Guest guest Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 All, Just after I posted my last post I opened up the little book called Approaches to Traditional Chinese Medical Literature, edited by Paul Unschuld. Great book for any who are concerned about the subject. In the introductory remarks, Paul makes mention of the 1682 translation by Andreas Cleyer of a Ming treatise on pulse diagnosis that contains the following statement in which he explains his approach to the translation: " Still, I will not at all attempt, hereafter to evaluate their principles on the basis of our own principles; rather I shall orient myself on the Chinese themselves. " This spirit seems to have been eradictaed by the ensuing three centuries of intellectual development among Western writers on Chinese medicine to a great and disturbing extent. Paul discusses the attendant difficulties and associated issues, and I highly recommend that anyone interested in this topic take a look. He does say that Cleyer's motto is still worth considering today. And indeed it is. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 A very important issue, Ken. I remember something that Marta Hansen, who is working on a Wen Bing historical text, said about creating 'a virtual Chinese Qing dynasty mindset'. In other words, trying as much as possible to inhabit the mind-space of the physicians of that time, and express that in language. It seems anthropological writers such as Marta, Francesca Brey, Donald Harper and Elisabeth Hsu seem to be more interested in this than actual practitioners of Chinese medicine. > " Still, I will not at all attempt, hereafter > to evaluate their principles on the basis > of our own principles; rather I shall orient > myself on the Chinese themselves. " > > This spirit seems to have been eradictaed > by the ensuing three centuries of intellectual > development among Western writers on Chinese > medicine to a great and disturbing extent Can't we also consider, Ken, that some modern Chinese writers and committees have also committed this faux-pas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 Ken, I appreciate your persistence in these matters. Pat ---------- Hence my dogged persistence at sussing out who is who and what is what in terms of ideas, documents, etc. that issue from that zone. Believe me, I've been up to my eyeballs in this whole thing for some time now. It's very, very complicated. Ken ============================================================================== NOTE: The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not read, use or disseminate the information. Although this email and any attachments are believed to be free of any virus or other defect that might affect any computer system into which it is received and opened, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that it is virus free and no responsibility is accepted by Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft LLP for any loss or damage arising in any way from its use. ============================================================================== Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 In Judaism, we say that sometimes one has to challenge heaven, with what is called " divine chutzpah " . I'd say Ken has divine chutzpah. You've got my vote, Ken. On Wednesday, October 22, 2003, at 02:34 PM, Emmanuel Segmen wrote: > To Ken and the list, > > I actually laid away for awhile last night wanting to say to the CHA > list in general how important I find Ken's questions. If you think > about it, Ken is incredibly impertinent in that he is attempting to > influence " teachers " regarding their attunement to CM. There are a > lot of people who teach CM on this list. I personally value this > impertinence. It's an exercise in lineage. Everyone must look at what > and who they've been studying to see that their sails are trimmed ... > or even what their sails look like. > > Thanks for allowing my impertinence to point this out. > > Emmanuel Segmen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2003 Report Share Posted October 22, 2003 Ken, I'm not sure I understand this. Can you expand on it a little? doug ______________ 's post the other day testified to > the prevalence of an attitude that > sees stares blindly inside the clinic > for the answers to all clinical questions. > > Real patients spend very little time > in the clinic. If you want to really > influence the way people lives their > lives, you have to go out and meet > them where they live, i.e., in their > own realities, in their minds as > well as in their bodies. > _____________ > Ken > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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