Guest guest Posted October 29, 2001 Report Share Posted October 29, 2001 I have received inquiries from three patients today as a result of this Q & A piece, "Ask Dr. Weil"(on his website). It seems that he is trying to paint us with a pretty broad brush laden with manure. Why? (hah!) Frances Are Herbs from China Safe? My acupuncturist gave me a bottle of herbs in pill form that are made in China. Are herbs from China safe, especially since China has different environmental laws? -- Mary (Published Friday October 26, 2001) You're right to be cautious about using herbs from China. In the past, some Chinese herbal remedies manufactured in Hong Kong turned out to contain powerful pharmaceutical drugs. One such treatment for arthritis known as black pearls contained diazepam (Valium) and phenylbutazone, an anti-inflammatory drug rarely used in humans because of its toxicity. These and other pharmaceutical drugs were added to black pearls to increase the product's effectiveness. Today, Chinese herbal products may not be safe for a variety of reasons. Some still may be spiked with pharmaceutical drugs that are not listed on the labels. The herbs may be contaminated with pesticides, fungicides, or heavy metals, or adulterated with cheaper plants. Be especially wary of patent medicines from China; get them only from a reputable practitioner. You might be better off buying Chinese herbal products manufactured in the United States. You should, of course, be careful whenever buying herbs. As a rule of thumb, I recommend avoiding medicinal herbs (Chinese or domestic) in the following forms: Teas. While herbal teas can be soothing, don't buy whole dried herbs from bins or jars in stores because dried plants deteriorate on exposure to air, light, and moisture. Make sure tea bags are richly fragrant rather than faintly scented. Bulk herbs. Herbal leaves and flowers deteriorate quickly in bins in natural food stores. If they've lost their natural color and odor, they will be useless as remedies. Powdered herbs in capsules. Grinding certain dried herbs into powder speeds their oxidation, so the capsules are often useless. When you buy herbal remedies, follow these general rules: Look for the term standardized as your most reliable guide to whether or not the active constituents of the herb are present. Choose liquid and solid extracts, tinctures, or freeze-dried encapsulated herbs, all of which are more stable and potent than herbs in other forms. Use products made with freeze-dried herbs rather than air-dried herbs. Check the expiration date to make sure the remedy is still effective. Buy from reputable companies whose brands are nationally available and that provide written materials explaining their manufacturing processes and the sources of their herbs. ____________________________ Make a great connection at Personals. http://personals. Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 30, 2001 Report Share Posted October 30, 2001 , Frances Gander <fgander@c...> wrote: > > I have received inquiries from three patients today as a result of > > this Q & A piece, " Ask Dr. Weil " (on his website). It seems that he is > > trying to paint us with a pretty broad brush laden with manure. Why? > > (hah!) > > Frances He does make some good points -- see below > > (Published Friday October 26, 2001) You're > > right to be cautious about using herbs from > > China. In the past, some Chinese herbal > > remedies manufactured in Hong Kong turned > > out to contain powerful pharmaceutical drugs. > > One such treatment for arthritis known as > > black pearls contained diazepam (Valium) and > > phenylbutazone, an anti-inflammatory drug > > rarely used in humans because of its toxicity. > > These and other pharmaceutical drugs were > > added to black pearls to increase the product's > > effectiveness. true > > > > Today, Chinese herbal products may not be > > safe for a variety of reasons. Some still may > > be spiked with pharmaceutical drugs that are > > not listed on the labels. The herbs may be > > contaminated with pesticides, fungicides, or > > heavy metals, or adulterated with cheaper > > plants. Be especially wary of patent medicines > > from China; get them only from a reputable > > practitioner. You might be better off buying > > Chinese herbal products manufactured in the > > United States. again, true. though subhuti lectured on this subject at the Pacific symposium and pointed out that many chinese companies are now getting certified as GMP - drug free, etc. I also spoke with Paul Unschuld this weekend and he told me that in Germany where ALL herbs are tested by law for contaminants, fully 30% of ALL herbs, western and chinese, have to be discarded. > > Teas. While herbal teas can be soothing, > > don't buy whole dried herbs from bins or jars in > > stores because dried plants deteriorate on > > exposure to air, light, and moisture. very true, most bulk herbs in most clinic pharmacies and stores I have inspected are utter garbage - old and worthless > > > > Powdered herbs in capsules. Grinding > > certain dried herbs into powder speeds their > > oxidation, so the capsules are often useless. again, true, I have avoided such herbs for many years > > Choose liquid and solid extracts, tinctures, > > or freeze-dried encapsulated herbs, all of > > which are more stable and potent than herbs > > in other forms. absolutely, which is why I now use only powder and liquid concentrates in my private practice for many years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 30, 2001 Report Share Posted October 30, 2001 Thanks for breaking this down, Todd. I realized that Dr. Weil spoke some truth in his reply, but objected to the tone and rhetoric more than anything. Frances wrote: , Frances Gander <fgander@c...