Interesting Crohn's disease cure

January 19, 2005

In a message dated 1/19/2005 8:49:56 AM Eastern Standard Time,

writes:

Over the holidays I ran into an old friend who had been suffering from

Crohn's disease for quite some time. Over the course of the disease he had

lost probably 50 pounds and would frequently lose large amounts of blood.

He said he had cured himself and had been symptom-free for over a year. His

cure? Smoking large amounts of marijuana daily... he said he actually

researched this 'protocol' before engaging, but originally (I think) the

research done was on smoking cigarettes. Either way I find this

fascinating, because he had tried everything under the sun, but am having a

hard time understanding the TCM pathomechanism underlying this 'cure'...

comments?

-- Jason

From what I understand, pot smoking is cool, maybe considered, cold which

may relieve the heat symptoms from Crohn's.

On the other hand, with Crohn's, there is likely an immune response to

food or an infection of some sort in the gut. Pot will likely suppress the

immune system and mediate the reaction to the offending food or infection and

lesson the inflammation and symptoms.

Just a guess,

Chris

January 19, 2005

Jason,

The munchies brought on by his marijuana smoking may have facilitated

his gaining back his previous weight.

Is marijuana cooling even when it's smoked?

Frances Gander

Athens, OH

January 20, 2005

Correcto.

Bob

January 20, 2005

>

> Bob Flaws [pemachophel2001]

> Thursday, January 20, 2005 10:36 AM

>

> Re: interesting Crohn's disease cure

>

> Correcto.

>

> Bob

[Jason]

What is??

-JAson

January 21, 2005

> [Jason]

> Where is this from? Pot smoking may be cool, in some circles, but I

would

> never think that it would be cooling or cold. If anything it stirs

> ministerial fire and creates heat in the body, IMO. One just need

to look

> at the side effects after smoking to see this... but maybe you have

had a

> different experience that you would like to share that illustrates

> marijuana's cold nature...

Cannabis can produce a dry mouth and redness of the eyes, and the act

of smoking would logically produce local lung heat, or at least damage

to lung yin. However, do you see evidence that it produces systemic

heat of any type? Why do you think that it stirs ministerial fire?

The zhong yao da ci dian only describes the male flowers (not

prevalently used in modern Chinese medicine, nor in the West) as being

warm. The female flowers are listed as balanced, as are the seeds.

I've heard many people say that cannabis is cool or cannabis is warm,

but I am not aware of all that much primary literature that supports

either side.

Eric

January 23, 2005

Eric,

From my understanding of Dong-yuan's yin fire theory, anything that

creates excitement, speeds up heart beat, arouses sexual desire, opens

the senses, and intensifies pleasure is liberating jing-essence from

the kidneys and shunting mingmen fire up towards the upper burner.

On Jan 21, 2005, at 5:54 PM, smilinglotus wrote:

>

> Cannabis can produce a dry mouth and redness of the eyes, and the act

> of smoking would logically produce local lung heat, or at least damage

> to lung yin. However, do you see evidence that it produces systemic

> heat of any type? Why do you think that it stirs ministerial fire?

January 24, 2005

, " "

<zrosenbe@s...> wrote:

> Eric,

> From my understanding of Dong-yuan's yin fire theory, anything that

> creates excitement, speeds up heart beat, arouses sexual desire, opens

> the senses, and intensifies pleasure is liberating jing-essence from

> the kidneys and shunting mingmen fire up towards the upper burner.

>

Thanks for the clarification. I haven't undertaken as detailed a

study on Li Dong-Yuan's yin fire theory as you have, so some of the

concepts that you mentioned were new to me. I was under the

impression that the primary symptoms of stirring ministerial fire were

related to increased sexual desire and seminal emission. I haven't

studied it as much from a historical perspective, but modern basic

Chinese texts describe the following:

" In insufficiency of liver-kidney yin, the ministerial fire can become

hyperactive, giving rise to a condition known as stirring of

ministerial fire, which is characterized by dizziness, headache,

unclear vision, tinnitus, deafness, irascibility, profuse dreaming,

vexing heat in the hearts and palms, seminal emission, and premature

ejaculation. This condition is the same as vacuity fire flaming

upward due to liver-kidney yin vacuity. "

My confusion came because I could see little relation of that type of

pathology to the side-effects of cannabis. I wasn't aware of the

wider implications that you mentioned.

Cannabis certainly has very different effects on different

individuals. While it is well-established that many users experience

increases in pulse rate, and I think many would agree with your

suggestion that cannabis " opens the senses " and " intensifies

pleasure, " I have to disagree that it arouses sexual desire.

If anything, I think cannabis actually causes a temporary reduction in

" carnal " sexual desire. While its adherents may assert that it is

sensually enjoyable, I think that it temporarily reduces the physical

desire for sexual gratification. In this regard, it is virtually the

opposite of alcohol. Alcohol increases the physical desire to have

sex (and often makes the selection criteria for a sex partner more

lax), but it actually dulls the sensations once intimacy is initiated.

By contrast, one could make the assertion that cannabis reduces the

immediate physical drive and raises the bar of selection criteria for

the potential partner, yet once intimacy is initiated then the sensory

experience can be intensified.

There is wide variety of individual responses to such drugs and the

cultural patterns of use and expections vary widely among individuals.

Nonetheless, among people that I have spoken with, many agree that

cannabis reduces rather than increases the desire for sexual

gratification. Since I thought that increased libido and seminal

emission were the main signs of stirring ministerial fire, I

questioned the assertion that cannabis stirs ministerial fire.

It makes much more sense that alcohol would stir ministerial fire.

