Muscle Testing and related esoteric diagnostic methods

July 5, 2003

Hi All,

Several people have written that they see no place for applied

kinesiology (Muscle Testing) and related esoteric diagnostic

methods in (CM). I wonder if this is fully correct?

There is weak (mainly anecdotal and experiential) evidence that

humans (and animals) have a sixth sense - call it intuition, " gut

feeling " , or what you will. There ia also some evidence.(equally

weak) that humans (and animals) can transmit signals

telepathically and that sensitive humans/animals can " read " these

signals at a distance.

In the same Pandora's box, there is (weak) evidence that some

humans can have " out-of-body " experiences (not just confined to

" near-death " experiences). Indeed, some people actively train

themselves to have such experiences.

It is a FACT that many practitioners have studied (and use) more

than one modality in their day-to-day practice. They may combine

some or all of the following: WM, surgery, chiropractic/osteopathy,

conventional dietetics, nutraceuticals, AP, Moxibustion, Gua Sha,

Massage, CHM, homeopathy, isopathy, Bach Flower Remedies,

Aromatherapy, medical hypnosis, " radionics/psionic medicine " ,

prayer, " hand healing " , etc.

Whether we like it or not, many practitioners (including some MDs

and vets) use intuitive (6th-Sense) methods to aid their Dx, AND

their selection of the most appropriate remedy/remedies. These

intuitive methods all come under the general heading of Medical

Dowsing (divination, divining).

Originaly, dowsing used traditional instruments (V-Stick, angle-

irons, pendulum, rubbing block, etc) but many adaptions exist.

These include visualisation, Voll-type instruments, NAET,

Radiaesthesia (Delawarr-type Black Box) and Applied Kinesiology

(including the Omura Bigital O-Ring Test), etc. At the risk of being

torn apart, I include TCM- or VAS- type Pulse Dx (especially when

done on a surrogate), in the realm of Dowsing.

Unpredictability and erratic results is a basic problem with most

6th Sense methods. Sometimes they work and sometimes not.

Also, some practitioners get more consistent results with them

than other practitioners get.

IMO, practitioners who uses these methods should integrate the

findings into findings reached through the more predictable senses

[sight, hearing, touch, taste and smell]. If the 6th Sense Dx

conflicts with that reached by more conventional methods, the

practitioner should be wary of dismissing the more obvious Dx.

The ETHICS of one practitioner faulting the Dx or treatment of

another is an entilrely different matter. I sympathise with ANY

practitioner whose doctor-patirnt trust was undermined in that way.

BUT, one MUST expect this to happen from time to time. The old

saying, " Doctors differ ... patients die " is true. It occurs in

allopathic (WM) practice as well as in holistic and TCM practice.

For example, I feel sure that if the most experienced TCM-Pulse

takers and CHM practitioners in CHA were to assess the Dx and

Tx of a patient treated by a less experienced practitioner, they

WOULD certainly disagree with the Dx and Tx of their naive

colleague. Where the ethical question arises is whether or not they

tell the PATIENT of that disagreement!!

Best regards,

Phil

PS: The " deep well " of Holistic Medicine is deeper than the well of

any one of its component systems, including CM, and TCM is only

one facet of CM, which embraces both TCM and modern concepts

of medicine and health.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Etti Domb wrote:

> The whole concept of muscle testing is quite abscure and very

> relative, and there is no doubt that one cannot possibly rely on it

> when practicing CM at all. It seems to me to be a way for

> practitioners who are not sure of their diagnostic skills to find

> some sort of verification. Too often I recieve invitations to

> attend seminars in systems that someone developed and is toting to

> be the best thing since magic snakeoil...One really has to wonder

> why people can't just stick to drinking from the deep well of tried

> and true CM, which alone can provide a deep satistying experience

> of healing and wholeness.

