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Hi Heiko

Thanks for the article quantum biology. To me this article is the ultimate in la

la science paper. It builds up on a pyramid of totally unsubstantiated

statements.

The part where he talks about referred pain shows the shallowness of the

article. As a matter of fact we know much more about referred pain than just the

idea that there is an error in the nervous system. Also he is wrong saying

referred pain occurs only with disease. Referred pain can be stimulated under

normal physiologic conditions, for example, every time we get Da Qi. Referred

pain most of the time does not follow the TCM channels, except for small parts

of them. If the Pacific J of Oriental Medicine is a peer reviewed j it does so

poorly.

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

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Hi Alon

Good to see you read the article. I found it interesting , but to be honest

didn't quite understand how he came up with the frequency measurements for the

channels. Thanks for the review, but I expect not all things written in

experimental theories are right. This Frazer guy who wrote the article, has

patented some acupuncture diagnostic and treatment machine which I found through

google etc, I think they are expensive as there is only one in NZ.

No harm in seeing if it helps ...when I find out where it is.I will let you

know.

Heiko Lade

M.H.Sc.(TCM)

Lecturer and clinic supervisor

Auckland College of Natural Medicine

Website: www.acnm.co.nz

 

 

 

-

Wednesday, October 12, 2005 2:22 PM

Re: Quantum Biology

 

 

Hi Heiko

Thanks for the article quantum biology. To me this article is the ultimate in

la la science paper. It builds up on a pyramid of totally unsubstantiated

statements.

The part where he talks about referred pain shows the shallowness of the

article. As a matter of fact we know much more about referred pain than just the

idea that there is an error in the nervous system. Also he is wrong saying

referred pain occurs only with disease. Referred pain can be stimulated under

normal physiologic conditions, for example, every time we get Da Qi. Referred

pain most of the time does not follow the TCM channels, except for small parts

of them. If the Pacific J of Oriental Medicine is a peer reviewed j it does so

poorly.

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

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Hi All,

 

I'm finding it interesting everyone talking about Quantum-stuff. It is a

wide field right now. There is a lot of interesting experimentation

going on that is weirder than what everyone is arguing about. I'm

researching microtubule tunneling theory and experimentation. I'm at a

university and I have access to many journals and research papers

through the on-line library. I'm not reading the popularized stuff. I'm

reading science.

 

I've gotten real interesting into the ordering of water molecules. I

recently discovered that water is the densest substance in the body. So

when it is hammered on, it goes out, thus much of organ damage. But

there are many many more things going on with water, with its dipole

properties and its hydrogen bonding, that can have some very high

frequency change states within very small places such as the center of a

microtubule molecule. I'm learning stuff that is in textbooks that

weren't in them just a few years ago. I'm also learning stuff that isn't

in them yet. There is a guy named William Tiller, who has been doing an

incredible number of experiments with coherence and consciousness,

especially with intention. I can't follow all his math yet, but his

experiments are to change material things just through intention.

 

I'm sad too that Todd has equated the leadership of acupuncture with

religious fanatics. I think that parent's comment came from ignorance.

There is a fair amount of what people do in acupuncture field that is on

the artistic side. But any really good doctor will say that sometimes

intuition is very important in the process. Most doctors before

antibiotics came along believed in the relationship between doctor and

patient is part of the medicine. The age of antibiotics saving us from

disease is coming to a close. There is still more to know. It is my

personal belief that we must respect the mystery and live with it. It

will always be with us, and with life and death, sometimes we really

don't know what to do. I hate those moments and then kindness is really

a good idea and it should be there all along. Where does kindness fit

into science? Can someone tell me? Come on, get real. The day we

quantify ourselves is the day were just as good as a machine. Well we're

better and we know it.

 

A big thing that has happened to all of us in western civilization is we

have all learned to mistrust our senses. To not pay attention to all

that is going on. We've all gotten caught up into the word trance of our

culture. The earlier we learn to write and build our vocabulary, the

deeper that trance. The less we had of wandering in the wild, the deeper

that trance. So this is something I really like about Chinese medicine,

we get to practice seeing, hearing, smelling and sensing. Hopefully

thats so. Making sure everybody memorizes this and that and this, but

still lack basic sense training is a shame. Teaching students to think

and be aware is a big deal. Probably I'm preaching to the choir.

Science is a queer bedfellow to validating all that we are doing.

Somehow our human senses are suspect. Maybe they are cause we are so

much in trance and lack the experience of being present. Loading up and

loading up on the technical assurances will not make us any more present.

 

I listened to a Native elder the other day. The thing that stuck is the

lack of naming everything and explaining every experience before they

happen, so that a child is learning with observation, so that by age 11,

they can navigate the open seas, sense storms coming, make their way in

deep fog to where they are going and figure out how to row from Alaska

to California. Where have our senses gone? He then started his

political education at age 13, and now tries to help people communicate

to the Native elders, because scientist, ecologist are all looking to

'incorporate' Traditional Native Knowledge. What a task!!!

That was a long post, but I rarely write anything I'm so busy in school

right now.

 

So, I feel sad about all this science talk and skipping over the fact

that we are in relation to other humans who suffer, and we have found a

very deeply healing art to assist them to finding a much deeper healing

than generally found in Western medicine.

 

Rozz

 

a wrote:

> Hi Heiko

> Thanks for the article quantum biology. To me this article is the ultimate in

la la science paper. It builds up on a pyramid of totally unsubstantiated

statements.

> The part where he talks about referred pain shows the shallowness of the

article. As a matter of fact we know much more about referred pain than just the

idea that there is an error in the nervous system. Also he is wrong saying

referred pain occurs only with disease. Referred pain can be stimulated under

normal physiologic conditions, for example, every time we get Da Qi. Referred

pain most of the time does not follow the TCM channels, except for small parts

of them. If the Pacific J of Oriental Medicine is a peer reviewed j it does so

poorly.

>

>

>

>

> Oakland, CA 94609

>

>

>

>

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and treatment machine which I found through google etc, I think they are

expensive as there is only one in NZ.

No harm in seeing if it helps ...when I find out where it is.I will let you

know.

>>>>>>>

May be they are like his homeopathy imprinting equipment, ie not even hooked to

the power source

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

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Hi Alon,

 

Here is one article. They take some amount of time to read.

 

Rozz

 

wrote:

> Rozz

> Can you share more about what you are reading

> Thanks

>

>

>

 

 

 

 

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Hi Alon,

 

Here is one article. They take some amount of time to read.

>>>>>>

Rozz

Hi there was no article attached

 

thanks

 

 

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

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will not accept attachments. If you would like to post something to

the files

section please do that. I believe it will automatically tell us something is

there.

doug

 

 

, Rozz Lieght <Rusty7@g...> wrote:

>

> Hi Alon,

>

> Here is one article. They take some amount of time to read.

>

> Rozz

>

> wrote:

> > Rozz

> > Can you share more about what you are reading

> > Thanks

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

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will not accept attachments. If you would like to post something to

the files

section please do that. I believe it will automatically tell us something is

there.

>>>

Why not just send it as email

 

 

 

Oakland, CA 94609

 

 

 

 

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