Guest guest Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 What is it that you feel needs to change with the education in the west? Are we talking about western science courses or more Chinese medical theory? >>>Both need to be expended in a more clinical sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 My apologies to reply to some of this discussion late - I don't check in frequently. The University of Western Sydney Masters of Acupuncture and Masters of TCM I described as 'real' in the context of Australian tertiary education - it is equivalent to other coursework Masters. It is not like the TCM Masters offered at other Australian universities which offer a basic herb education to acupuncturists or basic acupuncture for other health practitioners like doctors and nurses. It may not be equivalent to a Chinese Masters - although I could say a bit about the quality of them! [My experience is that the Masters of TCM in China has partly become an opportunity to increase your likelihood of employment - many graduate TCM doctors are not getting work, or they are being 'juniors' for many years in TCM out-patient departments.] Yes the UWS does not have a clinical component - but it is taught by experienced clinicians who extend students clinical knowledge (all students are practitioners and bring their own experience to the educational forums). Currently it is only offered part-time with a mixture of online and workshops. The workshops are grouped at the beginning and end of each semester to allow students from distant places to leave their clinics and be in Sydney for 4-6 days depending how many units they are studying. It is planned to offer it full-time in one year but this will be a challenge for any student. Other post-graduate study is going on at the UNit at UWS and there are research Masters and PhDs enrolled there. Whether this is as high a standard as we would like or perhaps need depends partly on the practitioners/students involved. It is certainly higher than that offered elsewhere in Australia. There is some research I believe that it is experience in clinic which takes over after 5 years from education as the main determinant of quality service delivery. In the privatised nature of TCM in the West where we don't have many employment opportunities for new graduates in a supported and supervised environment learning on our patients seems inevitable. regards Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 David, " It is a generally fair assessment that our standards for TCM vary so greatly that some form of standarization would better serve our community. " What would you propose and why? Setting standards too rigid will no doubt further limit access and development of other styles of acupuncture and OM. Practitioner development should be looked as it is impacted by the current educational system. I was a witness to a decline in quality do to this change from hands-on to more book learning. Schools might want to look more at improving this aspect. " First, our skills as Western diagnosticians are in question " That is because most programs have errrantly tried to separate western medicine from TCM. TCM is an amalgation of both western and eastern medicine. Having said this, makes it all the more important to have a strong western scientific understanding like our Asian colleagues. The chiro colleges changed their emphasis to include large numbers of hours in western sciences and so should we. This is not a replacement for our theories only a support. " Acupuncture Board could actually serve us by assisting in the establishment of CEU's by category " If you are referencing the CA Acu Bd they have been working on this very issue. Reported in current online issue of acupuncturetoday.com in article on LHC report. We should be aware that the job of any state regulating board is not to help us but to protect the public from risk. Lastly,the MD may feel uneasy about actual practice for many reasons such as starting to pay off student loans, actually being responsible for another's health decisions, or due to a lack of actual time spent on their bedside manners. They overemphasize book learning and memorization. We should be cautious of following this trend. Our development is important for our effectiveness. Later Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > " David O " <davidoinca > > >Re: Masters of CM in Australia >Sun, 12 Dec 2004 17:42:41 -0000 > > > >This is my first look into this group, as I have just joined. The >more than dozen posts I received this weekend speak of the passion >many share on this topic. > >I do have a comment. There are specific complaints about our >educational requirements not including essential diagnostics. It is >a generally fair assessment that our standards for TCM vary so >greatly that some form of standarization would better serve our >community. We're at a crossroads where the bar needs to be raised >with regard to entry level competency. > >Many MD's speak of their basic education as being barely enough to >feel comfortable (competent) practicing out of the shoot. " See one, >do one, teach one. " Specialization and a narrowing of practice gets >them closer, as does experience and continuing education. > >Prioritizing our needs as a profession seems to be necessary. First, >our skills as Western diagnosticians are in question, this being the >most imminent threat to our viability. Second, the TCM minimum >skills or standards should be addressed. To that end, our >Acupuncture Board could actually serve us by assisting in the >establishment of CEU's by category, insuring maintenance of standards >in perpetuity. Incidentally, rumors of threatened lawsuits against >schools who are jeopardizing our future as practitioners by >offering " sub-standard " programs (whether they actually do or not) >will only fuel the flames by putting our core program under the >microscope. It is my opinion that this dirty laundry should be >handled within the profession after other concerns from without are >addressed. > >Respectfully, >David O. > > , " Alon Marcus " ><alonmarcus@w...> wrote: > > > > Having now noted this, what do educational titles actually function >to > > convey there if not ones education level > > >>>Well they do but obviously used differently in different >countries > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2004 Report Share Posted December 15, 2004 Clinical rellevance is quite a problem for all schools that teach healthcare providers. One interesting note is that SIOM in Seattle created a new model of education (tested this for last 10 years) that is based upon clinical training. Everything revolves around this aspect. I like this idea as it seems that our discussions have come to this topic many times. Maybe the other schools should consider this model as well. Later Mike W.Bowser, L Ac > " Alon Marcus " <alonmarcus > > >Re: Masters of CM in Australia >Mon, 13 Dec 2004 06:24:06 -0800 > >What is it that you feel needs to change with the education in the west? >Are we talking about western science courses or more Chinese medical >theory? > >>>Both need to be expended in a more clinical sense. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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