Guest guest Posted November 20, 2004 Report Share Posted November 20, 2004 I thought some might be interested in these statistics. They reflect the exact wording of queries made to search engines in the past 8 weeks. I won't bore you with raw numbers, but rather I'll select searches for acupuncture as the baseline point for comparison. Acupuncture actually gets quite a few searches. To compare to commonly searched items or recent news events, acupuncture got 3 times as many hits as fallujah, but 12 times less than iraq. To gain even more perspective, acupuncture got 20 times less hits than ashley simpson (some lip syncing debacle) to 5 times less hits than the ever popular girls gone wild. Finally, acupuncture got 6 times less hits than Oprah and 8 times less than election. I think that should give Americans who watch TV an idea of where Acupuncture fits into pop culture priorities. So while obviously many more people are interested in the fate of pop stars than they are about acupuncture, more than twice as many are interested in Acupuncture as they are in american politics. Of course, it is not a scientific survey, but the sheer volume of data is telling and certainly sways marketers. While that is all well and good, the numbers are not near as good for herbology. Herbal medicine got about half the hits that acupuncture did. Chinese herbs got 1/7. Chinese herbal medicine got 1/30 (Chinese herbology gets 10 times less than that). Chinese medicine got 1/6. Traditional got 1/17. Medicine only got 5 times more and alternative medicine and chiropractic both got about twice as many hits each. Oriental medicine got 1/40 the hits as acupuncture, barely a blip. Most of them were specific searches for schools with Oriental in the name. This suggests to me there is far more interest in acupuncture than there is for in general and Chinese Herbs in particular. While chinese herbs is a reasonably well searched term, chinese herbal medicine is not. Very ew people search specifically for information on professional chinese herbal medicine (in fact no one searches for that term) as opposed to those just looking to buy herbs in most cases. It seems that we do barely exist on the public radar as a distinct and essential type of practice within OM. I think this is yet more evidence that until and unless we do research demonstrating the efficacy of chinese herbology, our role in modern medicine will be small. Chinese Herbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2004 Report Share Posted November 20, 2004 On Nov 20, 2004, at 2:19 PM, wrote: > This suggests to me there is far more interest in acupuncture than > there is for in general and Chinese Herbs in > particular. Acupuncture as a search term has the benefit of being limited to pretty much two words: acupuncture and accupuncture. However the herbal category is going to be diffused by all the variations, some of which you checked into yourself. Things may not be as bleak as they seem. Lot's of people search for their symptoms or their diagnosis plus " holistic " or " natural " in their searches. To many, holistic can mean " herbal " . -al. -- Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. -Adlai Stevenson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2004 Report Share Posted November 20, 2004 , Al Stone <alstone@b...> wrote: > > Lot's of people search for their symptoms or their diagnosis plus > " holistic " or " natural " in their searches. To many, holistic can mean > " herbal " . Al I don't dispute that. But it also means lots of other things like flower essences and colonics. Neither natural or holistic medicine rank that highly themselves, but they do indeed inflate the herb search stats somewhat, I'm sure. But my point is that chinese herbal medicine or even chinese medicine or OM are not really recognized as distinct entities by many searchers. They are subsumed to either acupuncture or alternative or herbal medicine in general. I think we need to really distinguish ourselves from all of this in order to develop with credibility. While I think joint acupuncture/OM research should be done, I also think chinese herb research must be done independently. I hate to say this, but the current state of affairs in acupuncture research will just drag us down. I am honestly surprised that despite the constant self-congratulatory rhetoric I read about our penetration into the mainstream, so few people still search for info directly on chinese herbal medicine. We have done a really poor job educating the public. I would venture to say a disproportionate amount of time has been spent promoting acupuncture at the expense of herbology to the detriment of our profession and the public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2004 Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 On Nov 20, 2004, at 11:18 PM, wrote: > But my point is that chinese herbal > medicine or even chinese medicine or OM are not really recognized as > distinct entities by many searchers. They are subsumed to either > acupuncture or alternative or herbal medicine in general. I think we > need to really distinguish ourselves from all of this in order to > develop with credibility. It might be interesting to see how the keywords of Chinese herbal medicine and its derivatives pan out in the UK search engines where Chinese herbs seem to be synonymous with dermatology. What happened in the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the hearts and minds of the American psyche. -- Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. -Adlai Stevenson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2004 Report Share Posted November 23, 2004 , Al Stone <alstone@b...> wrote: What happened in > the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the hearts > and minds of the American psyche. > pleae elaborate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2004 Report Share Posted November 23, 2004 On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > , Al Stone <alstone@b...> > wrote: > What happened in >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the >> hearts >> and minds of the American psyche. >> > > > pleae elaborate. I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular in the UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done something right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when people think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in the same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they think about herbs. -al. -- Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. -anonymous email. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2004 Report Share Posted November 23, 2004 What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done using Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic results that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological conditions. The study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later became affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by the way are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in NY). He treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very good results. Marnae At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > , Al Stone <alstone@b...> > > wrote: > > What happened in > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the > >> hearts > >> and minds of the American psyche. > >> > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular in the >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done something >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when people >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in the >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they think >about herbs. > >-al. > >-- > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. >-anonymous email. > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2004 Report Share Posted November 23, 2004 Here is one of the cites: Lancet. 