Guest guest Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Does anyone know of a textbook source or sources that have comprehensive lists of the specific anti-microbial properties of Chinese herbs? Chen and Chen's sections on antimicrobial properties of herbs are generally good, but certain classes of microbes like mycoplasmas, rickettsias, Yersinia, Brucella, Pasteurella are not mentioned. And it would also be helpful to find information that gives some idea of the differential antimicrobial effects on different classes of viruses, instead of a general statement like " useful against influenza and other viruses " . Specifically, variola, arboviruses, the hemorrhagic fevers, etc. Correctly matching the herbs and formula to the pattern (wen bing, shang han, etc.) is 70% of the battle, but I find that fine-tuning these formulas by adding specific antimicrobials often gets one the extra 30%. But for some classes of infections, I don't have access to this information. I suspect it is out there somewhere... Any help will be greatly appreciated. ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 when they mention anti-bacterial and antimicrobial activity they usually talk about the same sorts of things, is there a standard panel of representative bacteria and microbes things are tested against, and a standard range that plant immune functions (essential oils et al) tend to address? Par - <rw2 Tuesday, January 25, 2005 2:05 PM anti-microbials > > > Does anyone know of a textbook source or sources that have comprehensive > lists of the specific anti-microbial properties of Chinese herbs? > > Chen and Chen's sections on antimicrobial properties of herbs are > generally good, but certain classes of microbes like mycoplasmas, > rickettsias, Yersinia, Brucella, Pasteurella are not mentioned. And it > would also be helpful to find information that gives some idea of the > differential antimicrobial effects on different classes of viruses, > instead of a general statement like " useful against influenza and other > viruses " . Specifically, variola, arboviruses, the hemorrhagic fevers, etc. > > Correctly matching the herbs and formula to the pattern (wen bing, shang > han, etc.) is 70% of the battle, but I find that fine-tuning these > formulas by adding specific antimicrobials often gets one the extra 30%. > But for some classes of infections, I don't have access to this > information. I suspect it is out there somewhere... > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > > > ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist > contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ > Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA > Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org > > > > > > Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including > board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a > free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 I would think you could find this information in the books available in China. There's a lot of pharmacological research happening there, and many books on this topic. Graduate students have to do some kind of a research, and often that research is pharmacological. I never had the interest in learning all the Chinese terms for the molecular names, and WM functions, so I don't really know in which book you could find it. But perhaps the information does indeed exist... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2005 Report Share Posted February 13, 2005 One company that has done a lot of research into essential oils is youngliving. The " Essential Oil Desk Reference " compiled by Essential Science Publishing provides a very detailed look at the chemistry of various substances that are found in our herbs and what effects they have been shown to have in a lab. Let me know if you cannot locate it. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > " Par Scott " <parufus > > >Re: anti-microbials >Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:55:59 -0500 > >when they mention anti-bacterial and antimicrobial activity they usually >talk about the same sorts of things, is there a standard panel of >representative bacteria and microbes things are tested against, and a >standard range that plant immune functions (essential oils et al) tend to >address? > >Par >- ><rw2 > >Tuesday, January 25, 2005 2:05 PM > anti-microbials > > > > > > > > Does anyone know of a textbook source or sources that have comprehensive > > lists of the specific anti-microbial properties of Chinese herbs? > > > > Chen and Chen's sections on antimicrobial properties of herbs are > > generally good, but certain classes of microbes like mycoplasmas, > > rickettsias, Yersinia, Brucella, Pasteurella are not mentioned. And it > > would also be helpful to find information that gives some idea of the > > differential antimicrobial effects on different classes of viruses, > > instead of a general statement like " useful against influenza and other > > viruses " . Specifically, variola, arboviruses, the hemorrhagic fevers, >etc. > > > > Correctly matching the herbs and formula to the pattern (wen bing, shang > > han, etc.) is 70% of the battle, but I find that fine-tuning these > > formulas by adding specific antimicrobials often gets one the extra 30%. > > But for some classes of infections, I don't have access to this > > information. I suspect it is out there somewhere... > > > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > > > > > > > ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist > > contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ > > Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA > > Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org > > > > > > > > > > > > Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including > > board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a > > free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2005 Report Share Posted February 13, 2005 Check