Joe Garner replied:

> Eti, I couldn't agree with you more. Muscle testing, to me, is

> only about testing muscles for anatomical/physiological problems,

> and then only if you know what to do about it to help. I would

> never use it to determine an herbal prescription or a pattern

> diagnosis or any such thing. Musculoskeletal problem muscle testing

> is a logical system based on acupuncture channels, muscle

> mechanics, and lymphatic, circulatory and nervous system anatomy

> and physiology, not something woo-woo. I like to do things that I

> can justify to anyone for logical reasons. That way, if I ever do

> have to defend what I do, I can. I don't think any of us could ever

> justify herbal muscle testing in a court of law or before a medical

> board. At least I hope we never can. I too think, as Will said,

> that this issue should be addressed in practice management classes.

> I agree with you, Eti, that there is plenty in the deep well of CM,

> more than enough to keep us going for life, especially when it is

> mixed with WM knowledge of the body.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Best regards,

WORK : Teagasc Staff Development Unit, Sandymount Ave., Dublin 4, Ireland

WWW :

Email: <

Tel : 353-; [in the Republic: 0]

HOME : 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland

WWW : http://homepage.eircom.net/~progers/searchap.htm

Email: <

Tel : 353-; [in the Republic: 0]

July 5, 2003

, " " wrote:

> Whether we like it or not, many practitioners (including some MDs

> and vets) use intuitive (6th-Sense) methods to aid their Dx, AND

> their selection of the most appropriate remedy/remedies. >>>

Phil:

When I teach, I won't even allow my students to use the word. I've

never met someone who claims to use their intuition as their main

diagnostic resource that has actually read more than one book of the

literature in their field. It's just an excuse for laziness in

studying.

Jim Ramholz

July 5, 2003

We had a similar discussion a few years back. If I remember correctly, and I, among others, agreed that intuition is the result of

intensive training and experience in a modality, and is the product of

discipline. It is similar to a great musician like John Coltrane

improvising on the base of his great mastery of the saxaphone.

On Saturday, July 5, 2003, at 10:18 AM, James Ramholz wrote:

> When I teach, I won't even allow my students to use the word. I've

> never met someone who claims to use their intuition as their main

> diagnostic resource that has actually read more than one book of the

> literature in their field. It's just an excuse for laziness in

> studying.

>

> Jim Ramholz

July 6, 2003

Phil,

Your points are all good, however I must disagree with your designation of

intuition (6th-Sense) as being used only with such tools as you mentioned. I

don't see dowsing as necessarily being intuitive. Muscle testing is

fools-gold and although you may get an intuitive hit based on the outcome of

the test, intuition can only come from experience and education (I don't

necessarily mean formal schooling).

Your assertion that all practitioners use intuition on some level is likely

true, although I think some people are afraid to let it in. However,

intuition is something that needs to be cultivated, like the soil in the

garden, plants grow bigger, stronger and faster if they are given the right

nutrients, etc. If one wants to use their intuition then using a crutch like

muscle testing is selling themselves short. Muscle testing is not a tool for

the intuition it is as Eti stated an " obscure and relative tool " that is

like going to Hong Kong and telling people you've seen all China has to

offer.

Intuition is defined by Webster's as " The instant knowing or learning of

something without the conscious use of reasoning. " By this definition the

use of muscle testing (or any of the other tools you mentioned) is not in

any way intuitive, quite the opposite. When applying muscle testing one

attempts to illicit a response to a possible source of a problem (i.e.

laying a vile of something on the chest while testing for any strength

changes). This clearly uses reasoning: " I put this vile on his chest, the

arm seems weaker, the contents of the vile must be part of the problem. "

Where is the intuition?

My first TCM and clinical teacher taught me to trust those intuitive " hits "

while putting an herbal formula together (or working with a patient on any

level). It is his belief (my understanding) that when we are connected to

the plants on a level that transcends the textbooks and the dusty dried

herbs sent halfway around the world that the plants will speak to us and

guide us to help our fellow Earth-dweller. I have come to believe this and

trust that when I find my hand on a jar that was not part of the

prescription I wrote on the paper there's a good chance it belongs in the

formula.

If one wants intuition to be a part of their practice, then throw away the

crutches and trust in the power of yourself and your connection to the

greater macrocosm but keep studying.

thomas

Chinese Herbology and Acupuncture

acupuncture and herbal information

" Knowing nothing, you will be aware of everything. "

Lao Tzu

-

" " <