Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 In Taiwan and Japan, the SHL formula Da Chai Hu Tang for reduction of hypertension. Will here seems to be a concern amongst my students that chai hu will raise the blood pressure. it can cause liver yang to rise, but this is not synonymous with increasing BP. In bensky, it says chai hu lowers blood pressure and all research considers it to be tranquilizing. has anyone heard or experienced otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 there seems to be a concern amongst my students that chai hu will raise the blood pressure. it can cause liver yang to rise, but this is not synonymous with increasing BP. In bensky, it says chai hu lowers blood pressure and all research considers it to be tranquilizing. has anyone heard or experienced otherwise. Chinese Herbs " Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds " -- Albert Einstein Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 , WMorris116@A... wrote: > In Taiwan and Japan, the SHL formula Da Chai Hu Tang for reduction of hypertension. Korea and America, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response curve. Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. Will > I was taught that on a low dose chai hu tends to raise blood pressure > while on high dose it tends to lower it. I wonder what research there is for this position. In japan and taiwan, the dosage of chai hu in da chai hu tang is a raw daily dose equivalent of about 10 grams per day. Even though the total formula is dosed at only 6-9 grams per day in these countries, 23% is chai hu. 23% of 9 = 2.1 X concentration ratio of 5:1 gets you about 10.5 g per day, a fairly high dose of chai hu. William R. Morris, OMD Secretary, AAOM Dean of Clinical Education Emperor's College of TOM 310-453-8383 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Jason - Yes you can ask...that doesn't assure an answer. Jesting aside, the anthroquinine content causes purging at higher doses and the tannin content tends to be active in the low dose range. There is a whole book called "Rhubarb ----" I believe the cite comes from there. Will , WMorris116@A... wrote: > Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response curve. > Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. > Will, Can I ask your ource on this one? I have never found this true and have a source from Sionneau's Dui yao that says, "up to 3 g of da huang is lightly purgative and stimulates digestion." William R. Morris, OMD Secretary, AAOM Dean of Clinical Education Emperor's College of TOM 310-453-8383 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 , <@i...> wrote: > there seems to be a concern amongst my students that chai hu will raise > the blood pressure. it can cause liver yang to rise, but this is not > synonymous with increasing BP. In bensky, it says chai hu lowers blood > pressure and all research considers it to be tranquilizing. has anyone > heard or experienced otherwise. I was taught that on a low dose chai hu tends to raise blood pressure while on high dose it tends to lower it. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Jason - I have seen binding of the bowels with low dose da huang. Also, refractory constipation is an issue for chronic self prescribers. will morris What have you seen clinically? -JAson , WMorris116@A... wrote: > Jason - > > Yes you can ask...that doesn't assure an answer. > > Jesting aside, the anthroquinine content causes purging at higher doses and > the tannin content tends to be active in the low dose range. There is a whole > book called "Rhubarb ----" I believe the cite comes from there. > > Will > > > , WMorris116@A... wrote: > > > Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response > > curve. > > > Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 , " Danny Levin <lvds@n...> " < lvds@n...> wrote: > > I was taught that on a low dose chai hu tends to raise blood pressure > while on high dose it tends to lower it. I wonder what research there is for this position. In japan and taiwan, the dosage of chai hu in da chai hu tang is a raw daily dose equivalent of about 10 grams per day. Even though the total formula is dosed at only 6-9 grams per day in these countries, 23% is chai hu. 23% of 9 = 2.1 X concentration ratio of 5:1 gets you about 10.5 g per day, a fairly high dose of chai hu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 , WMorris116@A... wrote: > Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response curve. > Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. > Will, Can I ask your source on this one? I have never found this true and have a source from Sionneau's Dui yao that says, " up to 3 g of da huang is lightly purgative and stimulates digestion. " - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Will, What have you seen clinically? -JAson , WMorris116@A... wrote: > Jason - > > Yes you can ask...that doesn't assure an answer. > > Jesting aside, the anthroquinine content causes purging at higher doses and > the tannin content tends to be active in the low dose range. There is a whole > book called " Rhubarb ---- " I believe the cite comes from there. > > Will > > > , WMorris116@A... wrote: > > > Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response > > curve. > > > Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. > > > > > > > Will, > > > > Can I ask your ource on this one? I have never found this true and have a > > source from Sionneau's Dui yao that says, " up to 3 g of da huang is lightly > > purgative and stimulates digestion. " > > > William R. Morris, OMD > Secretary, AAOM > Dean of Clinical Education > Emperor's College of TOM > 310-453-8383 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Will, what is considered a low dose of da huang- raw? I've never heard this before. -- Cara Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response curve. Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. Will > I was taught that on a low dose chai hu tends to raise blood pressure > while on high dose it tends to lower it. I wonder what research there is for this position. In japan and taiwan, the dosage of chai hu in da chai hu tang is a raw daily dose equivalent of about 10 grams per day. Even though the total formula is dosed at only 6-9 grams per day in these countries, 23% is chai hu. 23% of 9 = 2.1 X concentration ratio of 5:1 gets you about 10.5 g per day, a fairly high dose of chai hu. William R. Morris, OMD Secretary, AAOM Dean of Clinical Education Emperor's College of TOM 310-453-8383 Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Will, I am wondering , if in this case, the rhubarb is cooked longer than 10 minutes. I'm thinking about the differences between using da haung as a laxative and as a blood moving agent. Longer cooking diminishes the anthroquinone content, no matter what the dosage. -- Cara Jason - Yes you can ask...that doesn't assure an answer. Jesting aside, the anthroquinine content causes purging at higher doses and the tannin content tends to be active in the low dose range. There is a whole book called " Rhubarb ---- " I believe the cite comes from there. Will , WMorris116@A... wrote: > Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response curve. > Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. > Will, Can I ask your ource on this one? I have never found this true and have a source from Sionneau's Dui yao that says, " up to 3 g of da huang is lightly purgative and stimulates digestion. " William R. Morris, OMD Secretary, AAOM Dean of Clinical Education Emperor's College of TOM 310-453-8383 Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 9, 2002 Report Share Posted December 9, 2002 ....and Zhi Shi with its general downward directionality is used in high dosages to (lift and) prevent miscarriages. This is a somewhat recent development and one that I have only heard of being used at the Beijing University of TCM. -al. Other herbs have inverse actions at the low end of the dose response curve. Da Huang causes constipation at low doses. Will > I was taught that on a low dose chai hu tends to raise blood pressure > while on high dose it tends to lower it. I wonder what research there is for this position. In japan and taiwan, the dosage of chai hu in da chai hu tang is a raw daily dose equivalent of about 10 grams per day. Even though the total formula is dosed at only 6-9 grams per day in these countries, 23% is chai hu. 23% of 9 = 2.1 X concentration ratio of 5:1 gets you about 10.5 g per day, a fairly high dose of chai hu. William R. Morris, OMD Secretary, AAOM Dean of Clinical Education Emperor's College of TOM 310-453-8383 Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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