Youth culture is full of slang expressions like " beer goggles " that

imply that more drinks cause unattractive people to appear more

attractive, but I have never heard of anyone suggest such a phenomenon

with pot.

Eric

" creates excitement, speeds up heart beat, arouses sexual desire,

opens the senses, and intensifies pleasure "

> On Jan 21, 2005, at 5:54 PM, smilinglotus wrote:

>

> >

> > Cannabis can produce a dry mouth and redness of the eyes, and the act

> > of smoking would logically produce local lung heat, or at least

damage

> > to lung yin. However, do you see evidence that it produces systemic

> > heat of any type? Why do you think that it stirs ministerial fire?

>

January 24, 2005

This is a most interesting topic. It is my understanding that this

condition is or has a lot to do with a spleen/stomach deficency, hence the

usage of Bu Zhong yi qi wan. This is what I remember from one of Charles

Chace's seminars on respiratory conditions. Cannot locate info due to

everything is boxed up for move.

Later

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

> " smilinglotus " <smilinglotus

>

> Re: interesting Crohn's disease cure

>Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:46:51 -0000

>

> , " "

><zrosenbe@s...> wrote:

> > Eric,

> > From my understanding of Dong-yuan's yin fire theory, anything that

> > creates excitement, speeds up heart beat, arouses sexual desire, opens

> > the senses, and intensifies pleasure is liberating jing-essence from

> > the kidneys and shunting mingmen fire up towards the upper burner.

> >

>

>Thanks for the clarification. I haven't undertaken as detailed a

>study on Li Dong-Yuan's yin fire theory as you have, so some of the

>concepts that you mentioned were new to me. I was under the

>impression that the primary symptoms of stirring ministerial fire were

>related to increased sexual desire and seminal emission. I haven't

>studied it as much from a historical perspective, but modern basic

>Chinese texts describe the following:

>

> " In insufficiency of liver-kidney yin, the ministerial fire can become

>hyperactive, giving rise to a condition known as stirring of

>ministerial fire, which is characterized by dizziness, headache,

>unclear vision, tinnitus, deafness, irascibility, profuse dreaming,

>vexing heat in the hearts and palms, seminal emission, and premature

>ejaculation. This condition is the same as vacuity fire flaming

>upward due to liver-kidney yin vacuity. "

>

>My confusion came because I could see little relation of that type of

>pathology to the side-effects of cannabis. I wasn't aware of the

>wider implications that you mentioned.

>

>Cannabis certainly has very different effects on different

>individuals. While it is well-established that many users experience

>increases in pulse rate, and I think many would agree with your

>suggestion that cannabis " opens the senses " and " intensifies

>pleasure, " I have to disagree that it arouses sexual desire.

>

>If anything, I think cannabis actually causes a temporary reduction in

> " carnal " sexual desire. While its adherents may assert that it is

>sensually enjoyable, I think that it temporarily reduces the physical

>desire for sexual gratification. In this regard, it is virtually the

>opposite of alcohol. Alcohol increases the physical desire to have

>sex (and often makes the selection criteria for a sex partner more

>lax), but it actually dulls the sensations once intimacy is initiated.

> By contrast, one could make the assertion that cannabis reduces the

>immediate physical drive and raises the bar of selection criteria for

>the potential partner, yet once intimacy is initiated then the sensory

>experience can be intensified.

>

>There is wide variety of individual responses to such drugs and the

>cultural patterns of use and expections vary widely among individuals.

> Nonetheless, among people that I have spoken with, many agree that

>cannabis reduces rather than increases the desire for sexual

>gratification. Since I thought that increased libido and seminal

>emission were the main signs of stirring ministerial fire, I

>questioned the assertion that cannabis stirs ministerial fire.

>

>It makes much more sense that alcohol would stir ministerial fire.

>Youth culture is full of slang expressions like " beer goggles " that

>imply that more drinks cause unattractive people to appear more

>attractive, but I have never heard of anyone suggest such a phenomenon

>with pot.

>

>Eric

>

> " creates excitement, speeds up heart beat, arouses sexual desire,

>opens the senses, and intensifies pleasure "

>

> > On Jan 21, 2005, at 5:54 PM, smilinglotus wrote:

> >

> > >

> > > Cannabis can produce a dry mouth and redness of the eyes, and the act

> > > of smoking would logically produce local lung heat, or at least

>damage

> > > to lung yin. However, do you see evidence that it produces systemic

> > > heat of any type? Why do you think that it stirs ministerial fire?

> >

January 24, 2005

On cannabis. I don't think any of the mentioned TCM /or other actions,

speak of the effect that cannabis has on an individual undergoing chemo, on

pain killers, morphine, and is in overall pretty bad shape. When the

intestines are bound, and there is almost constant nausea and vomiting.

Can't eat, and there is severe chronic constipation. People waiting or

wishing to die.

Cannabis for those people all have the same immediate effect.

Reduce pain. Settling of the stomach. Increase or return of appetite with

return of taste sensation. A bowel movement. Jeez, almost as if life was

returning...

I believe cannabis awakens the ministerial fire on those that had been

trampled upon.

The effect of cannabis, as some of us on this list may attest, on younger

more vibrant bodies, are of course well known. But those are the effects of

overuse and abuse. Just like Ma Huang. There's a cocktail that will kill

you - cannabis and speed. It is not the radical abuse that we need address

but the judicious intervention of herbs.

Ed Kasper L.Ac., Acupuncturist & Medicinal Herbalist

http://HappyHerbalist.com eddy

Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:46:51 -0000

" smilinglotus " <smilinglotus

Re: interesting Crohn's disease cure