Guest guest Posted February 28, 2005 Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 I am interested in idea of possible approaches to herbal formulas for the following case: 49 year old woman, 5'10 " , 95 lbs. looks emaciated no appetite, ashen complexion, flat voice, extreme fatigue, irritability Has felt sick most of the time since she was 28 Tongue: long dusky body with red tip, thin dry white fur, slight scallops Insomnia usually but has been sleeping better since receiving acupuncture Stool is light color, formed but not dry, floating, small amount & not regular Pulses are thready and feel knotted or tight in heart and lung positions. Skin feels cool and clammy. Long history of depression and running to various physicians. Diagnosis of CFIDS in '78, '94; '97 Eppstein-Barre. She has taken a lot of antibiotics over the years. She recently independently weaned herself off clonopin and is still taking neurontin 1200 mg and doxipin 10 mg. Wants to be off those, too. Lost job in 2000. Lives with ex-boyfriend and is seeing a psychotherapist and trying to put her life together. Too weak to do much about it. 2000: surgery: uterine artery embolism to seal off blood supply to 10 cm fibroid (alternative to hysterectomy). It shrunk to 4 cm. After this surgery her legs have been weak and she can't walk very far. Feels weak and heart pounds on slightest exertion. There are metal clips on her femoral artery.. Comes to my taiji class and lately sits and watches. Legs feel weak. Has migraines premenstrually and at other times, takes Maxil for migraines. Menses are heavy, some clots, regular every 24 days. No libido Knee pain not helped with prolotherapy, osteopathic manipulation, acupuncture, or electrostim. No back pain. I find deficient qi and stagnant blood, liver qi depression. Bu zhong yi qi tang seems a good place to start, what to add? This lady really needs to recover her energy. Thank you for your comments. Frances Gander Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 Be careful tonifying too much with people like this. It seems obvious that there is Qi Stagnation from your description and deficiencies as well. If you try to tonify too strongly, it will backfire. Tonification is really popular here... ;-) Why wouldn't you try something simple like Xiao Yao Wan? I thought they always said - clear excess then tonify the deficiency. Also check about other drug use - with the history I wouldn't be suprised if there was something else going into her system. Geoff , frances gander <threetreasures@f...> wrote: > > I am interested in idea of possible approaches to herbal formulas for > the following case: > > 49 year old woman, 5'10 " , 95 lbs. looks emaciated > no appetite, ashen complexion, flat voice, extreme fatigue, irritability > Has felt sick most of the time since she was 28 > Tongue: long dusky body with red tip, thin dry white fur, slight scallops > Insomnia usually but has been sleeping better since receiving acupuncture > Stool is light color, formed but not dry, floating, small amount & not > regular > Pulses are thready and feel knotted or tight in heart and lung positions. > Skin feels cool and clammy. > Long history of depression and running to various physicians. > Diagnosis of CFIDS in '78, '94; '97 Eppstein-Barre. She has taken a lot > of antibiotics over the years. > She recently independently weaned herself off clonopin and is still > taking neurontin 1200 mg and doxipin 10 mg. Wants to be off those, too. > Lost job in 2000. Lives with ex-boyfriend and is seeing a > psychotherapist and trying to put her life together. Too weak to do > much about it. > 2000: surgery: uterine artery embolism to seal off blood supply to 10 cm > fibroid (alternative to hysterectomy). It shrunk to 4 cm. After this > surgery her legs have been weak and she can't walk very far. Feels weak > and heart pounds on slightest exertion. There are metal clips on her > femoral artery.. > Comes to my taiji class and lately sits and watches. Legs feel weak. > Has migraines premenstrually and at other times, takes Maxil for migraines. > Menses are heavy, some clots, regular every 24 days. > No libido > Knee pain not helped with prolotherapy, osteopathic manipulation, > acupuncture, or electrostim. No back pain. > I find deficient qi and stagnant blood, liver qi depression. > Bu zhong yi qi tang seems a good place to start, what to add? This > lady really needs to recover her energy. > > Thank you for your comments. > > Frances Gander Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 Have you thought about the possibility of parasites? I have a very similar case of a woman who has had 3 bouts of parasites in the past several years and the other problems that go with undiagnosed parasites are very similar to what you are describing. Marnae At 10:08 AM 3/1/2005, you wrote: >Be careful tonifying too much with people like this. It seems >obvious that there is Qi Stagnation from your description and >deficiencies as well. If you try to tonify too strongly, it will >backfire. Tonification is really popular here... ;-) Why wouldn't >you try something simple like Xiao Yao Wan? I thought they always >said - clear excess then tonify the deficiency. Also check about >other drug use - with the history I wouldn't be suprised if there >was something else going into her system. > >Geoff > > , frances gander ><threetreasures@f...