Money

[Guest guest]

It is not easy to make a living at

Chinese

> medicine.

 

I disagree. 10-12 years ago, when I ran Iris Acupuncture Associates

in Boulder, CO, I was making $75K just doing acupuncture/Chinese

medicine (not counting any Blue Poppy revenue; that put me over

$100K). I believe that $75K would be more like $100K today. The issue

is one's business plan. It's not easy making money working out of a

spare bedroom in your home as many practitioners attempt to do

(and which I have also done). But, if you are willing to go into debt,

write a good business plan to get financing, and create a well run

clinic where you have several income streams (treatments, herbs,

nutritional supplements, other goods and services, such as classes,

books, videotapes, etc.), it's not that hard to live quite well with

an entirely " fee for service " practice.

 

Of course, you have to establish the practice where there is an actual

market need, not where there's scores of other acupuncturists. Then

you've got to position and market yourself effectively, and you've got

to be money savvy. All this requires some risk, but that's what

business is. No or low risks generally equal either A) working for

someone else who's willing to shoulder the risks or B) low income.

(Often both)

 

If you're not making the kind of money you would like, check out

www.100Kacupuncture.com for a start. Also read Napoleon Hill's

classic, Think and Grow Rich. Most problems with not enough money stem

from what the late Trungpa Rinpoche called " poverty consciousness. "

Another way of saying this is zero sum thinking.

 

There's a huge market for acupuncture/Chinese medicine out there.

However, the growth potential is not in San Diego, L.A., NYC, Boulder,

Madison, Portland, Santa Fe, Seattle, Austin, Ashville, etc. It's in

Grinnell, Iowa, Pueblo, CO, Deadwood, SD, and other places which are

not as attractive to live. Take Gallup, NM. It is one of the richest

per capita cities in the U.S. It's also not Taos or Santa Fe. Hell,

it's not even Alburquerque.

 

Also, as Marilyn Allen and Honora Wolfe point out, you will earn the

same average annual income as your average patient. Even in small

cities in the U.S. in the " heartland, " there are many professionals

who earn $100K per annum. So then the question is, Do you play golf or

do whatever it is that those folks do? If not, then you probably

should consider learning.

 

I guess my point is that there is a cost to earning $100K doing

acupuncture/CM in the U.S., a price to be paid. You can't just keep

doing what you're doing. If you do, you'll keep getting what you're

getting. So, to make considerably more money than one currently is,

one has to change their modus operandi. Then the question is, How much

are you willing to change?

 

Bob

[Guest guest]

, " pemachophel2001 "

> There's a huge market for acupuncture/Chinese medicine out there.

> However, the growth potential is not in San Diego, L.A., NYC,

Boulder, Madison, Portland, Santa Fe, Seattle, Austin, Ashville,

etc. It's in Grinnell, Iowa, Pueblo, CO, Deadwood, SD, and other

places which are not as attractive to live. Take Gallup, NM. It is

one of the richest per capita cities in the U.S. It's also not Taos

or Santa Fe. Hell, it's not even Alburquerque.

 

If you're better than most at what you do, you should be able to go

into any market where the growth potential is presumably saturated

and claim a piece of that market share. You shouldn't have to live

in SD for any reason.

 

Jim Ramholz

[Guest guest]

I said it wasn't easy, not impossible. One has to work to build a

practice, it is not automatic. I agree with most of your points about

location, business plan, investment. There are various models one can

use.

 

In San Diego, too many graduates are sticking around, opening up

boutique clinics with other recent graduates and not succeeding. This

is largely due to the inability of some graduates to make a presence for

themselves, and just waiting for the patients to come. Those who really

put themselves out there with enthusiasm and continue to study the

medicine seem to do fine, however.

 

I have a home clinic model, and combined with teaching, I'm in a similar

income bracket to your own. I support a large family and own a home. I

have a dedicated clinic space of two rooms, bathroom and waiting room in

a separate part of the house. The overhead is low, and I can be at home

rather that away day and night both treating patients and teaching,

which puts me at the college 15 hours or so per week. It works for me,

but it won't work for everyone.

 

I agree that we need to spread out and take up new territory in other

places than the most 'groovy' ones. The problem with this strategy is

that new graduates need mentoring with senior practitioners and

communication with their colleagues. While sites such as CHA and

post-graduate course like Blue Poppy can help, it does take a lot of

strength to go to a new, strange town and open up a clinic.

 

Is Gallup really a wealthy town? What a surprise!

