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With previous discussions debating whether or not TCM

supports the idea of a healing crisis, I just wanted to mention a line from the

SHL (#101). After one has given

X.C.H.T. …“There will be steaming and quivering, then heat effusion

and sweating again, by which the disease resolves.” It clearly demonstrates an increase in

symptoms (getting worse before better) due to the body getting stronger and the

battle becoming more intense, fighting harder to outhrow the pathogen. Were there other classic references that

we mentioned at one time, or that others know of…?

 

-

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, " " <@o...> wrote:

> With previous discussions debating whether or not TCM supports the idea

> of a healing crisis, I just wanted to mention a line from the SHL

> (#101). After one has given X.C.H.T. . " There will be steaming and

> quivering, then heat effusion and sweating again, by which the disease

> resolves. " It clearly demonstrates an increase in symptoms (getting

> worse before better) due to the body getting stronger and the battle

> becoming more intense, fighting harder to outhrow the pathogen. Were

> there other classic references that we mentioned at one time, or that

> others know of.?

>

> -

 

It is one thing to see such a reversal of sx in an acute condition

which is what that clause refers to. Many people use the concept in

reference to chronic conditions. Bob Flaws, you have mentioned the

herxheimer's reaction in candida cases which apparently is a type of

healing crisis. However I am curious if the chinese literature

describes this phenomena in chronic cases of chong or gu or anything

else. Robert Svoboda writing about ayurveda states that healing crises

are undesirable and the result of improper therapy. While ayurveda

uses purging and enemas, measures are taken to expel circulating toxins

slowly and thus avoid the " crisis " . I think crises occur when the

therapy causes the body to use routes of elimination like the skin

because the kidneys and liver (western organs here) are not up to the

task. However, if the liver and kidneys are functioning properly due

to a balanced zang fu therapy, then the crisis does not occur. I think

this is why things like colonics and fasting induce crises. they

cleanse, but do not tonify and thus only one aspect of the mutually

engendering pathomechanisms is addressed leading to side effects.

 

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One of the definitions of Chinese

words with which many Westerners

have become familiar is the word

" crisis, " wei2 ji1 in Chinese.

The two Chinese characters mean

" danger " and " opportunity " respectively.

 

If you understand healing crisis

in this fundamental sense, then

it is hard to argue that traditional

medicine in China has neglected this

fundamentally important aspect of

medical intervention, namely alerting

the patient to both the danger and

the opportunity of the crisis of the

illness or injury. The path to wholeness

lies along the road that will bring

the patient to deal effectively with

the former while seizing the latter.

 

The manifestations of such changes

in awareness, attitude and action

(as well as reaction) on the part

of the patient are as individual as

everything else about the patient.

 

Personally, I always counsel patients

to be alert for apparently " adverse "

reactions to any form of therapy and

to take advantage of situations that

at first appear disadvantageous.

 

It seems to me that this is one of

the greatest strengths of the traditional

approach to medicine in China.

 

Perhaps this way of thinking is unique

to the traditions of a number of doctors

who were also martial artists, notably

practitioners of tai4 ji2.

 

But I think it is germane to the discussion

of the healing crisis.

 

Ken

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Perhaps this way of thinking is unique

to the traditions of a number of doctors

who were also martial artists, notably

practitioners of tai4 ji2.

 

Ken, can you elaborate on this? I find it curious and germane to

this discussion of 'healing crisis.'

Frances

yulong wrote:

One of the definitions of Chinese

words with which many Westerners

have become familiar is the word

"crisis," wei2 ji1 in Chinese.

The two Chinese characters mean

"danger" and "opportunity" respectively.

If you understand healing crisis

in this fundamental sense, then

it is hard to argue that traditional

medicine in China has neglected this

fundamentally important aspect of

medical intervention, namely alerting

the patient to both the danger and

the opportunity of the crisis of the

illness or injury. The path to wholeness

lies along the road that will bring

the patient to deal effectively with

the former while seizing the latter.

The manifestations of such changes

in awareness, attitude and action

(as well as reaction) on the part

of the patient are as individual as

everything else about the patient.

Personally, I always counsel patients

to be alert for apparently "adverse"

reactions to any form of therapy and

to take advantage of situations that

at first appear disadvantageous.

It seems to me that this is one of

the greatest strengths of the traditional

approach to medicine in China.

Perhaps this way of thinking is unique

to the traditions of a number of doctors

who were also martial artists, notably

practitioners of tai4 ji2.

But I think it is germane to the discussion

of the healing crisis.