> wrote: > > > > I am interested in idea of possible approaches to herbal formulas >for > > the following case: > > > > 49 year old woman, 5'10 " , 95 lbs. looks emaciated > > no appetite, ashen complexion, flat voice, extreme fatigue, >irritability > > Has felt sick most of the time since she was 28 > > Tongue: long dusky body with red tip, thin dry white fur, slight >scallops > > Insomnia usually but has been sleeping better since receiving >acupuncture > > Stool is light color, formed but not dry, floating, small amount & >not > > regular > > Pulses are thready and feel knotted or tight in heart and lung >positions. > > Skin feels cool and clammy. > > Long history of depression and running to various physicians. > > Diagnosis of CFIDS in '78, '94; '97 Eppstein-Barre. She has taken >a lot > > of antibiotics over the years. > > She recently independently weaned herself off clonopin and is >still > > taking neurontin 1200 mg and doxipin 10 mg. Wants to be off >those, too. > > Lost job in 2000. Lives with ex-boyfriend and is seeing a > > psychotherapist and trying to put her life together. Too weak to >do > > much about it. > > 2000: surgery: uterine artery embolism to seal off blood supply to >10 cm > > fibroid (alternative to hysterectomy). It shrunk to 4 cm. After >this > > surgery her legs have been weak and she can't walk very far. Feels >weak > > and heart pounds on slightest exertion. There are metal clips on >her > > femoral artery.. > > Comes to my taiji class and lately sits and watches. Legs feel >weak. > > Has migraines premenstrually and at other times, takes Maxil for >migraines. > > Menses are heavy, some clots, regular every 24 days. > > No libido > > Knee pain not helped with prolotherapy, osteopathic manipulation, > > acupuncture, or electrostim. No back pain. > > I find deficient qi and stagnant blood, liver qi depression. > > Bu zhong yi qi tang seems a good place to start, what to add? >This > > lady really needs to recover her energy. > > > > Thank you for your comments. > > > > Frances Gander > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 There are metal clips on her femoral artery.. >>>>>>>>>>>This sounds kind strange. What do you mean by metal clips. Did she have stenosis? Clips sound too close to clemps which would make no sense. Alon , Marnae Ergil <marnae@p...> wrote: > Have you thought about the possibility of parasites? I have a very similar > case of a woman who has had 3 bouts of parasites in the past several years > and the other problems that go with undiagnosed parasites are very similar > to what you are describing. > > Marnae > > At 10:08 AM 3/1/2005, you wrote: > > > >Be careful tonifying too much with people like this. It seems > >obvious that there is Qi Stagnation from your description and > >deficiencies as well. If you try to tonify too strongly, it will > >backfire. Tonification is really popular here... ;-) Why wouldn't > >you try something simple like Xiao Yao Wan? I thought they always > >said - clear excess then tonify the deficiency. Also check about > >other drug use - with the history I wouldn't be suprised if there > >was something else going into her system. > > > >Geoff > > > > , frances gander > ><threetreasures@f...> wrote: > > > > > > I am interested in idea of possible approaches to herbal formulas > >for > > > the following case: > > > > > > 49 year old woman, 5'10 " , 95 lbs. looks emaciated > > > no appetite, ashen complexion, flat voice, extreme fatigue, > >irritability > > > Has felt sick most of the time since she was 28 > > > Tongue: long dusky body with red tip, thin dry white fur, slight > >scallops > > > Insomnia usually but has been sleeping better since receiving > >acupuncture > > > Stool is light color, formed but not dry, floating, small amount & > >not > > > regular > > > Pulses are thready and feel knotted or tight in heart and lung > >positions. > > > Skin feels cool and clammy. > > > Long history of depression and running to various physicians. > > > Diagnosis of CFIDS in '78, '94; '97 Eppstein-Barre. She has taken > >a lot > > > of antibiotics over the years. > > > She recently independently weaned herself off clonopin and is > >still > > > taking neurontin 1200 mg and doxipin 10 mg. Wants to be off > >those, too. > > > Lost job in 2000. Lives with ex-boyfriend and is seeing a > > > psychotherapist and trying to put her life together. Too weak to > >do > > > much about it. > > > 2000: surgery: uterine artery embolism to seal off blood supply to > >10 cm > > > fibroid (alternative to hysterectomy). It shrunk to 4 cm. After > >this > > > surgery her legs have been weak and she can't walk very far. Feels > >weak > > > and heart pounds on slightest exertion. There are metal clips on > >her > > > femoral artery.. > > > Comes to my taiji class and lately sits and watches. Legs feel > >weak. > > > Has migraines premenstrually and at other times, takes Maxil for > >migraines. > > > Menses are heavy, some clots, regular every 24 days. > > > No libido > > > Knee pain not helped with prolotherapy, osteopathic manipulation, > > > acupuncture, or electrostim. No back pain. > > > I find deficient qi and stagnant blood, liver qi depression. > > > Bu zhong yi qi tang seems a good place to start, what to add? > >This > > > lady really needs to recover her energy. > > > > > > Thank you for your comments. > > > > > > Frances Gander > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including > >board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a > >free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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