Digest Number 1078

[Guest guest]

Fernando,

>

> Was this case in China, or here in the US?

 

USA.

 

> Was there any counseling or psychotherapy

> given to this man?

 

Not that I know of.

 

Or was the Bald Chicken

> formula enough

> to deal with such obsessive symptoms?

 

I don't know if the formula dealt

with the obsession per se. But it

did deal with the xu1 symptoms

effectively from what this fellow

told me.

 

>

> By the sound of it, this " having sex with a

> ghost " is much

> more than an occasional wet dream or fancy with

> an ex-lover.

 

It's a disease, rather, it's a description

of a diseased condition. And like so many

descriptions in Chinese medicine it reflects

ideas, values, and logic that is quite

context-dependent. When you take the term

out of context, therefore, its meaning

naturally begins to distort.

 

Ken

[Guest guest]

Stephen,

>

> Ken,

>

> Thanks for the news update. Do you have a

> perspective on the main

> differences between Traditional Tibetan and

> Chinese herbal medicine?

 

I'm glad Todd provided a bit of an overview,

because I am woefully ignorant about traditional

Tibetan medicine. There has been a center for

the study and teaching of this medicine here

in Chengdu at the TCM university for several

years now, but I've never made the time to

investigate carefully.

 

I have met a number of Tibetans as well and I

know an American doctor who spends about half

of each year working on a project in Tibet to

deal with child nutrition problems there.

 

Through these contacts I've come to know a little

about the subject, and it's not inconsistent

with what Todd described.

 

How

> different are the yao cai that are used?

 

I know there are many ingredients used in

medicinal formulas that are indigenous to

Tibet and Western Sichuan. Many of these

are common to both " systems " of medicine,

such as hong1 hua1. But some are found

only in Tibetan medicine, as far as I

know.

 

You might be able to get more detailed

information from the website of the

Tibet Child Nutrition Program:

<www.terma.org>

 

Is

> the diagnostic system somewhat

> related?

 

Hopefully, one of the other folks that mentioned...or someone else who

actually knows something about the subject

will be able to answer more fully.

 

Ken

[Guest guest]

Rey,

>

> 'Modern Chinese' or xian dai hanyu (which

> includes modern medical

> Chinese) has been 'defined' when the ancient

> classical style of

> writing or gu dai hanyu underwent substantial

> reforms after the May

> 4th Movement of l919. Hence Chinese literature

> written before the May

> 4 Movement were considered ancient classical

> Chinese literature or gu

> dai hanyu while those materials written after

> this historical event

> were considered " modern Chinese " or xian dai

> hanyu.

>

> Gu dai hanyu or classical Chinese

> literature (which encompases

> Yi Gu Wen or ancient Chinese medical

> literature) in turn includes wen

> yan wen and Gu bai hua or ancient

> vernacular(which evolved after the

> Song Dynasty).

>

> The above info is from Zhou Da Pu's book

> A Classical Chinese

> Language Teaching Dictionary Gu Dai Hanyu Jiao

> Xue Didian (l991).

> Changsha City. I also cited this material in my

> paper " The Language

> of TCM and a Unified TCM Curricullum " which I

> am trying to get into

> the CHA files.

>

 

Thanks for providing this.

 

It's remarkable how useful a few

simple standard definitions can

be.

 

For reasons I don't clearly understand

I can't access the CHA files, but as

soon as I can I'll check out your paper.

Sounds very intriguing.

 

Thanks, again.

 

Ken

[Guest guest]

 

 

> It is interesting that this formula supplements

> yang and

> nourishes essence. This type of condition

> would clearly fall

> under spermatorrhea in modern TCM, wouldn't it?

 

The " leakage " aspect would, I guess. Not

quite sure what you're getting at.

 

 

> However,

> spermatorrhea with dreams or fantasies is

> typically fire or yin xu,

> not cold or yang xu. cold or yang xu is the

> end result of the

> exessive sexual activity.

 

I think you should say, " can be " rather

than " is " . And we should note that this

result can obtain from other causes as

well. There's a reference in Who Can

Ride the Dragon? in chapter 6 about

the liability of total abstinence from

sexual activity, i.e., that one's " jade

pole " can become like a frozen snake.

 

Frances mentioned a couple days ago

the dynamic of sexual repression

coming into play in such cases, and

I think it should be borne in mind

when assessing and treating them.

 

but in the

> beginning, it is hot and

> hyperactive. this seems sensible, as desire is

> yang. yang xu

> has no desire.