Ken

 

 

 

 

Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed

healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics

specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional

services, including board approved online continuing education.

 

 

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Frances,

 

, Frances Gander <fgander@c...> wrote:

> > Perhaps this way of thinking is unique

> > to the traditions of a number of doctors

> > who were also martial artists, notably

> > practitioners of tai4 ji2.

> >

> Ken, can you elaborate on this? I find it curious and germane to

this

> discussion of 'healing crisis.'

 

What I meant is that viewing disease

as an opportunity may not be a widespread

attitude among practitioners of Chinese

medicine, either here or in China. I

developed this attitude largely from

the teachers I've had, many of whom are

also martial artists.

 

I mention tai4 ji2 in this regard because

it includes this idea of taking advantage

of the disadvantageous. This of course

stems directly from Daoist sources, which

can be cited at length.

 

The appearance of symptoms, which is generally

the first point at which most people recognize

that they are sick, can be seen as the onset

of a disease or it can be understood as the

opening up of a window in which we can see

patterns of imbalance which have probably

plagued the patient for a long time.

 

Many people pay little attention to their

bodies and minds until and unless they cease

to function in their habitual modes. This,

in and of itself, is a kind of longterm disease.

And therefore any illness can be seen as

an opportunity to interrupt the routine

ignorance of the body/mind with a penetrating

look to find out what has gone wrong.

 

To me, this conforms to that principle in

the Nei Jing to treat patients before they

get sick. In order to do this, I think the

patient has to take control of their life

in a way that can overcome the habitual

patterns and return to a more harmonious

way of living. What we call disease is

thus an opportunity for this process

of returning to begin.

 

The Chinese have long used martial metaphors

to describe the functions and structures of

the body. And prior to their use in medical

texts, the terms shi2 and xu1 were used by

Sun Zi to discuss battlefield circumstancs.

 

The tai4 ji2 classics tell us that every place

in the body has the same shi2 and xu1. This

is the kind of thinking that I was referring

to.

 

Ken

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Ken,

Thank you for your elucidation. I agree that this way of viewing

disease [as opportunity] is not widespread among modern practitioners of

chinese medicine.

 

What I meant is that viewing disease

as an opportunity may not be a widespread

attitude among practitioners of Chinese

medicine, either here or in China. I

developed this attitude largely from

the teachers I've had, many of whom are

also martial artists.

 

In my experience, most of my martial arts teachers were/are doctors, but--to

my disappointment--I have not found my chinese medicine teachers to be

students of the martial arts. I have studied only in the U.S.,

with chinese and caucasian teachers, respectively. So I look

into my taiji experience and studies for deeper meanings in my clinical

work.

 

I mention tai4 ji2 in this regard because

it includes this idea of taking advantage

of the disadvantageous. This of course

stems directly from Daoist sources, which

can be cited at length.

 

Yes, certainly in tai ji tou shou, one takes another's disadvantage

and transforms it into an advantage, or a change into another direction.

 

And therefore any illness can be seen as

an opportunity to interrupt the routine

ignorance of the body/mind with a penetrating

look to find out what has gone wrong.

 

And, why it went wrong when it did, why an illness happened at a particular

point in a person's life. There may be a deeper symbolism and synchronicity

to the time in one's life that a disease surfaces.

Frances

 

yulong wrote:

Frances,

, Frances Gander <fgander@c...>

wrote:

> > Perhaps this way of thinking is unique

> > to the traditions of a number of doctors

> > who were also martial artists, notably

> > practitioners of tai4 ji2.

> >

> Ken, can you elaborate on this? I find it curious and germane

to

this

> discussion of 'healing crisis.'

What I meant is that viewing disease

as an opportunity may not be a widespread

attitude among practitioners of Chinese

medicine, either here or in China. I

developed this attitude largely from

the teachers I've had, many of whom are

also martial artists.

I mention tai4 ji2 in this regard because

it includes this idea of taking advantage

of the disadvantageous. This of course

stems directly from Daoist sources, which

can be cited at length.

The appearance of symptoms, which is generally

the first point at which most people recognize

that they are sick, can be seen as the onset

of a disease or it can be understood as the

opening up of a window in which we can see

patterns of imbalance which have probably

plagued the patient for a long time.

Many people pay little attention to their

bodies and minds until and unless they cease

to function in their habitual modes. This,

in and of itself, is a kind of longterm disease.

And therefore any illness can be seen as

an opportunity to interrupt the routine

ignorance of the body/mind with a penetrating

look to find out what has gone wrong.

