Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 , " Bob Flaws " <pemachophel2001> wrote: > I also wonder why Mitchel et al. chose " Marquis. " This is a decidedly > Eurocentric title. According to Webster's New World Dictionary, a > marquis is " a nobleman ranking above an earl and count and below a > duke. " In England, this term was used to denote the eldest son of a > duke who is also a marquis. Could this term choice imply that the > Marquis of Qi was the eldest son of the rule of Guo? Don't know. Just > asking. > > Even if they were wrong on this point of history or geography or whatever, I don't think it calls into question the rest of the text at all. The focus of the book is the clinical commentaries and the main sources of advice on the text were those who are expert in Chinese medicine and SHL, not chinese history or genealogy, per se. I think an error in this preface is really inconsequential. I would suggest that if someone is really to call into question other parts of the translated text, then it is incumbent upon that person to provide examples of errors of clinical significance. To point to a minor error that has nothing to do with medicine as if it proves a major error elsewhere yet to be found is just unfair. The fact that the book is widely acclaimed by many disparate parties should speak for itself. The burden of proof here is upon the accuser. If it is not forthcoming, let's move along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 Please one more reply from Bob Felt, the publisher of the Mitchell/Wiseman/Feng Shang Han Lun: " The source Shinjiro Kanazawa is referring to, the biography of Bian Que (referred to as Yue4-ren2 in the SHL preface) is from the Shi Ji (Historical Records). It is obvious that this line refers to two stories from Bian Que's biography: The first one is indeed, as the note explains, a reference to the famous story of Bian Que raising the Prince of Guo2 from apparent death. The second line, on " inspecting the complexion of the Marquis of Qi2 " , refers to a second story, also quite well-known, where Bian Que, when passing through Qi2, was hosted by the Marquis Huan2 of Qi2. He diagnosed the Marquis as suffering from disease in the interstices, the Marquis does not believe him and waves him off. Over the next days, Bian Que comes back every five days, each time he tells the Marquis that his condition has advanced further inward, wants to treat him, but the Marquis refuses. In the end, Bian Que leaves, and the Marquis dies. So I'm perfectly willing to agree that given the clinical audience to which the book is addressed the note could have distinquished the two different stories, although both are very famous. I'd agree too that something like " Each time I read the stories about Yue-Ren, [ . . .] and when he inspected the complexion of the Marquis of Qi2... would have more clearly distinguised the two stories. However, this comes nowhere near showing that literal translation of idiomatic expresssions means losing the real meanings. It's quite a leap between footnote editing and failed translation. " Bob Felt Robert L. Felt bob Paradigm Publications www.paradigm-pubs.com 202 Bendix Drive 505 758 7758 Taos, New Mexico 87571 On Jul 19, 2005, at 8:22 AM, wrote: > , " Bob Flaws " > <pemachophel2001> wrote: > > >> I also wonder why Mitchel et al. chose " Marquis. " This is a decidedly >> Eurocentric title. According to Webster's New World Dictionary, a >> marquis is " a nobleman ranking above an earl and count and below a >> duke. " In England, this term was used to denote the eldest son of a >> duke who is also a marquis. Could this term choice imply that the >> Marquis of Qi was the eldest son of the rule of Guo? Don't know. Just >> asking. >> >> >> > > Even if they were wrong on this point of history or geography or > whatever, I don't think it calls into question the rest of the text at > all. The focus of the book is the clinical commentaries and the main > sources of advice on the text were those who are expert in Chinese > medicine and SHL, not chinese history or genealogy, per se. I think > an error in this preface is really inconsequential. I would suggest > that if someone is really to call into question other parts of the > translated text, then it is incumbent upon that person to provide > examples of errors of clinical significance. To point to a minor > error that has nothing to do with medicine as if it proves a major > error elsewhere yet to be found is just unfair. The fact that the > book is widely acclaimed by many disparate parties should speak for > itself. The burden of proof here is upon the accuser. If it is not > forthcoming, let's move along. > > > > > > > Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, > including board approved continuing education classes, an annual > conference and a free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 I would suggest > > that if someone is really to call into question other parts of the > > translated text, then it is incumbent upon that person to provide > > examples of errors of clinical significance. The Paradigm Shang Han Lun was largely the work of Feng Ye, and he is one of the top SHL scholars in Taiwan. If there are clinically significant errors in the text, they are likely to be few and far between. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 , " Eric Brand " <smilinglotus> wrote: > I would suggest > > > that if someone is really to call into question other parts of the > > > translated text, then it is incumbent upon that person to provide > > > examples of errors of clinical significance. > > The Paradigm Shang Han Lun was largely the work of Feng Ye, and he is > one of the top SHL scholars in Taiwan. If there are clinically > significant errors in the text, they are likely to be few and far between. > > Eric That was my assumption. I hnope it was clear that I wrote this in defense against a straw man critique. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2005 Report Share Posted July 19, 2005 , " " <zrosenbe@s...> wrote: > > Please one more reply from Bob Felt, the publisher of the > Mitchell/Wiseman/Feng Shang Han Lun: > .. > However, this comes nowhere near showing that literal translation of > idiomatic expresssions means losing the real meanings. It's quite a > leap between footnote editing and failed translation. " > Presenting further real evidence on either side is fine. No more BS, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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