Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 Dear Group, Will's reference is Rhubarb: The Wondrous Drug, by Clifford M. Foust, Princeton University Press, 1992. It discusses all the complex properties of rhubarb and also traces the history of its use, including the attempts on the part of the Europeans to cultivate the "true" Chinese species. A fascinating book. Both dosing and cooking timing affect the astringent versus purging properties, but I also understand from this book that the astringency could occur at any dose and cooking: "the astringent quality is ready to undo what the purgative has done" (p. 144). Have people in this group personally experimented with rhubarb in their own bodies? I did, early on in my studenthood, with varied and interesting results. I have also given rather high doses to patients with severe constipation and sometimes NO RESULTS! Even with short cooking! I love Da Huang for all it can do, but sometimes Peach Kernel pills are more reliable. Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 My first exposure to Chinese herbs, and that of many macrobiotic folk at the time (1973) were exposed to rhubarb 'en masse' via Healing Ourselves by Naboru Muramoto and his Herb T Company. For some reason, everyone was trying out rhubarb prescriptions. . .to say the least, it cleaned you out and made you feel kind of 'high'. Mr. Muramoto was the first individual I knew to introduce Chinese herbal medicine in America, and his prescriptions were all from the Shang Han Lun. He also gave me and several others the inspiration to study Eastern medicine in more depth, as he combined his macrobiotic counceling with acupuncture (gold needles) and moxa, along with herbal medicine. He used to have a little school, the Asunaro Institute, here in California. On Saturday, December 7, 2002, at 08:36 PM, Julie Chambers wrote: > Have people in this group personally experimented with rhubarb in > their own bodies? I did, early on in my studenthood, with varied and > interesting results. I have also given rather high doses to patients > with severe constipation and sometimes NO RESULTS! Even with short > cooking! I love Da Huang for all it can do, but sometimes Peach Kernel > pills are more reliable. > > Julie > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 This is interesting below, because I just came across a book on herbal laxatives that talks about rhubarbs normalizing effects. It can be used to treat diarrhea, but will not cause constipation because at low doses it tends towards normalization, not really strong purgation or astringency. So no one would have noticed it being constipating in TCM, because it was not. It is also possible that american rhubarb is higher in tannins and lower in anthraquinones. > " Brett Jacques, ND " <Dr_Jacques > Thu Dec 12, 2002 09:50:16 AM US/Pacific > " " < > Re: rhubarb > > Hello My Friend, > > Your are correct, it is dose dependent. Remember rhubarb is high in > tannins. Tannins definitely curtail diarrhea, we all know that. The > tannin content varies with variety. An additional concept to consider > from a Naturopathic/Western Herbal perspective is that rhubarb improves > the quality of bile. So if you are secreting thin, immature bile you > will have diarrhea. Secreting thick viscous bile will lead to > constipation. Rhubarb affects both of these situations. Chinese Herbs " Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds " -- Albert Einstein Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 This is one of my questions. How different is american rhubarb from the Chinese? I know that even when the Chinese cultivate rhubarb, they have their farms at high altitude. I don't know if American rhubarb is cultivated at high altitude. I've also noticed that a lot of the rhubarb in Chinese herb clinics is wine-treated, even when the labels don't indicate it. Wine-treated rhubarb, as we know, has different effects than the raw. On Thursday, December 12, 2002, at 10:02 AM, wrote: > This is interesting below, because I just came across a book on herbal > laxatives that talks about rhubarbs normalizing effects. It can be > used to treat diarrhea, but will not cause constipation because at low > doses it tends towards normalization, not really strong purgation or > astringency. So no one would have noticed it being constipating in > TCM, because it was not. It is also possible that american rhubarb is > higher in tannins and lower in anthraquinones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 > This is one of my questions. How different is american rhubarb from > the Chinese? I know that even when the Chinese cultivate rhubarb, they > have their farms at high altitude. I don't know if American rhubarb is > cultivated at high altitude. Julie replies: According to Clifford Foust, the western cultivated rhubarb root is very different from the Chinese. The Europeans tried for centuries to duplicate the effects of the " true " Chinese rhubarb, and to cultivate rhubarb from seed, but found their climate and soil could not produce the correct purging and astringing properties of the Chinese-grown roots. It is a fascinating book about the history of rhubarb. But, is anyone in this group using American-grown rhubarb medicinally? Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 This, then raises a new issue. I would suspect that the medicinal qualities of western cultivated rhubarb will be milder, therefore more flexible vis-a-vis constipation and diarrnea then the Chinese rhubarb. Is it then fair to compare Western herbal medicine sources on rhubarb and compare them with the Chinese? On Thursday, December 12, 2002, at 11:10 AM, Julie Chambers wrote: > Julie replies: > According to Clifford Foust, the western cultivated rhubarb root is > very > different from the Chinese. The Europeans tried for centuries to > duplicate > the effects of the " true " Chinese rhubarb, and to cultivate rhubarb > from > seed, but found their climate and soil could not produce the correct > purging > and astringing properties of the Chinese-grown roots. It is a > fascinating > book about the history of rhubarb. > > But, is anyone in this group using American-grown rhubarb medicinally? > > > Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 Also, this discussion moves me wonder about the differences between American rhubarb and Rheum Palmatum (?)/ Turkey rhubarb, which is used in the formula Essiac. Does anyone have any sources for this? Cara > This is one of my questions. How different is american rhubarb from > the Chinese? I know that even when the Chinese cultivate rhubarb, they > have their farms at high altitude. I don't know if American rhubarb is > cultivated at high altitude. Julie replies: According to Clifford Foust, the western cultivated rhubarb root is very different from the Chinese. The Europeans tried for centuries to duplicate the effects of the " true " Chinese rhubarb, and to cultivate rhubarb from seed, but found their climate and soil could not produce the correct purging and astringing properties of the Chinese-grown roots. It is a fascinating book about the history of rhubarb. But, is anyone in this group using American-grown rhubarb medicinally? Julie Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 There is a substantial chapter on Rheum Palmatum in Wm H Cook's THE PHYSIO-MEDICAL DISPENSATORY (1869). (This American work, antecedent to King & Felter, is possibly still available in reprint from the Eclectic Institute.) A more recent reference (in print and available from Redwing or the American Botanical Council) is Thomas Bartram's ENCYCLOPAEDIA OF HERBAL MEDICINE from Britain, which has a concise but useful Rhubarb, Turkey entry, including some combination rx. Neal White. - Cara Frank Thursday, December 12, 2002 4:05 PM Re: Fwd: rhubarb Also, this discussion moves me wonder about the differences between American rhubarb and Rheum Palmatum (?)/ Turkey rhubarb, which is used in the formula Essiac. Does anyone have any sources for this?Cara > This is one of my questions. How different is american rhubarb from> the Chinese? I know that even when the Chinese cultivate rhubarb, they> have their farms at high altitude. I don't know if American rhubarb is> cultivated at high altitude.Julie replies:According to Clifford Foust, the western cultivated rhubarb root is verydifferent from the Chinese. The Europeans tried for centuries to duplicatethe effects of the "true" Chinese rhubarb, and to cultivate rhubarb fromseed, but found their climate and soil could not produce the correct purgingand astringing properties of the Chinese-grown roots. It is a fascinatingbook about the history of rhubarb.But, is anyone in this group using American-grown rhubarb medicinally?JulieChinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services, including board approved online continuing education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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