To me, this conforms to that principle in

the Nei Jing to treat patients before they

get sick. In order to do this, I think the

patient has to take control of their life

in a way that can overcome the habitual

patterns and return to a more harmonious

way of living. What we call disease is

thus an opportunity for this process

of returning to begin.

The Chinese have long used martial metaphors

to describe the functions and structures of

the body. And prior to their use in medical

texts, the terms shi2 and xu1 were used by

Sun Zi to discuss battlefield circumstancs.

The tai4 ji2 classics tell us that every place

in the body has the same shi2 and xu1. This

is the kind of thinking that I was referring

to.

Ken

 

 

Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed

healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics

specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional

services, including board approved online continuing education.

 

 

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Frances,

>

> Thank you for your elucidation. I agree that this way of viewing

> disease [as opportunity] is not widespread among modern

practitioners of

> chinese medicine.

 

Why do you reckon this is? I'm just

curious.

>

> > What I meant is that viewing disease

> > as an opportunity may not be a widespread

> > attitude among practitioners of Chinese

> > medicine, either here or in China. I

> > developed this attitude largely from

> > the teachers I've had, many of whom are

> > also martial artists.

> >

> In my experience, most of my martial arts teachers were/are doctors,

> but--to my disappointment--I have not found my chinese medicine

teachers

> to be students of the martial arts. I have studied only in the

U.S.,

> with chinese and caucasian teachers, respectively. So I look

into my

> taiji experience and studies for deeper meanings in my clinical

work.

 

It's certainly a good place to look.

Are you familiar with the writings of

Zheng Man Qing (Cheng Man Ching)? His

rather short essays on various aspects

of medicine and tai4 ji2 are enlightening.

 

>

> > I mention tai4 ji2 in this regard because

> > it includes this idea of taking advantage

> > of the disadvantageous. This of course

> > stems directly from Daoist sources, which

> > can be cited at length.

> >

>

> Yes, certainly in tai ji tou shou, one takes another's disadvantage

and

> transforms it into an advantage, or a change into another direction.

>

 

And when you think about it, that's what

a good doctor does as well, eh? And the

best doctors teach their patients how to

do it themselves.

 

> > And therefore any illness can be seen as

> > an opportunity to interrupt the routine

> > ignorance of the body/mind with a penetrating

> > look to find out what has gone wrong.

> >

> And, why it went wrong when it did, why an illness happened at a

> particular point in a person's life. There may be a deeper

symbolism

> and synchronicity to the time in one's life that a disease surfaces.

>

I can't really talk about this subject

without frequently referring to Prof.

Zheng. He called his tai4 ji2 school

Correct Timing, and it is certainly

one of the premier skills of both accomplished

doctors and boxers that they can discern

the right moment for action and stillness.

 

Ken

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Sorry it has taken me so long to reply to your query. I have been in

S.F. teaching.

 

In any case, to answer your question, I have not found much in the way

of Chinese discussions of or even acknowledgement of the

homeopathic/naturopathic concept of a healing crisis in the sense

that this concept is defined within that tradition. It is something

I have been keeping my eyes open for for a number of years now. Nor

have I found much in the way of Chinese acknowledgement of Herxheimer

reactions. The one place I have found something that looks like it

might be a reference to such an event vis a vis gu zheng is in the

Chinese discussions of bai he bing, lily disease.

 

From as far back as Zhang Zhong-jing's Jin Gui Yao Lue, one of the

definitions of a lily disease is that the patient vomits back up the

meds which otherwise appear to fit their pattern. The classical

solution to this is the administration of formulas containing Bulbus

Lilii (Bai He). This is interesting since, according to Heiner's

description of gu zheng therapy, gu zheng Rxs typically contain

yin-supplementing medicinals (especially heart-lung-stomach yin

supplements). For some time now I have been wondering if the

description of the seeming medicinal intolerance of bai he bing

patients is not a reference to Herxheimer reactions. Since bai he bing

patients are anxious and restless and one of the main disease

mechanisms of anxiety and restlessness is evil heat harassing the

heart, it seems likely that previous formulas used to treat these

symptoms might have contained bitter, cold heat-clearing meds such as

Rhizoma Coptidis Chinensis (Huang Lian) which can most definitely

cause a Herxheimer reaction.

