Wu jia pi/Siberian ginseng

[Guest guest]

<<Apparently, some older texts classify Wu Jia Pi as a tree, others as a

shrub, while still others say it is climbing plant. .....Anyway, I've

recently had the fortune to see some " Wu Jia Sheng " . I assume this is

the whole root with the bark unremoved. I would estimate the mean

diameter of the roots to be 2-5cm.>>

 

That sounds smaller than Elutherococcus senticocus/Ci wu jia, which is

easily as big around as an arm. Do you know whether this was a taproot

or lateral root? (OTOH species differentiation or growing conditions

could account for your references regarding it as a " tree " in the

northern sandy soils and a " herbaceous plant " in the southern sandy

soils- in which case the piece you saw might be southern).

 

Does anyone know whether any araliacae are climbing plants? I've only

seen them as herbaceous or woody shrubs. Does Periploca sepium (aka

Xiang jian pi) climb?- most asclepiadiacae don't.

 

Li Sh Zhen said that the five leafed wu jia was the better one.

Elutherococcus senticocus has five leaves while the others we know of do

not. ( He also recommended upgrading the herb from the middle class to

the highest.)

 

Paul Bergner's " Healing Power of Ginseng and the Tonic Herbs " states that

over the years at least 13 different species have been used as Wu jia.

(Paul- are you still on list?). Several including E. ( A.) gracilstylus

are less potent than E. senticocus/Ci wu jia. Periploca can cause toxic

reactions and must be used for shorter periods of time. This may explain

why Ci wu jia has not been greatly used.

 

Karen Vaughan

CreationsGarden

***************************************

Man, surrounded by facts, permitting himself no suprise, no intuitive

flash, no great hypothesis, no risk, is in a locked cell. " -Lillian

Smith

 

______________

YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

[Guest guest]

<<I would estimate the mean diameter of the roots to be 2-5cm.>>

 

<<Does anyone know whether any araliacae are climbing plants? I've only

seen them as herbaceous or woody shrubs. Does Periploca sepium (aka

Xiang jian pi) climb?- most asclepiadiacae don't.>>

 

The following is excerpted from a Botanica BioScience internal document,

nothing too confidential.. (partly plagiarized, partly translated from

Chinese texts):

 

Eleutherococcus is a tall spiny deciduous shrub, which grows north of

latitude 38 and up to an elevation of about 2500 feet in forests in

northeastern Russia (including Sakhalin Island), Japan, South Korea, and

China (most abundantly in Manchuria and the Heilonjiang province). This

region is also known as the taiga zone. Eleutherococcus prefers sun, but can

also be found in the shade. It grows naturally in cold-to-moderate climates.

It competes very successfully with other plant species in the dense taiga

forest. In some places, mature plants 7-10 years old have grown 7-9 feet

tall with more than 100,000 sprouts in a hectare forming an almost

impenetrable thicket.

The root is the most widely used component with the highest concentration

of biologically active substances occurring in the fall, just before

defoliation. After the roots are dug, the lateral rootlets are cut away and

the roots are cleaned. The cortex of the root is retained, and the wood is

often discarded, not always. The leaves are also used medicinally, with

their highest concentration of biologically active substances occurring in

July, just before flowering.

The total eleutheroside content of the root is in the range of 0.6-0.9%,

and the stems in the range of 0.6-1.5%. Eleutheroside B (syringin) is found

in the stems of the dried plant (avg. 0.5%), but not in the leaf or the

fruit. It is present in extracts of plants from Russia and South Korea, but

in substantially lower levels or not at all in plants obtained from

(indigenous to) China. Therefore, regional variance of syringin levels makes

quantification of syringin an essential component of quality control. END

 

Eleuthroside E is also used as a measure of quality. As noted above,

Eleuthrosides are found in very small quantities in the raw material

compared to a good quality extract, which is typically targeted toward the

0.8% level of E and B combined. It is necessary to do between a 25 and 40

to 1 extract in order to get a 0.8% eleuthroside E and B total content,

depending on the quality of the raw material. The eleuthrosides are not

very soluble in water, and only a bit more soluble in ethanol. So it would

not have been as potent in traditional decoctions. The somewhat arbitrary

0.8% standard is an attempt to match what was used in many of the Russian

research studies. However the analytical method for eleuthrosides using

HPLC is not easy to perfect and two labs testing the same material can come

up with substantially different results. I have seen a 20 fold difference

in results between a lab in China (at the Beijing U of TCM) and a US lab

testing the same exact extract batch. The Chinese lab was higher. So the

test product used in the Russian studies that claims a 0.8% eleuthroside E

and B content could be way off.

 

The Chinese Pharmacopeia lists Ci Wu Jia as Acanthopanacis senticosus. It

states that the rhizomes are 1.4cm to 4.2cm in diameter and the root is

3.5cm to 12cm long and 0.3cm to 1.5cm in diameter.

 

Its actions are to reinforce qi, invigorate the function of the spleen and

kidney, and to calm the nerves (it is indicated for insomnia and

dream-disturbed sleep as well as vacuity symptoms).

 

My personal experience from having tasted many batches that were also

analysed by our and other labs tells me that organoleptic assessment often

reveals as much about the potency as an HPLC. We have produced batches with

as high as 2.0% eleuthroside content when the raw materials were good. The

taste becomes more pungent and slightly sour. At that concentration it

sticks to your fingers when compressed. I've also eaten ground up raw

materials from Nature's Way that tasted somewhere between cardboard and

sawdust.

 

Stephen

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Karen S Vaughan [creationsgarden]

Thursday, September 28, 2000 3:24 PM

 

Re: Wu jia pi/Siberian ginseng

 

 

 

Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare

practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing

in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,

including board approved online continuing education.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Stephen-

 

Thanks for that information.

 

Karen Vaughan

 

______________

YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!

Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!

Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:

http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.