>

 

> Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

> There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change

with an advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards can

be developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs can be

developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before we will see

what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments and students seeking

degrees)

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether it

is desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure criteria

changes. There are models of professions that did not change entry level

licensure criteria when they created optional advanced degrees. Why are we

buying into some " either/or " philosophy?

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001@> wrote:

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

> > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

> > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License, like

California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board agreeing

they have no license value in California???

 

>

 

> > **********************************************************************

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

> > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on " ACAOM

February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

> > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be provisions

for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine to take

classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details have yet to

be determined).

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

> > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

 

>

 

> >

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

> ________

 

> Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft's powerful SPAM protection.

 

> http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/

 

>

 

>

[Guest guest]

The FPD will not be a Phd just as the M.D. is not a Phd, it is a professional

doctorate. The DAOM is a hybrid degree, it is considered a professional

doctorate but there is a capstone dissertation requirement that most

professional doctorates, such as the MD, do not have. Therefore, it gives the

DAOM some research expertise that an MD may not have.

 

 

 

Dr. Don Snow, DAOM, MPH, L.Ac.

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

magisterium_magnum

Wed, 10 Mar 2010 13:27:54 -0800

Re: Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

So then what's the difference between a Masters level and a Phd? Will the

Phd's get to make Western diagnoses? LOL.

 

-

" ValerieH " <hobbs.valeriehobbs

<Chinese Medicine >

Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:25 AM

Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

> There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change

> with an advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards

> can be developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs

> can be developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before

> we will see what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments

> and students seeking degrees)

>

> We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether

> it is desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure

> criteria changes. There are models of professions that did not change

> entry level licensure criteria when they created optional advanced

> degrees. Why are we buying into some " either/or " philosophy?

>

> Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

>

> Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

> <singlewhip2001 wrote:

>>

>> Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

>>

>> Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

>> like California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

>> agreeing they have no license value in California???

>> **********************************************************************

>>

>>

>> At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

>> Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

>> standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on

>> " ACAOM February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

>>

>> Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

>> provisions for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental

>> Medicine to take classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree

>> (these details have yet to be determined).

>>

>> You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

>> Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

>>

>

>

>

>

> ---

>

> Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times

> http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com

>

> Help build the world's largest online encyclopedia for Chinese medicine

> and acupuncture, click, http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/wiki/CMTpedia

>

>

> and adjust

> accordingly.

>

> Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group

> requires prior permission from the author.

>

> Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely

> necessary.

[Guest guest]

Hi Richard:

 

I think your point is critical to understand and maybe most people do not

understand.

 

My understanding is ACOM is not pursuing the FDP, nor did it pursue the DAOM.

Its role is to review proposals, to see if they meet the standards for a degree.

It is others in our profession that initiate the process of review and approval

by ACOM. It is AAAOM and others that initiate the process and in a sense control

the process.

 

If my understanding is not correct can someone clarify?

 

 

thanks,

david

 

 

 

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , acudoc11 wrote:

>

> Michael

>

> Do tell what the current program is equivalent to in your opinion?

>

> By many who count......it is WAY passed even a PhD at least in terms of

> college credits or clock hours.

>

> 60 college credits to get into an acupuncture school and by today's

> so-called Masters program another 200 credits (3,000 hours divided by the

> standard 15 hrs per credit). That TOTALS 260 credits.

>

> BS = 120 to 128 credits

> MS = 32

> PhD = 32

> Totals approximately 192 credits

>

> So we are apparently ALREADY completing 68 college credits BEYOND a PhD.

>

> Hmmmmmmmm.....I know you will have something interesting to contradict

> these FACTS.

>

> Oh...and by the way......WHERE is ACAOM's CONSENSUS on the FPD?

> How are they pushing the FPD through without CONSENSUS?

> They NEED to PROVE the CONSENSUS.

>

> I am sure Mr Dort Bigg (ED of ACAOM) can shed some light..... if he is

> still within lurking distance.