 

There is yet another phenomenon which makes me think that Herxheimer

reactions are not a well known phenomenon within Chinese medicine. I'm

sure that you, like me, have heard Chinese doctors from China saying

that Americans cannot stomach Chinese herbs. Over the years, I've

heard this from any number of recent arrivals. They say that, when

they have given Americans Chinese meds seemingly appropriate for their

patterns, the Americans vomit and/or get diarrhea. More than one such

Chinese doctor has then gone on to tell me that he or she has stopped

giving Chinese meds to American patients, preferring to rely entirely

on acupuncture. My reading of this situation, based on my own

experience as a Chinese doctor treating American patients, is that, in

all probablity, these patients had Herxheimer reactions which these

Chinese doctors did not recognize as such. At least this has been my

experience when dealing with seemingly similar occurences.

 

Not having read the entire contents of this thread, I don't know if

anything I've said above hits the mark, but this at least is my

experience and the state of my research and thought on this issue at

the moment.

 

Bob

 

 

 

, @i... wrote:

> , " " <@o...>

wrote:

> > With previous discussions debating whether or not TCM supports the

idea

> > of a healing crisis, I just wanted to mention a line from the SHL

> > (#101). After one has given X.C.H.T. . " There will be steaming and

> > quivering, then heat effusion and sweating again, by which the

disease

> > resolves. " It clearly demonstrates an increase in symptoms

(getting

> > worse before better) due to the body getting stronger and the

battle

> > becoming more intense, fighting harder to outhrow the pathogen.

Were

> > there other classic references that we mentioned at one time, or

that

> > others know of.?

> >

> > -

>

> It is one thing to see such a reversal of sx in an acute condition

> which is what that clause refers to. Many people use the concept in

> reference to chronic conditions. Bob Flaws, you have mentioned the

> herxheimer's reaction in candida cases which apparently is a type of

> healing crisis. However I am curious if the chinese literature

> describes this phenomena in chronic cases of chong or gu or anything

> else. Robert Svoboda writing about ayurveda states that healing

crises

> are undesirable and the result of improper therapy. While ayurveda

> uses purging and enemas, measures are taken to expel circulating

toxins

> slowly and thus avoid the " crisis " . I think crises occur when the

> therapy causes the body to use routes of elimination like the skin

> because the kidneys and liver (western organs here) are not up to

the

> task. However, if the liver and kidneys are functioning properly

due

> to a balanced zang fu therapy, then the crisis does not occur. I

think

> this is why things like colonics and fasting induce crises. they

> cleanse, but do not tonify and thus only one aspect of the mutually

> engendering pathomechanisms is addressed leading to side effects.

>

 

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, pemachophel2001 wrote:

I'm

> sure that you, like me, have heard Chinese doctors from China saying

> that Americans cannot stomach Chinese herbs. Over the years, I've

> heard this from any number of recent arrivals. They say that, when

> they have given Americans Chinese meds seemingly appropriate for their

> patterns, the Americans vomit and/or get diarrhea. More than one such

> Chinese doctor has then gone on to tell me that he or she has stopped

> giving Chinese meds to American patients, preferring to rely entirely

> on acupuncture. My reading of this situation, based on my own

> experience as a Chinese doctor treating American patients, is that, in

> all probablity, these patients had Herxheimer reactions which these

> Chinese doctors did not recognize as such.

 

Interesting. I have also heard many chinese doctors say this, though

the typical response I see is that they use much lower dosages with

american patients to avoid reactions. The net result is that they do

not get adequate short term relief for their patients, who then refuse

to comply with raw herbs or even granules. Even guohui liu in the new

Warm disease book makes this statement about dose, claiming americans

are hypersensitive, pehaps because they are not used to taking herbs.

this makes little sense to me as americans are quite used to taking

strong drugs. He also suggests that the chinese export the best herbs

so they have to use higher dosage of low quality herbs in the PRC.

this was contradicted by Paul Unschuld who told me, on the contrary,

the Chinese reserve the best herbs for themselves and export lower

quality to all but the most discerning customers. So this herxheimer's

idea has some merit. I have never had to resort to low dosages, nor

does Heiner. But both of us have always attended closely to the issue

of candida and thus work with the patient to ride this through.

 

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Even guohui liu in the new Warm disease book makes this statement about dose, claiming americans are hypersensitive, pehaps because they are not used to taking herbs. this makes little sense to me as Americans are quite used to taking strong drugs. He also suggests that the Chinese export the best herbs so they have to use higher dosage of low quality herbs in the PRC. this was contradicted by Paul Unschuld who told me, on the contrary, the Chinese reserve the best herbs for themselves and export lower

>>>>>>There may be genetic differences. For example Chinese often need lower doses of western pharmaceuticals. This is a well known fact.

