Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either prophalactically before drinking, before going to bed or when you wake up and wish you were dead. Some other students and myself ran an unofficial trial of Kang Ning Wan Cu Ring pills before bed with mixed results. Unfortunately no one ageed to be the control group Any ideas or experience out there? Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 Yes, curing pills or the Kan extract works great, many of my patients swear by it, Eti Richard Blitstein <richblit wrote: Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either prophalactically before drinking, before going to bed or when you wake up and wish you were dead. Some other students and myself ran an unofficial trial of Kang Ning Wan Cu Ring pills before bed with mixed results. Unfortunately no one ageed to be the control group Any ideas or experience out there? Rich Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 Rich, > Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if > anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either > prophalactically before drinking, before going to bed or when you wake up > and wish you were dead. Some other students and myself ran an unofficial > trial of Kang Ning Wan Cu Ring pills before bed with mixed results. > Unfortunately no one ageed to be the control group > Any ideas or experience out there? Trying drinking less alcohol. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 , " Richard Blitstein " <richblit@r...> wrote: > Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if > anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either > prophalactically before drinking, before going to bed or when you wake up > and wish you were dead. Perhaps we should consider the varying etiological factors and presentations associated with hangover. No single remedy will be best for all cases because hangovers are not all caused by just the presence of alcohol in the system. Consider: 1. It is generally believed that mixing different forms of alcohol leads to much worse hangovers. So there must be something going on besides just the alcohol content. 2. alcohol leads to different effects on an empty or full stomach; hangovers with severe digestive upset often involve consumption of poor quality food concurrently. 3. Hangovers can range from severe GI sx to pounding headaches. One may have only head sx or only GI sx or they may be quite mild. One may be vomiting large quantities of undigested food another dry heaving for hours (everyone lived in a dorm at least a semester didn't they? it was pretty hard to hide the diversity of bodily responses to alcohol toxicity in those close and shared quarters). Finally, one may just have body aches and fatigue. Do these differences in presentation mean the root is different enough to warrant differing treatment? It would seems to make sense that if one consumes alcohol on an empty stomach, the immediate effect would be an accumulation of dampheat. Does this always occur or does it only occur if one consumes more alcohol thanthe spleen can digest in a given period of time. I suspect the latter, which is why a single glass of wine or beer may actually be healthful and not cause dampheat at all. But assuming one is drinking more heavily, which is what is implied by the poster, dampheat will soon begin to overwhelm the qi dynamic in the middle jiao. If food is present in the stomach already or consumed in large quantities after drinking has commenced, then the dampheat will be compounded by food accumulation. Dampheat is also aggravated by drinking very sweet or creamy alcoholic concoctions. Heat may congeal fluids into phlegm and it may waft upwards, clouding the head. If able to use individual formulas for hangovers, I have have treated some cases as purely dampheat, others as mostly food accumulation, others focusing on phlegm. As for prevention, it has a lot to do with the factors that lead to impairment of the qi dynamic. If one drinks too quickly, then the spleen/stomach will be overwhelmed. If one consumes excessive amounts of food or greasy, spicy and sweet foods at the same time, the spleen/stomach will be overwhelmed. I also think that mixing different forms of liquor overwhelms the spleen/stomach because some of these substances may interfere with the digestion of each other in some patients (fruit with grains is hard for some patients). Whatever most benefits a given patients digestion will give the most protection against alcohol. In some this may be spleen tonics, others liver qi coursing, others dampheat clearing. Because of this, reports about specific patents seem to suggest they work for some, not for others. this would seem to confirm that different patterns are involved. so bao he wan works when it is indicated and so on. For what its worth, there are reports that taking one 100 mg vitamin B-1 per drink prevents many of the head symptoms and the associated brain damage. Smart drinking can probably prevent many of the GI ones. Having said that, Ken is clearly right. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 Homeopathy remedy Nux Vomica Can be purchased at most health food stores. Take before, during or after. Works great. Susan Arnold - Saturday, November 16, 2002 2:20 PM Re: hangover remedies , "Richard Blitstein" <richblit@r...> wrote:> Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if> anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either> prophalactically before drinking, before going to bed or when you wake up> and wish you were dead. Perhaps we should consider the varying etiological factors and presentations associated with hangover. No single remedy will be best for all cases because hangovers are not all caused by just the presence of alcohol in the system. Consider:1. It is generally believed that mixing different forms of alcohol leads to much worse hangovers. So there must be something going on besides just the alcohol content.2. alcohol leads to different effects on an empty or full stomach; hangovers with severe digestive upset often involve consumption of poor quality food concurrently.3. Hangovers can range from severe GI sx to pounding headaches. One may have only head sx or only GI sx or they may be quite mild. One may be vomiting large quantities of undigested food another dry heaving for hours (everyone lived in a dorm at least a semester didn't they? it was pretty hard to hide the diversity of bodily responses to alcohol toxicity in those close and shared quarters). Finally, one may just have body aches and fatigue.Do these