>

> Richard

>

>

[Guest guest]

Richard,

 

Not sure what " current program " you are talking about as we do not yet have any

FPD in operation. Are you asking about the FPD? Not sure that your numbers are

relevant as the OM profession tends to create its own separate educational

reality.

 

BTW, there is no discussion of going this route (BS > MS > PhD), that I recall.

Even though this is the common route in China and possibly in Korea.

 

I see no real issue with adding in a few more classroom hours, more clinical

internship and adjusting the Master's to become a doctorate. I agree that the

master's is way too bloated as such. Would also like to see more rigor in the

courses and a higher educational requirement for entry. That is just me,

though.

 

Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine

CC: habeas_1

acudoc11

Fri, 12 Mar 2010 10:03:14 -0500

Re: Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Michael

 

 

 

Do tell what the current program is equivalent to in your opinion?

 

 

 

By many who count......it is WAY passed even a PhD at least in terms of

 

college credits or clock hours.

 

 

 

60 college credits to get into an acupuncture school and by today's

 

so-called Masters program another 200 credits (3,000 hours divided by the

 

standard 15 hrs per credit). That TOTALS 260 credits.

 

 

 

BS = 120 to 128 credits

 

MS = 32

 

PhD = 32

 

Totals approximately 192 credits

 

 

 

So we are apparently ALREADY completing 68 college credits BEYOND a PhD.

 

 

 

Hmmmmmmmm.....I know you will have something interesting to contradict

 

these FACTS.

 

 

 

Oh...and by the way......WHERE is ACAOM's CONSENSUS on the FPD?

 

How are they pushing the FPD through without CONSENSUS?

 

They NEED to PROVE the CONSENSUS.

 

 

 

I am sure Mr Dort Bigg (ED of ACAOM) can shed some light..... if he is

 

still within lurking distance.

 

 

 

Richard

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In a message dated 3/12/2010 9:53:50 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

 

naturaldoc1 writes:

 

 

 

Not sure where this misinfo is coming from. We are not talking about a

 

PhD but more then likely a clinical doctorate. I am sure that there will be

 

more western medicine in an expanded education, like a doctorate (similar

 

to the DAOM programs I would hope). Your ability to utilize western medical

 

theory is limited by your state laws. For example, the chiropractors

 

rely upon orthopedic and neurological exams, which are also part of western

 

medicine. It is how you use them that matters. So, the big difference is

 

more knowledge and hopefully more rigor in the curriculum. We tend to covet

 

the foreign trained practitioners for their expanded knowledge base in both

 

WM and CM, so now it is up to us to become better.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I think you might be mistaken in this opinion. When other professions offered

higher educational degrees, they did not enact new licensing standards. The

additional degrees exceeded the minimum licensing level in order to practice,

and their practice acts were not changed.

 

We are a hybrid profession, in that in most states we already are independent

providers of health care. Since we already have these scopes, I can't think of

any public health reason that legislation has to be changed. There is no reason

for us to to " one size fits all " thinking and envision a profession

where everyone has to have a doctorate. I could be wrong here -- do you know of

any other profession that increased licensing requirements when a higher

educational degree was offered? I haven't read all the PT statutes, but I've

read several and their DPT is not required for licensure.

 

Here's the PT law in California:

" each applicant for a license as a physical therapist shall be a graduate of a

professional degree program of an accredited postsecondary institution or

institutions approved by the board, and shall have completed a professional

education including academic coursework and clinical internship in physical

therapy. "

 

Here's the PT Accreditation commission's scope:

" CAPTE accredits first professional (entry-level) programs in the U.S. for the

physical therapist at the master's and doctoral degree levels and programs for

the physical therapist assistant at the associate degree level. "

 

While the PT profession is moving from Master's to a doctoral level, Master

degree programs do still exist, although the profession itself went voluntarily

more to the doctorate level programs faster than they had expected because of

student demand. Their Master's program, unlike ours, were not overly bloated,

and neither is their doctorate, so the conditions under which they made the

change were different. In many cases, you can get a doctorate in PT in less

hours than our Master level programs.

