microbes

[Guest guest]

http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/mycoplasma.html

 

anybody know anything about the AIDS/CFS/MNS mycoplasma connection

hypothesis.

 

this article above tries to make a case. a bit conspiratorial, but

who knows? Most of the citations are old, but that does not invalidate

them. if the author's hypothesis is correct, it explains why research

on the subject has been suppressed.

 

In any event, the mycoplasma is perhaps a better candidate for a latent

pathogen than viruses like HIV or even Hep C. But the identity of the

chronic pathogen is not so much my interest but rather the mounting

evidence that most americans are walking around with some form of slow

growing or insidious microorganism in their blood, whether HIV, hep C,

herpes, HPV, EBV, mycoplasma, etc. Whether microorganisms cause

diseases like AIDS may not be clear, but it is opportunistic

microorganisms that usually kill people with AIDS. It is likely that

some microorganism initiates most autoimmune diseases (including type 1

diabetes, MS and probably ALS), a number of cancers, perhaps 1/3 of

heart disease.

 

I have suggested in other contexts that undiagnosed slow developing

infectious diseases similar to syphilis may have been responsible for a

number of chronic presentations in ancient china that were attributed

to lifestyle (sexual excesses mainly). It is quite possible that

conditions that began as infections in ancient china and were not

recognized as such may have been responsible for a lot of harm. Now I

can imagine a patient in ancient china presenting with an atrophy

syndrome and two doctors debating whether the condition had arisen from

an internal condition of vacuity due to lifestyle of mainly from an

untreated warm disease from years ago that had lingered and done

damage. I'm not talking about a lurking pathogen here, I think. From

my reading of Liu's warm diseases, it looks as if one can develop

chronic dampheat that starts from a warm disease. But it is not

lurking, per se, because it causes recurrent sx ever since its

inception rather than remaining hidden for 30 years or something like

that.

 

The question is what is meant by dampheat. Does it refer to a state of

imbalance that may or may not involve pathogenic microorganisms or does

it always involve such infections. I would suggest that a state of

chronic dampheat in the body would always involve some abnormalities

involving microorganisms. There is actually considerable research to

back this up. Western medicine just doesn't consider things like

candida or mycoplasma or various assorted other buggers to be the cause

of any chronic illness and so does not even test for them, much less

treat them. But the documented abnormalities are always there if you

test for them. Abnormal gut flora, high or low; pathogenic bacteria in

the gut; overgrowth of yeast; these are almost a given in the

chronically ill.

 

What causes these infections? I don't know. Are they cause or effect?

In other words, do zang fu imbalances make us susceptible to chronic

infection or does chronic infection lead to zang fu imbalance? In such

cases, if infection is the root, than diet and all the rest only serve

to slow the inevitable decline. Those who do not attend to such things

go quicker, no doubt. And why is anyone sick with mycoplasma despite

such excessive antibiotic use in the US. The most common antibiotics

prescribed for bacteria do not work on mycoplasma, but there are

generic ones that do. And they must be used for long periods of time

and they can he hard on the system, but perhaps this can be offset by

combining with herbs. Or perhaps herbs alone would work. Huang bai

and huang lian are active against mycoplasma. I suspect many others

are as well. One that has gotten a lot of press is olive leaf extract.

 

As a final note, it is interesting how many chinese herbs have

antimicrobial activity, including tonics and blood movers and exterior

releasers and transform phlegm and clear heat, just about every

category has antimicrobial herbs in it. It make me wonder how the

antimicrobial activity of just about any herbal decoction figures into

its overall action.

 

 

 

Chinese Herbs

 

 

FAX:

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/6/2004 6:06:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

writes:

What causes these infections? I don't know. Are they cause or effect?

 

INMHO,,,they are actually both.

 

Some scientists would say that do to the ionic charge in the blood being

diminished, proteins and other things like platelets, plague and red blood

cells, will tend to coagulate causing all sorts of problems. We can see them in

" Live Cell Microscopy " ,,, which I do.

 

Given the " divine " nature of life, the proteins tend to form patterns

that are found throughout life as they fit together. Pre bacterial and fungal

forms. These were the first life forms on the planet because the original

proteins started sticking together in a particular way. I believe the same

process

happens in the blood in the same way as long as the environment within the

blood allows.

 

If you allow the possibility of the above example, there would be no

surprise that as people develop diseases after years of imbalance, the ionic

charge in their blood will tend to be compromised and these protein combinations

or

" Microbes " can be found all over.

 

So are we being infected???? Yes, but many times from the inside, and

only because the environment supports the coming together of these protein

forms. Change the environment and the forms, which are really quite delicate,

will

start dividing and become simple protein blocks again.

 

Simple and quick over view of a rather involved topic.

Hope it made sense,

 

Chris

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Chris

>>>>chris can you point me to any controlled information that shows that what

you guys see with dark field is actually known and not made-up

Alon

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/7/2004 12:27:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

alonmarcus writes:

Chris

>>>>chris can you point me to any controlled information that shows that what

you guys see with dark field is actually known and not made-up

Alon

 

 

That would be difficult for several reasons. One reason, and it is a

biggy, is that there really aren't a lot of people involved with it. I believe

most that do get involved are in it to help people and are not concerned with

" proving " what we are seeing to the Government or anyone else. Another reason

is that for universities or other institutions to get involved, they would

basically get to admit that there are formations in the blood caused by issues

outside what standard medicine accounts for. Who is going to fund it???? There

is more likely going to be money set aside to fight the availability of this

tool rather than proving there may be some validity to it.