As for quality of herbs, I think anybody that worked in a Chinese hospital and checked the quality of herbs against what we see here in the west can testify to the lower quality. I do not think Paul Unschuld is qualified to judge quality of herbs

Alon

 

-

 

Wednesday, November 21, 2001 11:00 PM

Re: Healing Crisis...

, pemachophel2001 wrote:I'm > sure that you, like me, have heard Chinese doctors from China saying > that Americans cannot stomach Chinese herbs. Over the years, I've > heard this from any number of recent arrivals. They say that, when > they have given Americans Chinese meds seemingly appropriate for their > patterns, the Americans vomit and/or get diarrhea. More than one such > Chinese doctor has then gone on to tell me that he or she has stopped > giving Chinese meds to American patients, preferring to rely entirely > on acupuncture. My reading of this situation, based on my own > experience as a Chinese doctor treating American patients, is that, in > all probablity, these patients had Herxheimer reactions which these > Chinese doctors did not recognize as such.Interesting. I have also heard many chinese doctors say this, though the typical response I see is that they use much lower dosages with american patients to avoid reactions. The net result is that they do not get adequate short term relief for their patients, who then refuse to comply with raw herbs or even granules. Even guohui liu in the new Warm disease book makes this statement about dose, claiming americans are hypersensitive, pehaps because they are not used to taking herbs. this makes little sense to me as americans are quite used to taking strong drugs. He also suggests that the chinese export the best herbs so they have to use higher dosage of low quality herbs in the PRC. this was contradicted by Paul Unschuld who told me, on the contrary, the Chinese reserve the best herbs for themselves and export lower quality to all but the most discerning customers. So this herxheimer's idea has some merit. I have never had to resort to low dosages, nor does Heiner. But both of us have always attended closely to the issue of candida and thus work with the patient to ride this through.ToddChinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education.

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, " Alon Marcus " <alonmarcus@w...> wrote:

 

> >>>>>>There may be genetic differences. For example Chinese often need lower

doses of western pharmaceuticals.

 

then they should need lower doses of herbs, too.

 

I do not think Paul Unschuld is qualified to judge quality of herbs

> Alon

 

Why not? He has consulted with German companies and universities on

issues of determining herb purity and potency for over 30 years. He

has been to China dozens of times, much of that spent in chinese

hospitals and pharmacies. I am sure he is as qualified as you are.

 

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then they should need lower doses of herbs, t>>>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>Apparently not. And we should also consider that in most old texts the dose is very small. May be there is some kind of genetic memory. But it is a very well known fact that Asians need smaller doses of many meds.

 

I thought he is a historian?

Alon

 

-

 

Thursday, November 22, 2001 9:00 PM

Re: Healing Crisis...

, "Alon Marcus" <alonmarcus@w...> wrote:> >>>>>>There may be genetic differences. For example Chinese often need lower doses of western pharmaceuticals.then they should need lower doses of herbs, too.I do not think Paul Unschuld is qualified to judge quality of herbs> AlonWhy not? He has consulted with German companies and universities on issues of determining herb purity and potency for over 30 years. He has been to China dozens of times, much of that spent in chinese hospitals and pharmacies. I am sure he is as qualified as you are.ToddChinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education.

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I too have heard from Chinese that the Chinese export the best grades

of meds overseas for hard currency. Whatever the case may be, for the

last 10 years or so, I have stuck to the dosages considered standard

in the PRC and get better results than when I used lesser dosages. I

do not find American patients " hypersensitive " to Chinese meds, if you

factor out the occasional Herxheimer reaction. I am still of the

opinion that the Herxheimer reaction is an important phenomenon to

consider when treating with bitter, cold, heat-clearing meds, and, at

least in my experience, is not a phenomenon with which any of the

Chinese doctors I am familar with seem to be aware of.

 

Bob

 

, @i... wrote:

> , pemachophel2001 wrote:

> I'm

> > sure that you, like me, have heard Chinese doctors from China

saying

> > that Americans cannot stomach Chinese herbs. Over the years, I've

> > heard this from any number of recent arrivals. They say that, when

> > they have given Americans Chinese meds seemingly appropriate for

their

> > patterns, the Americans vomit and/or get diarrhea. More than one

such

> > Chinese doctor has then gone on to tell me that he or she has

stopped

> > giving Chinese meds to American patients, preferring to rely

entirely

> > on acupuncture. My reading of this situation, based on my own

> > experience as a Chinese doctor treating American patients, is

that, in

> > all probablity, these patients had Herxheimer reactions which

these

> > Chinese doctors did not recognize as such.