 

We have several factions within our profession who have and will use a political

strategy in order to get a doctor title, and IMO, the lack of a credible

academic degree at a doctoral level and the pursuit of a political agenda more

than any other factor has pushed our degrees much higher in proscribed hours

than any other professional degree of its kind.

 

We need to be smart about how to strategically move this forward. Should a

doctorate not be offered, we'll just see individuals push their state

legislatures to make a legislative doctorate happen rather than a credible

academic one.

 

However, if we have been listening carefully this past several months, we also

need to develop a strategy for sustainability. Part of that sustainability is to

recognize that our currently licensed practitioners are providing good care at

the current licensing levels. Unless we are restricted in scope, such as those

states where herbs can't be prescribed, or we still need an MD Rx, or we still

aren't legal, we should not be promoting a change in licensing. There's no

reason to.

 

Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , mike Bowser

<naturaldoc1 wrote:

>

>

> V,

>

> That is part of their process toward a DPT profession. They also need this

for their own autonomy and to be able to provide limited diagnosis. The legal

entry is another issue as that needs to change in the legislature of each state.

>

> Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

 

> Chinese Medicine

> hobbs.valeriehobbs

> Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:03:27 +0000

> Re: First Professional Doctorate Gets Green Light!

 

 

> Even in PT, the entry level for licensure never changed. You can get a

license in PT at a bachelor, master or doctorate level. When PTs transitioned

their educational degrees (and remember there are still two degrees in the

field), not a single licensing board increased the standard to enter practice.

 

> Valerie

 

> Chinese Medicine , mike Bowser

<naturaldoc1@> wrote:

 

> > Nursing is not a good example for comparison. I would think that PT would

be a better comparison. We are forgetting that the non-Asian members (US) of

the profession are not a majority worldwide, whereas it appears that the Asian

membership is seeking the FPD. We need to seriously consider that this issue

may lead to fragmentation of our profession and a major step backwards. Also

keep in mind that CA was able to get a lot of political clout to create a better

acupuncture law because of the Asian community.

>

> >

>

> > Michael W. Bowser, DC, LAc

>

>

>

> > There is no implication that entry level for licensure needs to change

with an advanced title (think nursing). And this step means that standards can

be developed, which takes time. It will take years before any programs can be

developed, before graduates will come of those programs, and before we will see

what the effect is (in terms of patients seeking treatments and students seeking

degrees)

>

> >

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> >

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> >

>

> > We need to listen to each other on this issue and carefully reason whether

it is desirable or sustainable to create a scenario where licensure criteria

changes. There are models of professions that did not change entry level

licensure criteria when they created optional advanced degrees. Why are we

buying into some " either/or " philosophy?

>

> >

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> >

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> >

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> > Valerie Hobbs, L Ac

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> > Chinese Medicine , " singlewhip2001 "

<singlewhip2001@> wrote:

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> > > Any thoughts on this and do you all support AAAOM's pursuit of this?

>

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> > > Will you support their efforts to lobby the State Boards that License,

like California, to follow their goal? Without the Cal Acupuncture Board

agreeing they have no license value in California???

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> >

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> > > **********************************************************************

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> > > At its February meeting, the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and

Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) announced that it will proceed with developing

standards for the First-Professional Doctorate (FPD). (link - click on " ACAOM

February 2010 Action on First Professional Doctoral Standards " )

>

> >

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> > >

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> >

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> > > Once approved by the US Department of Education, there should be

provisions for allowing acupuncturists who hold a Master's in Oriental Medicine

to take classes to upgrade to a transitional doctorate degree (these details

have yet to be determined).

>

> >

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> > > You can find details on this exciting development in " Guide to the

Professional Doctorate (FPD) in AOM. "

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> > ________

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> > Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft's powerful SPAM protection.

>

> > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/

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