Guest guest Posted September 22, 2001 Report Share Posted September 22, 2001 The discussion of anthrax was timely for me because I had been planning to post on one of the issues that came up during this discussion. Alon has made it clear that he is uncomfortable with treating an illness with TCM just because we can find symptom sign complex that resembles the manifestations of the disease in a given patient. Bob is concerned whether we should go down this road because there is no reference to anthrax in CM lit he has access to. Z'ev has sided with Alon in the past when discussing the pattern differentiation of western diseases, such as presented in many modern TCM texts. Yet Z'ev and Bob have also long been advocates of treating presenting patterns even if no western diagnosis is available. We merely study chinese bing that match one or more of the chief manifestations and proceed from there. Now, I wouldn't try and treat anthrax unless conventional therapy had no chance of success. But pulmonary anthrax is almost always fatal, so it makes sense to consider what we might do, at least for our families and friend if this happened. But to me, the larger question is why is it wrong to treat new diseases based upon symptom sign complexes they resemble? I mean the use of formulas like xiao chai hu tang has been successfully expanded to treat far more than the condition originally described by zhang zhong jing (whatever it may have been). This expansion is based upon applying the formula to the pattern it treats without regard for the named disease. thus, it is used for mental disorders, menstrual complaints, prostate problems, hepatitis, malaria, etc. What is a disease from the TCM perspective other than its manifestations? As long as one makes correct pattern dx, one should be able to improve the patient's health. I think a lot of this debate uses the straw man technique, in which one debates a point that no one is making and then knocks down the straw man and claims victory. This came up when Bob's TCM Psych book was released and will no doubt surface again when BP releases their modern western diseases book. The straw man is the equation of diseases one to one with patterns. We saw a lot of this during the early days of treatment of AIDS with TCM. People laid out competing theories that claimed AIDS was a form of Cold Damage or a Hidden Warm Evil or Jing vacuity or yin vacuity or spleen vacuity, each proponent insisting that their model was correct. Yet the actual point that is made in well done books like those from BP is that NO textbook pattern will FIT a real live patient. Textbooks basically plot points on a continuum. They are static. Patients are dynamic. We use the static info from books to guide us in creating unique formulas for our dynamic patients. What is the difference between defining the continuum of possibilities for a western disease in a textbook by analyzing possible S/S complexes that resemble the typical manifestations or analyzing the S/S complex of a given patient and choosing herbs to match the pattern. I don't understand how you can argue for the latter and against the former. Or should we just not treat diseases that have not been actually researched in modern China? The purpose of a text is to provide an easily accessed compilation of patterns that resemble a disease. It serves no other purpose than to provide at one's fingertips what one would otherwise spend hours doing on their own each time. So whether we are talking about the similarity of anthrax to wen bing or lily disease to early stage parkinsons in some cases, what other process do we have than pattern differentiation? -- , VOICE: (858) 946-0070 FAX: (858) 946-0067 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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