Guest guest Posted November 18, 2003 Report Share Posted November 18, 2003 I was reading the June 2003 Journal of . There was an article by Stefan Chmelik entitled " Pao Zhi: Preparation of Chinese Herbs. " It seemed like a basic introduction to the topic. Near the beginning of the article, Stefan was explaining different prefixes, such as chuan (sichuan region), hong (red color), and so on. Then he went on to describe sheng(1) and shu. Here is the direct quote: " Sometimes the prefix sheng and shu, as in Di Huang, are used. Sheng (uncooked) does not mean fresh or crude, nor does it mean unprepared. The main difference is that the method of preparation does not involve heat, and the herb is processed in cold water. Shu (prepared) always involves the use of heat. " (pg.16) Because he was describing prefixes in general, and because he uses the word " always " in reference to shu, it is clear that he is not limiting these terms to there use with Di Huang. Nowhere in the article is a term limited in context to one specific herb. Anyway, this struck me as odd because he says that sheng does not mean fresh. That seemed wrong to me, but also made me wonder about our (PCOM) use of sheng jiang in our pharmacy. I showed the paragraph to a Chinese teacher at school who went on to say the author was wrong. Wiseman, in the PD (pg.638) says that sheng (unprocessed) referes to medicinals not having been subject to processing of any kind, especially any that involves heating; uncooked. So, in Wiseman's definition, though he clearly states that there is no processing of any kind, for some reason, he says " especially any that involves heating. " To me, no processing means no processing, and so that qualifier was not necessary. However, maybe this was poorly written, and maybe Wiseman is aware that there are " sheng " medicinals that have been processed but without heat. Could someone shed some light on this topic? Brian C. Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 18, 2003 Report Share Posted November 18, 2003 Brian, Stefan got this definition from Philippe Sionneau's Pao Zhi: An Introduction to the Use of Precessed Chinese Medicinals. In fact, he probably got his entire course from that source. I think part of the problem is confounding the terms raw, fresh, and crude in English and then comparing these to technical terms in CM. Xian means fresh, as in freshly picked (and therefore still juicy, as in xian Ma Chi Xian or or xian Pu Gong Ying). Sheng means unprocessed (not pao-zhi-ed) by any type of heat. However, this is not the same as raw or fresh. In some cases, such as Sheng Jiang, the med is both unprocessed AND fresh or raw. But in other case, such as Sheng Gan Cao, the med is dried, although not with heat. When it comes to Sheng Jiang, the other two main types, Gan Jiang and Pao Jiang, are both processed by heat, slow heat in the first case and a stronger, quicker heat in the second. Another example to think about: Sheng Di, uncooked Di Huang, is not the same as xian Di Huang, fresh, i.e., juicy Di Huang. xian Di Huang is xian Sheng Di. Does this help? In any case, stick with Wiseman & Ye. Not every Chinese source is equally knowledgeable. Wiseman has checked each term in his dictionary against numerous other Chinese language sources as well as asking numerous live Chinese sources from both Taiwan and Mainland China. In the field of terminology, he has the intelligence, training, knowledge, and academic credentials to be a reliable authority. Just my two cents. Bob " Then he went on to describe sheng(1) and shu. Here is the direct quote: > " Sometimes the prefix sheng and shu, as in Di Huang, are used. Sheng > (uncooked) does not mean fresh or crude, nor does it mean unprepared. > The main difference is that the method of preparation does not > involve heat, and the herb is processed in cold water. Shu (prepared) > always involves the use of heat. " (pg.16) > > Because he was describing prefixes in general, and because he uses the > word " always " in reference to shu, it is clear that he is not limiting > these terms to there use with Di Huang. Nowhere in the article is a > term limited in context to one specific herb. > > Anyway, this struck me as odd because he says that sheng does not mean > fresh. That seemed wrong to me, but also made me wonder about our > (PCOM) use of sheng jiang in our pharmacy. > > I showed the paragraph to a Chinese teacher at school who went on to > say the author was wrong. > > Wiseman, in the PD (pg.638) says that sheng (unprocessed) referes to > medicinals not having been subject to processing of any kind, > especially any that involves heating; uncooked. > > So, in Wiseman's definition, though he clearly states that there is no > processing of any kind, for some reason, he says " especially any that > involves heating. " To me, no processing means no processing, and so > that qualifier was not necessary. However, maybe this was poorly > written, and maybe Wiseman is aware that there are " sheng " medicinals > that have been processed but without heat. > > Could someone shed some light on this topic? > > Brian C. Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 18, 2003 Report Share Posted November 18, 2003 , " Bob Flaws " <pemachophel2001> wrote: > Brian, > Does this help? In any case, stick with Wiseman & Ye. Not every Chinese source is equally knowledgeable. Wiseman has checked Yes, it does help, Bob. Xian conveys the concept that was in my head when I would hear the English word raw, so thanks for the clarification regarding xian vs. sheng. Brian C. Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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