>

> Interesting. I have also heard many chinese doctors say this,

though

> the typical response I see is that they use much lower dosages with

> american patients to avoid reactions. The net result is that they

do

> not get adequate short term relief for their patients, who then

refuse

> to comply with raw herbs or even granules. Even guohui liu in the

new

> Warm disease book makes this statement about dose, claiming

americans

> are hypersensitive, pehaps because they are not used to taking

herbs.

> this makes little sense to me as americans are quite used to taking

> strong drugs. He also suggests that the chinese export the best

herbs

> so they have to use higher dosage of low quality herbs in the PRC.

> this was contradicted by Paul Unschuld who told me, on the contrary,

> the Chinese reserve the best herbs for themselves and export lower

> quality to all but the most discerning customers. So this

herxheimer's

> idea has some merit. I have never had to resort to low dosages, nor

> does Heiner. But both of us have always attended closely to the

issue

> of candida and thus work with the patient to ride this through.

>

 

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, pemachophel2001 wrote:

>

>

> I too have heard from Chinese that the Chinese export the best grades

> of meds overseas for hard currency.

 

I have heard that, too, though in hindsight I am not sure my source was

accurate.

 

 

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I have heard that, too, though in hindsight I am not sure my source was accurate

>>>>Again all you need to see is what they use in hospitals and I did. Much lower grades. The huang Qi was the grade that is sold as food in china town here.

Alon

 

-

 

Friday, November 23, 2001 7:12 PM

Re: Healing Crisis...

, pemachophel2001 wrote:> > > I too have heard from Chinese that the Chinese export the best grades > of meds overseas for hard currency.I have heard that, too, though in hindsight I am not sure my source was accurate.ToddChinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education.

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yulong wrote:

Frances,

>

> Thank you for your elucidation. I agree that this way of

viewing

> disease [as opportunity] is not widespread among modern

practitioners of

> chinese medicine.

 

Ken,

Why do you reckon this is? I'm just

curious.

>

I think that this way of viewing

disease as opportunity is rare among modern practitioners because of the

tendency to be more influenced by the western/modern medical model which

is more concerned with the cause and effect relationship that taking a

more cosmic view.

 

> > What I meant is that viewing disease

> > as an opportunity may not be a widespread

> > attitude among practitioners of Chinese

> > medicine, either here or in China. I

> > developed this attitude largely from

> > the teachers I've had, many of whom are

> > also martial artists.

> >

> In my experience, most of my martial arts teachers were/are doctors,

> but--to my disappointment--I have not found my chinese medicine

teachers

> to be students of the martial arts. I have studied only

in the

U.S.,

> with chinese and caucasian teachers, respectively.

So I look

into my

> taiji experience and studies for deeper meanings in my clinical

work.

It's certainly a good place to look.

Are you familiar with the writings of

Zheng Man Qing (Cheng Man Ching)? His

rather short essays on various aspects

of medicine and tai4 ji2 are enlightening.

 

Yes, I am familiar with Cheng

Man Ching's writings, Cheng Tzu's 13 Treatises on T'ai Chi Chuan.

He was very fortunate to have devoted students who were also good translators

and writers, so that his ideas have been widely communicated and shared,

at least among the taiji community.

>

> > I mention tai4 ji2 in this regard because

> > it includes this idea of taking advantage

> > of the disadvantageous. This of course

> > stems directly from Daoist sources, which

> > can be cited at length.

> >

>

> Yes, certainly in tai ji tui shou, one takes another's disadvantage

and

> transforms it into an advantage, or a change into another direction.

>

And when you think about it, that's what

a good doctor does as well, eh? And the

best doctors teach their patients how to

do it themselves.

 

Amen.

> > And therefore any illness can be seen as

> > an opportunity to interrupt the routine

> > ignorance of the body/mind with a penetrating

> > look to find out what has gone wrong.

> >

> And, why it went wrong when it did, why an illness happened at

a

> particular point in a person's life. There may be a deeper

symbolism

> and synchronicity to the time in one's life that a disease surfaces.

>

I can't really talk about this subject

without frequently referring to Prof.

Zheng. He called his tai4 ji2 school

Correct Timing, and it is certainly

one of the premier skills of both accomplished

doctors and boxers that they can discern

the right moment for action and stillness.

--Indeed, it is everything.

Frances

Ken

 

 

Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed

healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics

specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional

services, including board approved online continuing education.

 

 

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