1992 Jul 4;340(8810):13-7. Efficacy of traditional Chinese herbal therapy in adult atopic dermatitis. Sheehan MP, Rustin MH, Atherton DJ, Buckley C, Harris DW, Brostoff J, Ostlere L, Dawson A, Harris DJ. Department of Dermatology, Royal Free Hospital and School of Medicine, London, UK. There has been considerable interest in traditional Chinese herbal therapy (TCHT) as a new treatment for atopic dermatitis. To establish the efficacy and safety of this treatment, a daily decoction of a formula containing ten herbs that has been found to be beneficial in open studies was tested in a double-blind placebo-controlled study. 40 adult patients with longstanding, refractory, widespread, atopic dermatitis were randomised into two groups to receive 2 months' treatment of either the active formulation of herbs (TCHT) or placebo herbs, followed by a crossover to the other treatment after a 4-week washout period. The main outcome measures were extent and severity of erythema and surface damage as judged by standardised body scores. The patients' own assessments of the overall response to treatment were also sought. The geometric mean score for erythema at the end of active treatment was 12.6 (95% confidence interval [CI] 5.9 to 22.0) and at the end of the placebo phase was 113 (65 to 180). The geometric mean score for surface damage was 11.3 (5.8 to 21.8) and 111.0 (68 to 182), respectively. The 95% CI for the mean geometric ratio for the two values with active treatment was 0.04 to 0.22 for erythema (p less than 0.0005) and 0.04 to 0.27 for surface damage (p less than 0.0005). Of the 31 patients who completed the study and expressed a preference, 20 preferred that phase of the trial in which they received TCHT whereas 4 patients preferred placebo (p less than 0.02). There was a subjective improvement in itching (p less than 0.001) and sleep (p less than 0.078) during the TCHT treatment phase. No side-effects were reported by the patients although many commented on the unpalatability of the decoction. TCHT seems to benefit patients with atopic dermatitis. Palatability of the treatment needs to be improved and its safety assured. Publication Types: * Clinical Trial * Randomized Controlled Trial PMID: 1351600 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] At 05:52 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: >What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done using >Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic results >that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological conditions. The >study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of >Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later became >affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by the way >are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the >opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in NY). He >treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very good results. > >Marnae > >At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: > > >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > , Al Stone <alstone@b...> > > > wrote: > > > What happened in > > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the > > >> hearts > > >> and minds of the American psyche. > > >> > > > > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > > > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular in the > >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done something > >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when people > >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in the > >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they think > >about herbs. > > > >-al. > > > >-- > > > > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. > >-anonymous email. > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2004 Report Share Posted November 23, 2004 With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. -- In , Marnae Ergil <marnae@p...> wrote: > What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done using > Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic results > that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological conditions. The > study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of > Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later became > affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by the way > are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the > opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in NY). He > treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very good results. > > Marnae > > At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: > > >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > , Al Stone <alstone@b...> > > > wrote: > > > What happened in > > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the > > >> hearts > > >> and minds of the American psyche. > > >> > > > > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > > > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular in the > >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done something > >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when people > >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in the > >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they think > >about herbs. > > > >-al. > > > >-- > > > > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. > >-anonymous email. > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2004 Report Share Posted November 23, 2004 last year when I recommended CS (a dietary supplement) be applied to the skin the FDA warned me (in a letter) that dietary supplements must be administered orally. Since we prescribe herbs as dietary supplements is the FDA correct? Ed Kasper Tue, 23 Nov 2004 14:08:24 -0800 Al Stone <alstone Re: interest in OM On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > , Al Stone <alstone@b...> > wrote: What happened in the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the hearts and minds of the American psyche. > pleae elaborate. I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular in the UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done something right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when people think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in the same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they think about herbs. -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2004 Report Share Posted November 24, 2004 Hi Alon Im not sure but I will ask him on tues when I next go thanks , " Alon Marcus " <alonmarcus@w...> wrote: > With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque > psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years > after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I > personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. > > >>>>>Is he using lei gong teng in your formula? > Alon > - > nellshania > > Tuesday, November 23, 2004 3:30 PM > Re: interest in OM > > > > > With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque > psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years > after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I > personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. > > -- In , Marnae Ergil <marnae@p...> > wrote: > > What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done > using > > Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic > results > > that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological > conditions. The > > study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of > > Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later > became > > affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by > the way > > are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the > > opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in > NY). He > > treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very > good results. > > > > Marnae > > > > At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: > > > > >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Al Stone > <alstone@b...