 

This may be typical, but I don't think

it's accurate to state it as a categorical

fact that " yang xu has no desire. "

 

For instance, what if you see a case

of " yang xu " that has desire? Then

what?

 

 

 

>Ken makes it clear that pattern

> differentiation is

> essential. And I can't overstate this. the

> formula Ken presented

> is for cold and xu. It may worsen a hot

> condition, xu or shi.

 

And to the caveat that we've both already

noted and stressed, I'd add just one more:

be mindful of " false " signs and symptoms,

i.e., false heat and/or false cold when

dealing with such cases.

 

I don't have it in front of me, but one

of the recent past issues of CAOM includes

an article by a well known expert on TCM

diagnostics from Chengdu named Yan Shi Lin

on this dynamic of diagnosis.

 

Ken

[Guest guest]

 

Fernando:

> > By the sound of it, this "having sex with a> ghost" is much> more than an occasional wet dream or fancy with> an ex-lover.

Ken:

 

It's a disease, rather, it's a descriptionof a diseased condition.

 

Marco:

 

"it's a description of a diseased condition." is this one way of referring to the pin yin terms Bian Bing what the Chinese characters are I have no idea. Also what are the "comen" combinations of the term Bing (Ji, Yin and so forth, either put before or after).

 

what where or is the historical development and or emphasises of the term (+...) Bing (+...)

 

How is it related to Bian Zheng - pattern identification, i.e. how can one improve once knowledge and knowing Chinese medicine by understanding the (+...) bing (+...).

 

I know there was an article in Clinical Acupuncture and Oriental medicine from Shandong(?) about beginning to understand Theory related to practice and it less I am ill remembering dealt a bit with "bing" and its importance in clinical practice. I know that Steven Clavey mention in the introduction about "bing" and its importance in clinical practice. I am also aware less I am mistaking that Bob Flaws has written on the topic will investigate these sources again but as for the time of writing the concept of "bing" is not very clear, at least not to me, yes more evidence of a deficient course that I attended and or personal deficiencies, still one lives to learn...

 

 

 

Ken:

 

And like so manydescriptions in Chinese medicine it reflectsideas, values, and logic that is quitecontext-dependent. When you take the termout of context, therefore, its meaningnaturally begins to distort.

Marco:

 

How does this affect the practitioner-student needs to know more both in its original contexed and the information then possibly later being "contexilised" into "present/lacalidad" context?

 

what I am saying is that by the sound of it first one needs to know the original and original transformative contexed i.e. a historical process in order to contexulise the knowledge "here and know", just do not comprehend how?

 

Marco Bergh

 

[Guest guest]

 

Fernando:

> > By the sound of it, this "having sex with a> ghost" is much> more than an occasional wet dream or fancy with> an ex-lover.

Ken:

 

It's a disease, rather, it's a descriptionof a diseased condition.

 

Marco:

 

"it's a description of a diseased condition."

 

Is this one way of referring to the pin yin terms Bian Bing what the Chinese characters are I have no idea? Also what are the "comen" combinations of the term Bing (Ji, Yin and so forth, either put before or after).

 

what where or is the historical development and or emphasises of the term (+...) Bing (+...)

 

How is it related to Bian Zheng - pattern identification, i.e. how can one improve once knowledge and knowing Chinese medicine by understanding the (+...) bing (+...).

 

I know there was an article in Clinical Acupuncture and Oriental medicine from Shandong(?) about beginning to understand Theory related to practice and it less I am ill remembering dealt a bit with "bing" and its importance in clinical practice. I know that Steven Clavey mention in the introduction about "bing" and its importance in clinical practice. I am also aware less I am mistaking that Bob Flaws has written on the topic will investigate these sources again but as for the time of writing the concept of "bing" is not very clear, at least not to me, yes more evidence of a deficient course that I attended and or personal deficiencies, still one lives to learn...

 

 

 

Ken:

 

And like so manydescriptions in Chinese medicine it reflectsideas, values, and logic that is quitecontext-dependent. When you take the termout of context, therefore, its meaningnaturally begins to distort.

Marco:

 

How does this affect the practitioner-student needs to know more both in its original contexed and the information then possibly later being "contexilised" into "present/lacalidad" context?

 

what I am saying is that by the sound of it first one needs to know the original and original transformative contexed i.e. a historical process in order to contexulise the knowledge "here and know", just do not comprehend how?

 

Marco Bergh