Recycling ** Was: You CAN turn Priority Mail Boxes Inside-Out and Use Them!

[Guest guest]

Hi Karen,

 

Second try on this one .. is bouncing my mail. ;-)

 

Maybe you just tacked the wrong post on the bottom of yours.

 

If you didn't .. then I'm wondering what part of my original post you

didn't understand? Are you reading it as me saying we CAN reuse the

boxes as we wish .. or are you reading anyone as saying that?

 

Seems that folks have been debating something that nobody is disagreeing

with. The only disagreement I have seen is with the statement of some

clerk who told somebody (witnessed and reported by a list member) that

they could NOT recycle a Priority Mail box by turning it inside out and

reusing it to send Priority Mail again.

 

> Whatever. Y'all do and believe whatever you want. Whatever feels

> right to you.

 

That statement comes across to me as if you think folks are trying to

argue with your point. True it is that folks can do whatever feels

right for them .. this covers robbing banks, selling drugs, taking

contracts to knock off people and such .. but I have not read one post

that states someone wants to or intends to try to get around the intent

of the USPS requirement.

 

> I choose to honor the condition I agreed to with the USPS when I

> ordered their Priority Mail boxes online, and that is to use the

> Priority Mail packaging (boxes and envelopes) only as Priority Mail

> with priority postage. IF I re-use a Priority Mail box, it's for

> Priority Mail only, not general postage.

 

That's how I read all the posts that have been made .. I've not seen one

poster suggesting otherwise.

 

However, I will comment on the Terms of Agreement for use of the boxes

http://shop.usps.com/cgi-bin/vsbv/postal_store_non_ssl/display_products/termsOfA\

greement.jsp

 

That portion stating " Misuse may be a violation of federal law. " , is

like the one on mattresses stating that removal of the tag could be

punishable by law, etc. I can imagine some Grandma losing sleep cause

she accidentally tore the dang tag off. ;-) When there is an applicable

federal law it is common to quote it. In this case, they cannot say it

is illegal because there is no US Code to quote .. so they say it might

be a violation .. but of what? That is where the hard work comes in.

 

There are MANY federal laws on restrictions of use for Appropriated vs

Nonappropriated funds for mails .. one of the many is the Department of

Defense series in DoD 4525.8-m, " DoD Official Mail Manual, " 12/26/2001.

But if one wants to understand some parts of that Manual they will need

a law degree .. preferably specializing in understanding that Manual.

 

In fact .. what the US Postal Service is referring to is the possibility

that someone could be charged with Fraud Against the Government .. or

Wrongful Use of Government Property (which is also fraud). There is

absolutely no chance that the casual user will be charged with a crime

for misusing a US Postal Service provided container!

 

Technically .. the US Gummit can arrest and prosecute any person .. be

they a US Gummit employee or private citizen .. for wrongful use of

Gummit property. This can include signing a personal check using a US

Gummit issue ball point pen. Technically .. the US Gummit can swoop

down on those businesses outside the gate of any military installation,

find one of those pens in use .. and arrest the owner. But it is NEVER

done. Laws are tools to be used when appropriate .. and though it might

appear to be harassment .. it might be appropriate to enforce such a

law in order to inconvenience or temporarily hold a person for a number

of reasons having nothing to do with the charged violation. Al Capone

did not go to prison for the murders, rapes, robberies, drug deals and

other crimes he committed .. it was for something less horrendous .. tax

evasion.

 

Having said this .. I am now waiting for someone to half read what I

have written and ask me why the Hell I am suggesting folks abuse the

system and violate the law. ;-)

 

What I am saying is .. that intent is one of the important issues and

there are ALWAYS a sufficient number of laws available to use when a law

enforcement officer or agency wants to use them .. if they think there

is evil intent .. like someone is routinely trying to circumvent the

system for personal gain. But the last thing cops and agencies want to

get involved with is picking nits off of a gnat's nut .. this is my

opinion and I spent a good part of my life in law enforcement.

 

> Who really must go to the Post Office to cause a possible ruckus,

> anyway? I choose to have peace between me and my postal teller.

 

Here I will disagree. I will cause a ruckus with any government or

semi government employee who oversteps their authority. I spent 30

years as a direct employee of the US Gummit and 10 more working for the

US Gummit in a contract position .. and I am certain that there is far

more confusion in the US Gummit than there is in private industry. One

of the reasons for this is the Civil Service laws that force the Gummit

to keep employees that would be fired on day one in private industry.

 

We're lucky in Friendsville, MD in that we have a great Post Mistress

but everybody will not be so lucky .. for those who are not lucky they

have a choice of submitting to the whims of some US Gummit stooge, who

is supposed to be working for them .. or standing up for their rights.

 

> Non-priority-mail boxes... I might reuse them if they aren't junked

> up outside (I decided long ago that turning them inside out was kind

> of tacky looking), but not to send products to my customers.

 

That's a personal choice .. a matter of esthetics, etc., and has nothing

to do with the subject that was discussed. I reuse any boxes we can get

our hands on .. the local grocery in Friendsville lets us pick through

their boxes and take what we want. But I ship lots of large wholesale

orders .. and I do not charge handling fees or whatever name folks tack

onto customer's bills to help cover the cost of their doing business.

 

Since extending services from direct bulk export to wholesale/retail (in

summer 1999) we have used such recycled boxes and have never had a single

complaint from a customer. But we also use styrofoam over packs for

bottles valued over $25. We can drop that overpack from a second story

window and it will protect the bottle. They cost me over $2 each but

still I don't charge handling and such nonsense so we intend to continue

to use recycled boxes.

 

> Good night, and good luck.

 

And to you. A recap of all this is .. I think .. that the US Gummit is

providing free boxes for use in mailing Express and Priority and maybe

other categories of US Mail .. and the intent is for those boxes to be

used for that purpose only .. and they can be recycled and use for that

purpose again. They cannot be used to store documents in one's archive

or for purposes other than mailing. And the reason why the US Gummit is

providing these containers free is .. to encourage citizens to use their

services instead of the services of their competitors.

 

> Butch Owen wrote:

>

>>Agree .. we do it also. My point was and still is .. that any clerk

>>who tells folks they can't do the above is fulla bull .. and the

>>original poster stated:

 

" I believe you CAN re-use a box, you just can't take a USPS priority

mail box, flip it inside-out, and use it for non-priority mail

shipments. " UNQUOTE

 

This is CORRECT! It is not illegal .. as a second poster stated ..

based on a bad experience with a clerk somewhere that was wrong.

 

> Good night, and good luck.

 

> Karen

 

And to you .. and y'all keep smiling. :-) Butch http://www.AV-AT.com

 

PS: For those of you who have friends or family overseas .. don't

waste your money sending Priority or Express Mail to an APO of FPO

address. Some USPS clerks don't know it but there is no Priority Mail

or Express Mail service to these addresses .. your parcel will get there

just as soon using a less costly means of shipping. This is one of the

cases where I have caused a ruckus .. last trip to the USA I was mailing

packages in Georgia and a lady wanted to send something fast to her

soldier son in Italy .. the clerk recommend Express Mail .. I got

involved .. the clerk got out of hand .. the clerk's supervisor heard

the ruckus and to make a long one short .. told the clerk he was wrong.