differences in presentation mean the root is different enough to warrant differing treatment? It would seems to make sense that if one consumes alcohol on an empty stomach, the immediate effect would be an accumulation of dampheat. Does this always occur or does it only occur if one consumes more alcohol thanthe spleen can digest in a given period of time. I suspect the latter, which is why a single glass of wine or beer may actually be healthful and not cause dampheat at all. But assuming one is drinking more heavily, which is what is implied by the poster, dampheat will soon begin to overwhelm the qi dynamic in the middle jiao. If food is present in the stomach already or consumed in large quantities after drinking has commenced, then the dampheat will be compounded by food accumulation. Dampheat is also aggravated by drinking very sweet or creamy alcoholic concoctions. Heat may congeal fluids into phlegm and it may waft upwards, clouding the head.If able to use individual formulas for hangovers, I have have treated some cases as purely dampheat, others as mostly food accumulation, others focusing on phlegm. As for prevention, it has a lot to do with the factors that lead to impairment of the qi dynamic. If one drinks too quickly, then the spleen/stomach will be overwhelmed. If one consumes excessive amounts of food or greasy, spicy and sweet foods at the same time, the spleen/stomach will be overwhelmed. I also think that mixing different forms of liquor overwhelms the spleen/stomach because some of these substances may interfere with the digestion of each other in some patients (fruit with grains is hard for some patients). Whatever most benefits a given patients digestion will give the most protection against alcohol. In some this may be spleen tonics, others liver qi coursing, others dampheat clearing. Because of this, reports about specific patents seem to suggest they work for some, not for others. this would seem to confirm that different patterns are involved. so bao he wan works when it is indicated and so on.For what its worth, there are reports that taking one 100 mg vitamin B-1 per drink prevents many of the head symptoms and the associated brain damage. Smart drinking can probably prevent many of the GI ones. Having said that, Ken is clearly right. :-)ToddChinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 16, 2002 Report Share Posted November 16, 2002 In , " Richard Blitstein " <richblit@r...> wrote: Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either prophalactically before drinking> Rich My depression formula works well when used before and during drinking. Info below. Jim Ramholz Kai Xin Wan Advanced Support for Depression, Sadness, and Repressed Emotions Function • Balance the stagnation or reversal of liver (wood) energy from emotional stress such as depression, repressed anger, and sadness • Opens qi movement between liver and heart; resolves qi in the chest (upper jiao) • Strengthens spleen and stomach TCM Pattern Stagnation of the liver, lung and heart qi due to emotional problems such as depression, frustration, sadness, etc General Application Depression, sadness, and nervous exhaustion Dosage 1 600mg capsule 2-3 times daily between meals Contraindications • In a small number of persons with strong repression or internalized emotions, this herbal formula will help bring up those feelings to be processed. If the person feels overwhelmed, increasing the dosage can help make the transition easier • Pregnant women, persons with hypertension, children under 12, or anyone using prescription drugs should consult with his or her healthcare professional before taking Ingredients Modified from the classical Chinese formula Hua T'o Hua Dian Shen Fang——Albizzia, Lilium, Ganoderma, Acorus, Gardenia, Longan, Schrophularia, Aurantium, Ginseng, Angelica, Paeonia, Schizandre, Licorice, Ophiopogon, Sinapsis, Citrus, Biota, Bupleurum, Poria, Gypsum, Pinellia, Trichosanthes, Moutan, Rheum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 17, 2002 Report Share Posted November 17, 2002 Perhaps we should consider the varying etiological factors and presentations associated with hangover. No single remedy will be best for all cases because hangovers are not all caused by just the presence of alcohol in the system. I definitely agree with this and I should have been more specific in what I meant when I said hangover. I did not mean the GI sx involved from eating "bad" foods. This however does raise the interesting point that most of the foods people crave when drunk tend to be of theIt is interesting that I tend to have a weak spleen but food intake when drinking seems to decrease the hangover I feel. damp heat variety. I wonder why the body would crave something when it has recently taken in a large amount of the same. My post was intended to focus on the head symptoms of headache and fuzzy headedness. I'm sure a great deal of this is due to liver involvement. I like the idea of tailoring a formula with some of medicinals you mentioned taking into consideration the patho-physiology you outlined. I will try it next chance I get lol Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 17, 2002 Report Share Posted November 17, 2002 No body has pointed out the irony of a Dr. Blitstein requesting a hangover remedy. That sounds like something my friends would have called me in a previous life. (no offense Richard) Patent " Shu Gan Wan " with 20 ozs of water before bed can be helpful (I'm told) Mark Costello Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 18, 2002 Report Share Posted November 18, 2002 Rich - This is a big bucks iten in Taiwan. They have all kinds of proprietary formulas for such problems. Golden cabinet recommends ban xia xie xin tang. The compainies I had contact with used ban xia hou po tang and pill curing as guiding formulas for such purposes. I say it's a worthy endeaver - try a multicenter trial among student organizations around the country. You can get the inromation at CCAOM.org or ACAOM.org for school contact. And rather than elect the control group, propose a randomising scheme and publish. Will Having just returned from the PCOM symposium last week I was wondering if anyone has run across or created a hangover remedy to be used either prophalactically before drinking, before going to bed or when you wake up and wish you were dead. Some other students and myself ran an unofficial trial of Kang Ning Wan Cu Ring pills before bed with mixed results. Unfortunately no one ageed to be the control group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.