> wrote: > > I have received inquiries from three patients today as a result of > > this Q & A piece, "Ask Dr. Weil"(on his website). It seems that he is > > trying to paint us with a pretty broad brush laden with manure. Why? > > (hah!) > > Frances He does make some good points -- see below > > (Published Friday October 26, 2001) You're > > right to be cautious about using herbs from > > China. In the past, some Chinese herbal > > remedies manufactured in Hong Kong turned > > out to contain powerful pharmaceutical drugs. > > One such treatment for arthritis known as > > black pearls contained diazepam (Valium) and > > phenylbutazone, an anti-inflammatory drug > > rarely used in humans because of its toxicity. > > These and other pharmaceutical drugs were > > added to black pearls to increase the product's > > effectiveness. true > > > > Today, Chinese herbal products may not be > > safe for a variety of reasons. Some still may > > be spiked with pharmaceutical drugs that are > > not listed on the labels. The herbs may be > > contaminated with pesticides, fungicides, or > > heavy metals, or adulterated with cheaper > > plants. Be especially wary of patent medicines > > from China; get them only from a reputable > > practitioner. You might be better off buying > > Chinese herbal products manufactured in the > > United States. again, true. though subhuti lectured on this subject at the Pacific symposium and pointed out that many chinese companies are now getting certified as GMP - drug free, etc. I also spoke with Paul Unschuld this weekend and he told me that in Germany where ALL herbs are tested by law for contaminants, fully 30% of ALL herbs, western and chinese, have to be discarded. > > Teas. While herbal teas can be soothing, > > don't buy whole dried herbs from bins or jars in > > stores because dried plants deteriorate on > > exposure to air, light, and moisture. very true, most bulk herbs in most clinic pharmacies and stores I have inspected are utter garbage - old and worthless > > > > Powdered herbs in capsules. Grinding > > certain dried herbs into powder speeds their > > oxidation, so the capsules are often useless. again, true, I have avoided such herbs for many years > > Choose liquid and solid extracts, tinctures, > > or freeze-dried encapsulated herbs, all of > > which are more stable and potent than herbs > > in other forms. absolutely, which is why I now use only powder and liquid concentrates in my private practice for many years Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2001 Report Share Posted November 5, 2001 >> very true, most bulk herbs in most clinic pharmacies and stores I >> have inspected are utter garbage - old and worthless >> >> absolutely, which is why I now use only powder and liquid >> concentrates >> in my private practice for many years >> >> > >> > I am in the process of obtaining crude herbs for my pharmacy. I am currently using individual herbs in granule form and plan to switch my patients using granules to crude herbs as soon as I have enough herbs to write the most common formulas. Your point regarding the freshness of crude herbs in some pharmacies raises a couple of questions: 1. If one obtains a pound of Huang Qi (or any other herb for that matter) from say Mayway, good quality Plum Flower brand, non-sulphured etc. what is the shelf-life and what determines if the herb is not longer effective? 2. If one stay with the granules, should one buy formulas in granule form and modify with individual herbs according to the patient's needs? And if so, how would you subtract herbs from a granuled formula? I understand that a granuled formula is more effective than mixing individual herbs due to the synergistic effect of the herbs being cooked together. I thank you in advance, Fernando >> >> >> >> >> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed >> healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate >> academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a >> variety of professional services, including board approved online >> continuing education. >> >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2001 Report Share Posted November 5, 2001 > > Your point regarding the freshness of crude herbs in some pharmacies > raises a couple of questions: > 1. If one obtains a pound of Huang Qi (or any other herb for that > matter) from say Mayway, good quality Plum Flower brand, non-sulphured > etc. what is the shelf-life and what determines if the herb is not > longer effective? Mayway has good quality herbs, but everyone should be aware that unsulfured herbs have a shorter shelf life than those with sulfur. Sulfites are preservatives that a minute number of people are allergic to. I prefer unsulfured herbs myself, but it is unclear whether sulfuring poses more than a negligible risk when spoilage and turnover is also a concern. Many packaged food products still contain sulfites and patients just need to be warned so they can avoid chinese herbs if necessary. If kept in clear glass jars that are frequently opened and exposed to temperatures higher than 60, I think significant deterioration occurs adfter six months. there is no way to verify this except with lab analysis; also the herbs could be old even when you get them from the supplier. Another reason I like powder extracts because they are tested for active constituents before packaging so you can be assured of potency. > > 2. If one stay with the granules, should one buy formulas in granule > form and modify with individual herbs according to the patient's needs? > And if so, how would you subtract herbs from a granuled formula? I > understand