 

 

On Monday, July 15, 2002, at 09:25 AM, pemachophel2001 wrote:

 

>   It is not easy to make a living at

> Chinese

> > medicine.

>

> I disagree. 10-12 years ago, when I ran Iris Acupuncture Associates

> in Boulder, CO, I was making $75K just doing acupuncture/Chinese

> medicine (not counting any Blue Poppy revenue; that put me over

> $100K). I believe that $75K would be more like $100K today. The issue

> is one's business plan. It's not easy making money working out of a

> spare bedroom in your home as many practitioners attempt to do

> (and which I have also done).

[Guest guest]

James,

 

I agree with you that, if you're better than anyone else at what you

do, you will capture a larger share of the market. But if the market

is already saturated, even a larger share may not be as large as what

you would make in a less competitive market. My point is that being

successful in business requires certain trade-offs as well as sound

business sense. I'm really tired of hearing acupuncturists blaming

everyone else but themselves for not making as much money as they

think they ought to.

 

I could make a helluva lot more money than I do if I were willing to

do radio and TV interviews, ceaselessly travel teachinjg all over

Europe, Australia, News Zealand, etc., but I'm not willing to do that.

So I know that means that I won't make as much moolah as I could if I

were willing. Knowing that, I am content with what I do make. I know

how to make more money, but I'm not willing to pay the price.

 

Bob

 

>

> If you're better than most at what you do, you should be able to go

> into any market where the growth potential is presumably saturated

> and claim a piece of that market share. You shouldn't have to live

> in SD for any reason.

>

> Jim Ramholz

[Guest guest]

Z'ev,

 

Yeah, Gallup is really a hugely wealthy town because of the market

domestically and overseas in Native American art. You wouldn't know it

by looking at it from Rte. 66, but Gallup has one of the highest

perecentages of millionaires in the U.S., or so its Chamber of

Commerce says.

 

Is there much mentoring of recent graduates going on in San Diego? I'm

not aware of much in the way of mentoring recent graduates here in

Boulder, CO. Official mentoring programs are one of the things I think

the state associations could offer members. This could be both

business mentoring and CM mentoring. Miki Shima once told me that one

of the California associations had such an official mentoring program.

Do you know anything about it?

 

Bob

 

, " " <zrosenbe@s...>

wrote:

> I said it wasn't easy, not impossible. One has to work to build a

> practice, it is not automatic. I agree with most of your points

about

> location, business plan, investment. There are various models one

can

> use.

>

> In San Diego, too many graduates are sticking around, opening up

> boutique clinics with other recent graduates and not succeeding.

This

> is largely due to the inability of some graduates to make a presence

for

> themselves, and just waiting for the patients to come. Those who

really

> put themselves out there with enthusiasm and continue to study the

> medicine seem to do fine, however.

>

> I have a home clinic model, and combined with teaching, I'm in a

similar

> income bracket to your own. I support a large family and own a

home. I

> have a dedicated clinic space of two rooms, bathroom and waiting

room in

> a separate part of the house. The overhead is low, and I can be at

home

> rather that away day and night both treating patients and teaching,

> which puts me at the college 15 hours or so per week. It works for

me,

> but it won't work for everyone.

>

> I agree that we need to spread out and take up new territory in

other

> places than the most 'groovy' ones. The problem with this strategy

is

> that new graduates need mentoring with senior practitioners and

> communication with their colleagues. While sites such as CHA and

> post-graduate course like Blue Poppy can help, it does take a lot of

> strength to go to a new, strange town and open up a clinic.

>

> Is Gallup really a wealthy town? What a surprise!

>

>

> On Monday, July 15, 2002, at 09:25 AM, pemachophel2001 wrote:

>

> >   It is not easy to make a living at

> > Chinese

> > > medicine.

> >

> > I disagree. 10-12 years ago, when I ran Iris Acupuncture

Associates

> > in Boulder, CO, I was making $75K just doing acupuncture/Chinese

> > medicine (not counting any Blue Poppy revenue; that put me over

> > $100K). I believe that $75K would be more like $100K today. The

issue

> > is one's business plan. It's not easy making money working out of

a

> > spare bedroom in your home as many practitioners attempt to do

> > (and which I have also done).

[Guest guest]

A few practitioners, including myself do take on recent graduates as

observers. I typically have about five assistants at different times

during the week, a few undergraduates who are in clinical training, and

a few who have graduated and gotten their licenses. I also go over some

of their case histories and help them develop their diagnostic and

prescription skills (for both acupuncture and herbal medicine), time and

energy permitting. I am registered as an outpatient clinic site for

PCOM as well.