out... http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/young.html -Jason > > mike Bowser [naturaldoc1] > Sunday, February 13, 2005 5:37 PM > > Re: anti-microbials > > > One company that has done a lot of research into essential oils is > youngliving. The " Essential Oil Desk Reference " compiled by Essential > Science Publishing provides a very detailed look at the chemistry of > various > substances that are found in our herbs and what effects they have been > shown > to have in a lab. Let me know if you cannot locate it. > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > " Par Scott " <parufus > > > > > >Re: anti-microbials > >Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:55:59 -0500 > > > >when they mention anti-bacterial and antimicrobial activity they usually > >talk about the same sorts of things, is there a standard panel of > >representative bacteria and microbes things are tested against, and a > >standard range that plant immune functions (essential oils et al) tend to > >address? > > > >Par > >- > ><rw2 > > > >Tuesday, January 25, 2005 2:05 PM > > anti-microbials > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does anyone know of a textbook source or sources that have > comprehensive > > > lists of the specific anti-microbial properties of Chinese herbs? > > > > > > Chen and Chen's sections on antimicrobial properties of herbs are > > > generally good, but certain classes of microbes like mycoplasmas, > > > rickettsias, Yersinia, Brucella, Pasteurella are not mentioned. And it > > > would also be helpful to find information that gives some idea of the > > > differential antimicrobial effects on different classes of viruses, > > > instead of a general statement like " useful against influenza and > other > > > viruses " . Specifically, variola, arboviruses, the hemorrhagic fevers, > >etc. > > > > > > Correctly matching the herbs and formula to the pattern (wen bing, > shang > > > han, etc.) is 70% of the battle, but I find that fine-tuning these > > > formulas by adding specific antimicrobials often gets one the extra > 30%. > > > But for some classes of infections, I don't have access to this > > > information. I suspect it is out there somewhere... > > > > > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist > > > contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ > > > Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA > > > Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > including > > > board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and > a > > > free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2005 Report Share Posted February 14, 2005 Jason, Consider your source of info. Mr. Barrett also condemns acupuncture and oriental medicine because it is quackery. I have met Dr. Young and also toured his organic farm in UT where they also distill many of their oils on site. There is definitely an art to doing this according to the weather, growth cycle, etc. The ancient Chinese professed to harvest chen pi after a certain moon. There is a lot of scientific info in the text that I mention below that has been conducted at various universities. We should have a better understanding of what makes up various herbs and the effects of these substances on us. For example, the group of compounds know as sesquiterpines has been shown to cross the blood brain barrier and carry with it oxygen. This has led to research into using sandalwood and pepperminet, both high in such, to be used on ADD/ADHD children successfully. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > " " > > >RE: anti-microbials >Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:39:04 -0700 > >Check out... > >http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/young.html > >-Jason > > > > > mike Bowser [naturaldoc1] > > Sunday, February 13, 2005 5:37 PM > > > > Re: anti-microbials > > > > > > One company that has done a lot of research into essential oils is > > youngliving. The " Essential Oil Desk Reference " compiled by Essential > > Science Publishing provides a very detailed look at the chemistry of > > various > > substances that are found in our herbs and what effects they have been > > shown > > to have in a lab. Let me know if you cannot locate it. > > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > > > " Par Scott " <parufus > > > > > > > > >Re: anti-microbials > > >Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:55:59 -0500 > > > > > >when they mention anti-bacterial and antimicrobial activity they >usually > > >talk about the same sorts of things, is there a standard panel of > > >representative bacteria and microbes things are tested against, and a > > >standard range that plant immune functions (essential oils et al) tend >to > > >address? > > > > > >Par > > >- > > ><rw2 > > > > > >Tuesday, January 25, 2005 2:05 PM > > > anti-microbials > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does anyone know of a textbook source or sources that have > > comprehensive > > > > lists of the specific anti-microbial properties of Chinese herbs? > > > > > > > > Chen and Chen's sections on antimicrobial properties of herbs are > > > > generally good, but certain classes of microbes like mycoplasmas, > > > > rickettsias, Yersinia, Brucella, Pasteurella are not mentioned. And >it > > > > would also be helpful to find information that gives some idea of >the > > > > differential antimicrobial effects on different classes of viruses, > > > > instead of a general statement like " useful against influenza and > > other > > > > viruses " . Specifically, variola, arboviruses, the hemorrhagic >fevers, > > >etc. > > > > > > > > Correctly matching the herbs and formula to the pattern (wen bing, > > shang > > > > han, etc.) is 70% of the battle, but I find that fine-tuning these > > > > formulas by adding specific antimicrobials often gets one the extra > > 30%. > > > > But for some classes of infections, I don't have access to this > > > > information. I suspect it is