that a granuled formula is more effective than mixing > individual herbs due to the synergistic effect of the herbs being cooked > together. > You cannot substract herbs from premade formulas, a serious drawback in my opinion. And even if you like all the herbs, I often object to the proportions. The issue of synergy from cooking is a speculative matter that I have not found to be clinically important in my practice. the herbs are also " cooked " together in your stomach. Perhaps that is enough. I find the issue of substitution and dose proportions to be much more of a concern on a daily basis. I have used single herb granules for 14 years with good success. Finally, if you go with raw, you should expect a serious loss of compliance. I find patients to be three times more compliant woth granules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2001 Report Share Posted November 5, 2001 Iunderstand that a granuled formula is more effective than mixingindividual herbs due to the synergistic effect of the herbs being >>>I do not agree. And I tell my patients to put the mixture in boiling H2O and let it steep. Probably getting the same synergistic effect Alon - Fernando Bernall Monday, November 05, 2001 3:08 PM Re: Re: Dr. Weil >> very true, most bulk herbs in most clinic pharmacies and stores I>> have inspected are utter garbage - old and worthless>>>> absolutely, which is why I now use only powder and liquid>> concentrates>> in my private practice for many years>>>>>>>>I am in the process of obtaining crude herbs for my pharmacy. I amcurrently using individual herbs in granule form and plan to switch mypatients using granules to crude herbs as soon as I have enough herbs towrite the most common formulas.Your point regarding the freshness of crude herbs in some pharmaciesraises a couple of questions:1. If one obtains a pound of Huang Qi (or any other herb for thatmatter) from say Mayway, good quality Plum Flower brand, non-sulphuredetc. what is the shelf-life and what determines if the herb is notlonger effective?2. If one stay with the granules, should one buy formulas in granuleform and modify with individual herbs according to the patient's needs?And if so, how would you subtract herbs from a granuled formula? Iunderstand that a granuled formula is more effective than mixingindividual herbs due to the synergistic effect of the herbs being cookedtogether.I thank you in advance,Fernando>>>>>>>>>> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed>> healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate>> academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a>> variety of professional services, including board approved online>> continuing education.>>>> http://www..org>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 5, 2001 Report Share Posted November 5, 2001 I think significant deterioration occurs adfter six months. there is no way to verify this except with lab analysis; also the herbs could be old even when you get them from the supplier. Another reason I like powder extracts because they are tested for active constituents before packaging so you can be assured of potency.>>>It depends on the type of herbs. Flowers and leafs last shorter time than roots for example. Sulfites are used on a small % of herbs. Alon - Monday, November 05, 2001 4:49 PM Re: Dr. Weil > > Your point regarding the freshness of crude herbs in some pharmacies> raises a couple of questions:> 1. If one obtains a pound of Huang Qi (or any other herb for that> matter) from say Mayway, good quality Plum Flower brand, non-sulphured> etc. what is the shelf-life and what determines if the herb is not> longer effective?Mayway has good quality herbs, but everyone should be aware that unsulfured herbs have a shorter shelf life than those with sulfur. Sulfites are preservatives that a minute number of people are allergic to. I prefer unsulfured herbs myself, but it is unclear whether sulfuring poses more than a negligible risk when spoilage and turnover is also a concern. Many packaged food products still contain sulfites and patients just need to be warned so they can avoid chinese herbs if necessary. If kept in clear glass jars that are frequently opened and exposed to temperatures higher than 60, I think significant deterioration occurs adfter six months. there is no way to verify this except with lab analysis; also the herbs could be old even when you get them from the supplier. Another reason I like powder extracts because they are tested for active constituents before packaging so you can be assured of potency.> > 2. If one stay with the granules, should one buy formulas in granule> form and modify with individual herbs according to the patient's needs?> And if so, how would you subtract herbs from a granuled formula? I> understand that a granuled formula is more effective than mixing> individual herbs due to the synergistic effect of the herbs being cooked> together.> You cannot substract herbs from premade formulas, a serious drawback in my opinion. And even if you like all the herbs, I often object to the proportions. The issue of synergy from cooking is a speculative matter that I have not found to be clinically important in my practice. the herbs are also "cooked" together in your stomach. Perhaps that is enough. I find the issue of substitution and dose proportions to be much more of a concern on a daily basis. I have used single herb granules for 14 years with good success. Finally, if you go with raw, you should expect a serious loss of compliance. I find patients to be three times more compliant woth granules.ToddChinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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