Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 Nevertheless the term as employed conjoins a set of symptoms, and signs, especially according to pulse and tongue diagnosis, and then joins them to a treatment principle from which an herbal formula has been derived. >>>>>> I have no problem with this, i think dr shen is a good example of modern development of CM and of course to the strict chinese followers in out group can be categorized as MSU Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 Dr. Shen was a brilliant practitioner with poor English language skills, so the transmissions of his ideas via his earlier students such as 'blood unclear' remain quite fuzzy and difficult to figure out at times. Certainly he was an innovator, but I fear that much was lost in the shuffle. On Sep 15, 2005, at 5:28 PM, wrote: > I have no problem with this, i think dr shen is a good example of > modern development of CM and of course to the strict chinese > followers in out group can be categorized as MSU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 Certainly he was an innovator, but I fear that much was lost in the shuffle. >>>>>A Zev, are you speaking from first hand knowledge or a feeling? Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 I did take a few seminars from him as well. . . I was impressed with his pulse skills, although one of my teachers dismissed it as psychic parlor tricks (I didn't agree at the time). I've written elsewhere ( in the Clinical Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine Journal) about this, so I'm not going to repeat myself here again. On Sep 15, 2005, at 5:59 PM, wrote: > Certainly he was an innovator, but I fear that much > was lost in the shuffle. > >>>>>> A >>>>>> > Zev, are you speaking from first hand knowledge or a feeling? > > > > > Oakland, CA 94609 > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 Zev, perhaps Will can chime in and let us know what he think is lost or was poorly communicated to those that spent extended privet time with him Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 When I first started studying Chinese medicine I quit writing poetry for a while. When I began studying Chinese herbal formulas and learning how to modify them I discovered that some of the same creativity is required. Language aside, one can examine a formula and see its brilliance. I hope everyone will have an opportunity to see some of Dr. Shen's formulas " exposited. " What's more, having used the formula described myself, the relationship between the signs, symptoms, the Blood Unclear formula, and the results, there is nothing " unclear " about it. -Brandt Stickley , " " <zrosenbe@s...> wrote: > Dr. Shen was a brilliant practitioner with poor English language > skills, so the transmissions of his ideas via his earlier students > such as 'blood unclear' remain quite fuzzy and difficult to figure > out at times. Certainly he was an innovator, but I fear that much > was lost in the shuffle. > > > On Sep 15, 2005, at 5:28 PM, wrote: > > > I have no problem with this, i think dr shen is a good example of > > modern development of CM and of course to the strict chinese > > followers in out group can be categorized as MSU > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 Prescriptions can be built elegantly, and as you point out, there is a lot of poetry in that process. One can bypass the obscure language of poor translation to some degree. However, if we are trying to communicate medicine in the clearest fashion possible, using terms without Chinese or pinyin equivalents will make it rough going in understanding what teachers like Dr. Shen were trying to present. On Sep 15, 2005, at 7:02 PM, Brandt Stickley wrote: > When I first started studying Chinese medicine I quit writing > poetry for a while. When I > began studying Chinese herbal formulas and learning how to modify > them I discovered > that some of the same creativity is required. Language aside, one > can examine a formula > and see its brilliance. I hope everyone will have an opportunity > to see some of Dr. Shen's > formulas " exposited. " What's more, having used the formula > described myself, the > relationship between the signs, symptoms, the Blood Unclear > formula, and the results, > there is nothing " unclear " about it. > > -Brandt Stickley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 I'd be interested in reading your take on one of Dr. Shen's herbal poems. I myself feel like Chinese herbalism makes use of the same part of my brain as creative cooking. That's probably because I was a cook, not a poet. : ) -al. On Sep 15, 2005, at 7:02 PM, Brandt Stickley wrote: > When I first started studying Chinese medicine I quit writing > poetry for a while. When I > began studying Chinese herbal formulas and learning how to modify > them I discovered > that some of the same creativity is required. Language aside, one > can examine a formula > and see its brilliance. I hope everyone will have an opportunity > to see some of Dr. Shen's > formulas " exposited. " What's more, having used the formula > described myself, the > relationship between the signs, symptoms, the Blood Unclear > formula, and the results, > there is nothing " unclear " about it. > > -Brandt Stickley -- Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 using terms without Chinese or pinyin equivalents will make it rough going in understanding what teachers like Dr. Shen were trying to present. >>>>>> From what i understand Dr shen needed new terms that were not related to standard CM and for which pin yin may not be available Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 I don't mean this personally to you, but that for me is a cop-out. Poor english language skills means poorly translated information. Students who don't know Chinese language means that they cannot compare Chinese and English language terms, therefore not recording accurate information. Poor choices of terms to describe new discoveries means that the original ideas cannot be transmitted properly, no matter how innovative they are. On Sep 15, 2005, at 7:20 PM, wrote: > From what i understand Dr shen needed new terms that were not > related to standard CM and for which pin yin may not be available Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2005 Report Share Posted September 15, 2005 Poor choices of terms to describe new discoveries means that the original ideas cannot be transmitted properly, no matter how innovative they are >>>>Zev, whos terms are these? Dr Shen? or Just Hammer's. Will you spent time with Dr Shen what have you to say. Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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