out there somewhere... > > > > > > > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist > > > > contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ > > > > Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA > > > > Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > > including > > > > board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference >and > > a > > > > free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2005 Report Share Posted February 14, 2005 Perhaps we should also check out the additional sites below. Its a breath of fresh air to actually read the truth. http://www.quackwatch.org/index.html http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/acu.html http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/altmc.html http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/homeo.html http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/DSH/suppinsurance.html http://www.quackwatch.org/02ConsumerProtection/conorgs.html wrote: Check out... http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/young.html -Jason > > mike Bowser [naturaldoc1] > Sunday, February 13, 2005 5:37 PM > > Re: anti-microbials > > > One company that has done a lot of research into essential oils is > youngliving. The " Essential Oil Desk Reference " compiled by Essential > Science Publishing provides a very detailed look at the chemistry of > various > substances that are found in our herbs and what effects they have been > shown > to have in a lab. Let me know if you cannot locate it. > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > " Par Scott " <parufus > > > > > >Re: anti-microbials > >Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:55:59 -0500 > > > >when they mention anti-bacterial and antimicrobial activity they usually > >talk about the same sorts of things, is there a standard panel of > >representative bacteria and microbes things are tested against, and a > >standard range that plant immune functions (essential oils et al) tend to > >address? > > > >Par > >- > ><rw2 > > > >Tuesday, January 25, 2005 2:05 PM > > anti-microbials > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does anyone know of a textbook source or sources that have > comprehensive > > > lists of the specific anti-microbial properties of Chinese herbs? > > > > > > Chen and Chen's sections on antimicrobial properties of herbs are > > > generally good, but certain classes of microbes like mycoplasmas, > > > rickettsias, Yersinia, Brucella, Pasteurella are not mentioned. And it > > > would also be helpful to find information that gives some idea of the > > > differential antimicrobial effects on different classes of viruses, > > > instead of a general statement like " useful against influenza and > other > > > viruses " . Specifically, variola, arboviruses, the hemorrhagic fevers, > >etc. > > > > > > Correctly matching the herbs and formula to the pattern (wen bing, > shang > > > han, etc.) is 70% of the battle, but I find that fine-tuning these > > > formulas by adding specific antimicrobials often gets one the extra > 30%. > > > But for some classes of infections, I don't have access to this > > > information. I suspect it is out there somewhere... > > > > > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist > > > contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ > > > Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA > > > Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > including > > > board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and > a > > > free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2005 Report Share Posted February 14, 2005 Roger thanks for the sites good reading Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2005 Report Share Posted February 14, 2005 While occasionally Quackbusters comes up with legitimate criticisms of alternative health practices, most of there stuff is not credible. For background information on who is behind Quackbusters, see: http://www.rmhiherbal.org/review/2005-1.html#good Good news in the fight against Big Pharma Quackbusters, an organization funded by several major drug companies to discredit alternative practitioners of all types, has suffered serious setbacks as a result of several major court decisions. " [Tim] Bolen reports that recent U.S. court rulings have severely crippled Quackbusters. A recent published Appeals Court decision called its founder, Steven Barrett, biased and unworthy of credibility. Moreover, the National Council Against Health Fraud (NCAHF), a similar organization to Quackwatch, was defeated in similar court actions in California and Wisconsin. " Recently, Barrett, quackwatch.com, the NCAHF, Robert Baratz, and others have been named in a federal Racketeering (RICO) lawsuit in Colorado (CAVITAT v. Aetna Insurance). Aetna has filed four separate motions for dismissal in this case, and each motion has been rejected by the court; the case will proceed. " ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org > Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:39:04 -0700 > " " >RE: anti-microbials > >Check out... > >http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/young.html > >-Jason > >> >> mike Bowser [naturaldoc1] >> Sunday, February 13, 2005 5:37 PM >> >> Re: anti-microbials >> >> >> One company that has done a lot of research into essential oils is >> youngliving. The " Essential Oil Desk Reference " compiled by Essential >> Science Publishing provides a very detailed look at the chemistry of >> various >> substances that are found in our herbs and what effects they have been >> shown >> to have in a lab. Let me know if you cannot locate it. >> Mike W. Bowser, L Ac >> ---Roger Wicke, PhD, TCM Clinical Herbalist contact: www.rmhiherbal.org/contact/ Rocky Mountain Herbal Institute, Hot Springs, Montana USA Clinical herbology training programs - www.rmhiherbal.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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