 

That said,,,,,,I am quite sure that a lot of what many well meaning live

blood therapists talk about with their patients, comes form conjecture and

assumption and is unfortunately bogus. Although, even with these potential

misunderstandings, people are likely to get better with the information given by

the several training's that I have gone to. Primarily because all the

training's show the therapist at minimum how to increase the patients

nutritional

intake, detox capabilities and digestive capabilities.

 

I personally do my best to keep my explanations away from any definite

explanations of exactly naming what we are seeing and steer people into the

understanding of how the things we are seeing are a result of lifestyle and

guide

people into a healthy lifestyle with some possible supplement recommendations

I decide upon because of the many questions that I ask and other training I

integrate.

 

*** I will say that as the blood sample sits on the slide, I will see many

changes. *** Some of the changes are the formation of " strands " of what I

believe to be proteins coming together. Some of these protein formations look

like cells that WM has labeled as candida, and a few forms of bacteria. Some

well meaning therapists will state that these " are " candida and different

bacteria's. I do not go that far.

 

What I do say is that as a person changes their lifestyle and includes

what I determine to be healthy for that individual, these formations will likely

not appear any more and they will likely feel much better. This is usually

true.

 

There is a basic argument I try to balance when I treat people. " We are

sick because something has attacked us and we are sick because the internal

environment has allowed critters a good home. " A side note is that if we have

allowed critters a good home, there are going to be numerous biochemical

pathways that are compromised and this will need to be dealt with.

 

I believe we need to remember that both sides of the augment are true and

each individual will have their own unique challenges.

 

A simple explanation of part of how is see it,

 

Chris

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/11/2004 1:08:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

writes:

, Musiclear@a... wrote:

 

>

> So are we being infected???? Yes, but many times from the inside, and

> only because the environment supports the coming together of these protein

> forms. Change the environment and the forms, which are really quite

delicate, will

> start dividing and become simple protein blocks again.

 

 

Protein forms as you describe would not have genetic material, would they?

They could

not be grown outside the lab and are not living things that self-replicate.

If you claim

these protein forms have such properties, then I would need more info to back

this up.

 

 

Keep in mind that I am not indicating that I know what is going on. But,

there are some interesting possibilities with what I see on the slide.

There is definitely some joining together of something, most likely

proteins making " forms " that look like some bacteria, fungus and yeast. There

is

no getting around that one. It does happen. I watch it every day. The

questions I have are why do they come together and do they interact in some why

with

our health?

I agree that strictly speaking, there would appear to be no genetic

material involved in the above example. However, I believe there is a lot of

genetic material floating around the blood from all sorts of damaged cells and

digestive absorption.

There is also a nagging question in the back of my mind of,,, when the

earth went through the transition of a dead molten rock to a life providing

environment, where did the life forms come from. There was no life, then there

was. I don't have a definite answer to that. I will say I believe that

there is a push in this universe towards creating life. In the beginning

something happened to promote life from a rock with no proteins, to supporting

all

the life we see around and within us today.

I do not believe we need to have a man, or women to manufacture a genetic

structure for their to be a genetic structure. I don't think there is any

question that there is cross contamination of critters from one species to

another. How much of a jump in reasoning is it to assume that sometimes there

will

be a mutation between the host cell and the invading pathogen?

I don't know what you think of this, but there is a fairly large

scientific community that beliefs that the mitochondria within our cells were

really a

parasite invader millions of years ago.

To recite a line from one of my favorite stupid movies, " Life will find a

way " .

Believe me when I say I know this is a bunch of vague conjectures. It is

intended to potentially open the door to the possibility that not only does

life mutate out side the body, it mutates within. Given the abundance of raw

material within the body, I believe there is an infinite potential for the

combination of genetic material for all sorts of interesting new life forms

within

the body. We know this happens outside the body. Why not within?

 

Cheers,

 

Chris

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

, Musiclear@a... wrote:

 

>

> So are we being infected???? Yes, but many times from the inside, and

> only because the environment supports the coming together of these protein

> forms. Change the environment and the forms, which are really quite delicate,

will

> start dividing and become simple protein blocks again.

 

 

Protein forms as you describe would not have genetic material, would they? They

could

not be grown outside the lab and are not living things that self-replicate. If

you claim

these protein forms have such properties, then I would need more info to back

this up.

 

[Guest guest]

It depends on the vaccine. Some utilize proteins from the shells of

viruses, some use killed or weakened viruses or bacteria, some use

toxins produced by disease-causing organisms.

 

 

On Sep 11, 2004, at 10:52 AM, Musiclear wrote:

 

> Protein forms as you describe would not have genetic material, would

> they?

> They could

> not be grown outside the lab and are not living things that

> self-replicate.

> If you claim

> these protein forms have such properties, then I would need more info

> to back

> this up.

>