 

I am not aware of any association in California that has a mentoring

program. I do know that a few of the practitioner's associations were

supportive of a one year mentoring requirement for licensure that was

dropped some time ago in the process of lobbying for increased education

requirements.

 

I think senior practitioners should take new graduates under their wing

to help them get settled into practice. I've heard nothing but good

reports from recent graduates who have done so. It also keeps something

of the old apprenticeship tradition alive.

 

 

On Tuesday, July 16, 2002, at 07:27 AM, pemachophel2001 wrote:

 

> Is there much mentoring of recent graduates going on in San Diego? I'm

> not aware of much in the way of mentoring recent graduates here in

> Boulder, CO. Official mentoring programs are one of the things I think

> the state associations could offer members. This could be both

> business mentoring and CM mentoring. Miki Shima once told me that one

> of the California associations had such an official mentoring program.

> Do you know anything about it?

[Guest guest]

I don't know how qualified I am, but I would be happy to "mentor" anyone in Corvallis, Oregon. (I really miss those "moxa slaves"...)

Veronica Christie

Angel Hands Sanctuary for

541/752-0332

pemachophel2001 <pemachophel2001 wrote: Is there much mentoring of recent graduates going on in San Diego? I'm not aware of much in the way of mentoring recent graduates here in Boulder, CO. Official mentoring programs are one of the things I think the state associations could offer members. This could be both business mentoring and CM mentoring. Miki Shima once told me that one of the California associations had such an official mentoring program. Do you know anything about it?Bob, "" <zrosenbe@s...> wrote:> I said it wasn't easy, not impossible. One has to work to build a > practice, it is not automatic. I agree with most of your points about > location, business plan, investment. There are various models one can > use.> > In San Diego, too many graduates are sticking around, opening up > boutique clinics with other recent graduates and not succeeding. This > is largely due to the inability of some graduates to make a presence for > themselves, and just waiting for the patients to come. Those who really > put themselves out there with enthusiasm and continue to study the > medicine seem to do fine, however.> > I have a home clinic model, and combined with teaching, I'm in a similar > income bracket to your own. I support a large family and own a home. I > have a dedicated clinic space of two rooms, bathroom and waiting room in > a separate part of the house. The overhead is low, and I can be at home > rather that away day and night both treating patients and teaching, > which puts me at the college 15 hours or so per week. It works for me, > but it won't work for everyone.> > I agree that we need to spread out and take up new territory in other > places than the most 'groovy' ones. The problem with this strategy is > that new graduates need mentoring with senior practitioners and > communication with their colleagues. While sites such as CHA and > post-graduate course like Blue Poppy can help, it does take a lot of > strength to go to a new, strange town and open up a clinic.> > Is Gallup really a wealthy town? What a surprise!> > > On Monday, July 15, 2002, at 09:25 AM, pemachophel2001 wrote:> > > It is not easy to make a living at> > Chinese> > > medicine.> >> > I disagree. 10-12 years ago, when I ran Iris Acupuncture Associates> > in Boulder, CO, I was making $75K just doing acupuncture/Chinese> > medicine (not counting any Blue Poppy revenue; that put me over> > $100K). I believe that $75K would be more like $100K today. The issue> > is one's business plan. It's not easy making money working out of a> > spare bedroom in your home as many practitioners attempt to do> > (and which I have also done).Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education.

[Guest guest]

" pemachophel2001 " <pemachophel2001> wrote:

 

Bob:

 

I don't doubt that relentless selfpromotion would be personally

beneficial to a new practitioner. But I wanted to bring up that

being better in your field than the average---well educated, well

trained, well read in the profession's literature, etc.---also works

to increase your income. There's no better selfpromotion than people

feeling better right off the table the first time. So I would

encourage practitioners that by working harder to be more clincally

successful in this profession makes relentless advertising less

necesary. I use only word of mouth and a yellow pages ad, and I make

enough to not to need the 100K course.

 

But I think your point has implications that are even more important

for the future of the profession at large. Isn't relentless

selfpromotion what made chiropractors mainstream? And not doing it

more often as a profession what is slowing the mainstreaming of our

profession? Do we have any coordinated advertising or selfpromotion

at the national level? Even well known, old brandname products

advertise and constantly reinvent their image for the public.

 

 

Jim Ramholz