Guest guest Posted August 7, 2002 Report Share Posted August 7, 2002 Marco, I share Ray's opinion that it's a very good thing that you pose basic and challenging questions. There's certainly no reason to apologize. I can get the feeling of loneliness that you describe. Not having people to interact with directly can be a great loss, but as Prof. Cheng liked to say, " Invest in loss. " As it happens I am now working on a section of a new book dealing with the meanings of some basic Chinese medical terms. And lo and behold, this morning I was working over the dan1 tian2. [Can you see this toned pinyin: d¨¡n t¨ªan?] You'll also find a bit about this term in A Brief History of Qi. I think it's in Chapter Five, the chapter about qigong. Dan1 means a lot of things. It's a color: red, the color of cinnabar, which was a favorite ingredient in Daoist longevity formulas and the famous External (or Golden) Elixir formulas that constitute on of the central themes of Daoist alchemical literature of the Sui-Tang period. It also came to be the name of cinnabar as well as general term used to describe the little pills, dan1, that were made of the formulas that contained the substance, dan1, that was red, dan1...all the same word. It now means any little pill, but it also retains its historical echoes and of course it continues to mean " elixir " as it is used to describe both the internal and external elixirs that so fascinated the Daoists in their alchemical literature. One word of caution about this literature, whether or not one reads it in the original or in translation or if one only reads expository writing about the various traditions of Daoist alchemy, there is a characteristic of the terminology and the whole manner of expression that is heavily colored with the relatively unrestrained use of metaphor. In other words, things are seldom what they seem in this territory; and often the intended meaning is nowhere to be found in the text itself, requiring that one become a kind of literary detective in order to suss out the " real " meaning. Be that as it may, the term dan1 tian2 can be fairly accurately defined, at least in so far is it has been used in both this " source " literature and a number of derivative bodies of knowledge, such as the taiji classics and indeed certain Chinese medical texts and traditions. If you don't already have a copy of Cheng Tzu's Thirteen Treatises on Tai Ch'i Ch'uan [by Prof. Cheng Man Ch'ing, trans. by Bejamin Lo and Martin Inn, North Atlantic Books, 1985] you should get one. If you can't get your hands on a copy, let me know privately. Aside from being an extraordinarily clear set of writings on taiji, it contains many of Prof. Cheng's insights and experiences in traditional Chinese medicine; and I think you'd find it not only informational but inspirational. I do. He talks about both the Gate of Life and the Cinnabar Field in various places in the book, and rather than quote them here, I'll just refer you to them. One comment I will make is that in the Daoist alchemical literature there is often mention made of three cinnabar fields: the lower dan1 tian2, the middle dan1 tian2, and the upper dan1 tian2. These are three discrete locations in the body that were all known to Daoist practitioners to be places where qi4 can be stored and refined. Another word of caution: one cannot learn about these things from reading books alone. The taiji classics contain a line that says, " To enter the door and be shown the way, you must be orally taught. " Some thirty years ago, my taiji teacher added in explanation that " orally taught " in this case means not just by word of mouth but by physical connection between teacher and student. In other words, the meaning of terms such as dan1 tian2 and Gate of Life is only partly contained in the words that have become associated with them. There are also feelings and experiences that associate with these locations in the body; and the proper study of them involves the feeling of what happens in these locations. I hope you will continue to ask the difficult questions. I'm still working on a response the point you raised about colonization/ globalization. Best, Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2002 Report Share Posted August 8, 2002 Thanks both to Rey and Ken for your responses will try to convey them to the class and it is a theme that we will return to so maybe some related questions will arise. However it just occurred to me that I wrote the word " hara " : Someone can maybe relate this concept to life gate fire and or cinnabar field(s)? or are they not interrelated, is hara a Japanese development out of Chinese source material? In other words some elaboration on hara both as a diagnostically approach or historical development-recognition of hara and what can de actual English language representative term be for hara, just like I never have contemplated that Shiatsu means finger-pressure...hara? Is hara used (relevant) both in acumoxa and natural Japanese drug therapy? Is hara diagnoses used in other Asian counties Korea (the two), Vietnam? any comments most well come.... By the way have a few responses to do of the list, my apologies for the delay... Marco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 9, 2002 Report Share Posted August 9, 2002 , " Marco " <bergh@i...> wrote: > > However it just occurred to me that I wrote the word " hara " : > > Someone can maybe relate this concept to life gate fire and or cinnabar > field(s)? In English, this is really explained best in Matsumoto & Birch's Hara Diagnosis Reflections on the Sea. > > or are they not interrelated, is hara a Japanese development out of Chinese > source material? > > In other words some elaboration on hara both as a diagnostically approach or > historical development-recognition of hara and what can de actual English > language representative term be for hara, just like I never have > contemplated that Shiatsu means finger-pressure...hara? > " Hara " is the Japanese reading (kun-yomi) of the Chinese character fu4; " fuku " is the " borrowed " or " foreign " reading (on-yomi, most Japanese words based on CHinese characters have at least two different pronunciations: a native Japanese and an approximation of a foreign -- usually Chinese -- pronunciation). The meaning of hara or fuku is really just " abdomen " or " belly " . An example is the feudal practice of ritual suicide known alternately as seppuku (qie1 fu4) or harakiri (fu4 qie1) -- both terms the same characters in different order. The term is made up of the characters " cut " and " belly " respectively, which gives one an immediate sense of the manner in which this practice was carried out. " Hara " in the Japanese vernacular is a very important concept which aside from the mystical stuff most Westerners like to speculate on means roughly the same as " guts " would mean in English. There is for example a concept known as haragei which has very similar uses to the concept of c*j*nes in Spanish. I'll leave it to the readers to speculate on any connection with Mingmen in that usage. > Is hara used (relevant) both in acumoxa and natural Japanese drug therapy? Yes, in Japan abdominal dx is a very important part of both acumoxa and natural drug therapy (kanpo). Some sources I have read feel that the use of abdominal diagnosis in Japanese acumoxa was adapted from its use in kanpo. The root of kanpo abdominal dx is SHL/JGYL. In Japanese classical acupuncture (really Sino-Japanese), known as keiraku chiryou, the abdominal dx is largely based on Nan Jing ch 16. All of this means that the practice of abdominal dx goes back at least to the later Han period. So I would say your conclusion about fukushin ( or hara dx) as a Japanese development of CHinese source material would be more or less accurate. > Is hara diagnoses used in other Asian counties Korea (the two), Vietnam? > I can't comment specifically on that, though I'd be interested to hear about abdominal examination in various countries. I do know Tae Woo Yoo incorporates some abdominal dx into the Koryo hand therapy, but whether he was influenced by people like Manaka is hard to say. Certainly Korea's long history of occupation by Japan is a significant influence (many Koreans would say negative influence), but Japan received Chinese classical culture including medicine initially from Korea, so I would be surprised if there wasn't some history of abdominal dx there. > any comments most well come.... > > By the way have a few responses to do of the list, my apologies for the > delay... > no te preocupes, chico (sorry, i couldn't resist throwing a cubanism in there). robert hayden http://jabinet.net p.s.: this email was composed with the aid of Wiseman's Glossary, which for me is indispensible in linking the Japanese and CHinese terms. No other book uses the old characters any more, and the Japanese/Chinese cross-reference is invaluable. Unfortunately I think it is out of print. Anyway, just a note of appreciation for Wiseman's work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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