> > > > > wrote: > > > > What happened in > > > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into > the > > > >> hearts > > > >> and minds of the American psyche. > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > > > > > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular > in the > > >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done > something > > >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when > people > > >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in > the > > >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they > think > > >about herbs. > > > > > >-al. > > > > > >-- > > > > > > > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. > > >-anonymous email. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > including > > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference > and a > > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2004 Report Share Posted November 25, 2004 -Alon, After looking up the herb I see it is considered by some to be toxic. Was this your concern? thanks-- In , " Alon Marcus " <alonmarcus@w...> wrote: > With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque > psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years > after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I > personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. > > >>>>>Is he using lei gong teng in your formula? > Alon > - > nellshania > > Tuesday, November 23, 2004 3:30 PM > Re: interest in OM > > > > > With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque > psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years > after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I > personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. > > -- In , Marnae Ergil <marnae@p...> > wrote: > > What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done > using > > Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic > results > > that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological > conditions. The > > study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of > > Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later > became > > affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by > the way > > are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the > > opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in > NY). He > > treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very > good results. > > > > Marnae > > > > At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: > > > > >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Al Stone > <alstone@b...> > > > > wrote: > > > > What happened in > > > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into > the > > > >> hearts > > > >> and minds of the American psyche. > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > > > > > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular > in the > > >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done > something > > >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when > people > > >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in > the > > >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they > think > > >about herbs. > > > > > >-al. > > > > > >-- > > > > > > > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. > > >-anonymous email. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > including > > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference > and a > > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2004 Report Share Posted November 25, 2004 Hi Alon, I rang the clinic and No that herb has not been used in my treatment. thanks- -- In , " Alon Marcus " <alonmarcus@w...> wrote: > With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque > psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years > after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I > personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. > > >>>>>Is he using lei gong teng in your formula? > Alon > - > nellshania > > Tuesday, November 23, 2004 3:30 PM > Re: interest in OM > > > > > With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque > psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years > after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I > personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. > > -- In , Marnae Ergil <marnae@p...> > wrote: > > What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done > using > > Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic > results > > that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological > conditions. The > > study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of > > Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later > became > > affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by > the way > > are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the > > opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in > NY). He > > treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very > good results. > > > > Marnae > > > > At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: > > > > >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Al Stone > <alstone@b...> > > > > wrote: > > > > What happened in > > > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into > the > > > >> hearts > > > >> and minds of the American psyche. > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > > > > > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular > in the > > >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done > something > > >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when > people > > >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in > the > > >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they > think > > >about herbs. > > > > > >-al. > > > > > >-- > > > > > > > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. > > >-anonymous email. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > including > > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference > and a > > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2004 Report Share Posted November 25, 2004 With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. >>>>>Is he using lei gong teng in your formula? Alon - nellshania Tuesday, November 23, 2004 3:30 PM Re: interest in OM With reference to Mr Al-Khafaji- he is treating me for Plaque psoriasis and having suffered the condition extensively for 30 years after 17 weeks of herbs I have about 3% left which is also clearing,I personally am amazed after trying so many other ways to clear it. -- In , Marnae Ergil <marnae@p...> wrote: > What happened was that in the early 80's (I think) a study was done using > Chinese herbs for the study of eczema and there were such dramatic results > that Chinese herbs became associated with dermatological conditions. The > study was published in Lancet and in the British Journal of > Dermatology Mazin Al-Khafaji talks about this study - he later became > affiliated with the study - in his dermatology courses, which by the way > are absolutely fabulous and well worth taking if you ever have the > opportunity. (He just recently completed a second weekend here in NY). He > treats about 80% dermatology patients in his clinic and has very good results. > > Marnae > > At 05:08 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote: > > >On Nov 23, 2004, at 1:57 PM, wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > , Al Stone <alstone@b...> > > > wrote: > > > What happened in > > >> the UK may serve as a sort of template for bringing TCM into the > > >> hearts > > >> and minds of the American psyche. > > >> > > > > > > > > > pleae elaborate. > > > >I don't know what happened, but I do know that herbs are popular in the > >UK for dermatological conditions. Someone must have done something > >right because I've read on a few separate occasions that when people > >think about Chinese herbs in the UK, they think of dermatology in the > >same way that Americans think of oh, I dunno, energy when they think > >about herbs. > > > >-al. > > > >-- > > > > > >Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional. > >-anonymous email. > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 2004 Report Share Posted November 27, 2004 After looking up the herb I see it is considered by some to be toxic. Was this your concern? >>>Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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