re:undocumented workers pay taxes question

[Guest guest]

Aromatherapy, herbs, natural living, etcIf this does refer to illegals and/or

green card visitors, they most likely don't pay taxes unless hired by an actual

corporation or something.

 

We battle with laborers underbidding jobs here in Arkansas. They are hard

working people and can get about 10 of their illegal immigrant friends on the

job and everyone gets paid under the table. They can get it done fast and

sometimes the quality is poor because it is done so fast.

 

Then my dear husband has to get hired to fix the mistakes of others...but the

sad part is he should have had the job originally bid in the first place. We pay

taxes. We dont have health insurance. We need dental work we cannot afford. My

husband has some minor medical things that need attention...but we cannot

afford.

And we have been in a recession in our area for at least 4 months maybe more.

The cheap workers are getting the work while the regular skilled locals are not.

Hubby has not had a decent job in at least 2 months and we have drained

everything we had to survive. We are down to NOTHING.

I am not blaming immigrants completely, please don't get me wrong. I am just

stating our own experience and how this particular situation has hurt our

family. When I take my children to the doctor, there are few English speaking

folks in the waiting room with me.

 

It is a situation I really hope finds a good solution for ALL people.

Blessings

-Love and Light-

Ray and Kristena Roder

http://www.dreamseeds.org

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

We battle with laborers underbidding jobs here in Arkansas. They are hard

working people and can get about 10 of their illegal immigrant friends on

the job

 

[Dave:] I’m so sorry about the impact this is having on your family. It’s

the same all over the country, with no area being immune. I see it in my

own situation as well. When I lost the lease on the shop where I’d been

repairing furniture and restoring antiques, I could not find a job, not

because of the illegals but because I’m 55 years old and have worked for

myself most of my life. I finally found a janitorial position, and I also

work two other part-time jobs, one janitorial and the other helping to care

for an elderly disabled man. We get along by cutting expenses to the bone.

The trouble is that we live under a system that was never designed to absorb

millions of freeloaders. Our system is designed to enrich special

interests, in this case health-care providers. Since I’ve stuck with the

job, I have insurance for the first time in about 12 years. Lately I’ve

noticed that the Kaiser ads on TV are in English and Spanish. It is what it

is.

 

 

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[Guest guest]

, " David Lambert " <dlmbrt wrote:

 

 

> The trouble is that we live under a system that was never designed

to absorb

> millions of freeloaders. Our system is designed to enrich special

> interests, in this case health-care providers. Since I've stuck

with the

> job, I have insurance for the first time in about 12 years. Lately I've

> noticed that the Kaiser ads on TV are in English and Spanish. It is

what it

> is.

 

Greetings Dave & Others,

I am one of those " Health Care Provider " , I am a nurse that worked in

the " System " for 24 years, specialty Emergency & Trauma, in a Not for

Profit hospital, University Affiliate, (read that to mean tons of

clinical research) that treated what we lovingly called the Creme De

le Creme of the World, and the La Gradu of the City. Millions of

dollars in free care every year. Because of " SYSTEMS " , Insurance

Companies, Pharmaceutical Companines, Techno Co. like Siemens and HP,

that charged health care entities ridiculous amounts, or in the case

of Insurance Co. contracts that paid $120.00 for every one of their

patients visits regardless of the care providied. (An average Level I

Trauma patient in the first 3 hours actual cost = $25,000, Heart

Attack with Angio = $17,000, this is what the hospital pays for staff,

meds, equipment, etc calc based on yr 2000 costs)

Hospitals were strangled in the late 90's and in an effort to save

themselves, brought Big business CEO's on to their boards. Well the

motto: Do more with less. Since the Health care entities couldn't

control what insurance co were paying them, nor what Pharm and techno

were charging, what they could control was Staff salaries and number

of employees. So the knee jerk reaction, cut Nursing positions get

" Care extenders " , CNA,s and NA (Not bad but not knowledgable).

So now you have fewer Nurses, and Docs for that matter, working longer

hours for less. I stepped down from my position as Nurse Manager of

Emergency & Trauma in protest, I am not going to ask my staff to work

in an environment that sets them up to make mistakes, not because they

are negligent, but because they aren't ameobas, they can't slpit, and

no one can do a good job taking care of 30 people at one time. I

stepped into a staff position for another year, and finally stepped

away. I was afraid I would kill someone, not out of negligence or

stupidity, but because I could not provide the care that they needed.

I wouldn't be able to cope with that burden on my soul.

Yes some corp have gotten into the Health delivery system. But it's

not the Providers that are the problem. It's a system problem that

goes way past them, to Big business, outsourcing of jobs, politicians

unwilling to open the keg of worms called free enterprise.

This goes to the discussions on immigrants, and Butch I hear ya!

Social Security.

I don't know the answer, I am now working for a school district, with

no benenfits, single parent, 2 kids, cancel the cable, we're eatin

macaroni and cheese. Strap on the belt it's gonna be a wild ride.

My answer, get involved, go to your City Council meetings, VOTE, more

importantly, know what your voting for.

One more thing on voting and political info. Many great bills that

you wonder what happened to that, why didn't it pass. Get riders hung

on them at the last round. Things you wouldn't stand for ever. The

riders, which frequently have nothing to do with the original bill,

usually some pork thing, kill the bills. Like I said get involved, be

an Army of One.

PS The hospital I worked for and still love, gave $74 million (Their

cost) in free care to the uninsured/under insured last year.

Respectfully,

Lynn

[Guest guest]

I am one of those " Health Care Provider " , I am a nurse that worked in

the " System " for 24 years

 

[Dave:] Lynn, thanks for honestly and dispassionately showing us the other

side of the coin. I don’t have all the answers either – though I tend to

shoot from the hip just as if I did.

 

(An average Level I

Trauma patient in the first 3 hours actual cost = $25,000, Heart

Attack with Angio = $17,000, this is what the hospital pays for staff,

meds, equipment, etc calc based on yr 2000 costs)

 

[Dave:] I have no doubt of this. I guess what I’m suggesting is that we

need some kind of a new paradigm when it comes to providing all kinds of

services and products, too. Something that says: what’s the least I can

provide this to the world for, and still prosper? and not: what’s the most I

can get for this?

 

Since the Health care entities couldn't

control what insurance co were paying them, nor what Pharm and techno

were charging, what they could control was Staff salaries and number

of employees.

 

[Dave:] There’s sure something wrong with the picture, and in the short run

I don’t know how to fix it anymore than anyone else. On the matter of

illegals, I know the common wisdom says that they are overrunning our public

health-care system and that hospitals are closing as a result. I’ve also

read some surveys that say no, this is not the case, and lay the blame for

hospital closings on everything from soulless corporations to simple

mismanagement.

 

Me, I’m just a janitor, but even I know that people have always tended to

make the same kinds of mistakes, especially under pressure, and that people

in power cluster together and make as many blunders as any of them might on

his own. I know that greed is universal. So when I read about a crisis in

health care, or governance, or taxation, or military tensions, I know that

the same things are going on that activated the same thing in ancient Rome,

or in any other period and place.

 

Yes some corp have gotten into the Health delivery system. But it's

not the Providers that are the problem. It's a system problem that

goes way past them, to Big business, outsourcing of jobs, politicians

unwilling to open the keg of worms called free enterprise.

 

[Dave:] I absolutely agree.

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

> [Dave:] There's sure something wrong with the picture, and in the

short run

> I don't know how to fix it anymore than anyone else. On the matter of

> illegals, I know the common wisdom says that they are overrunning

our public

> health-care system and that hospitals are closing as a result. I've

also

> read some surveys that say no, this is not the case, and lay the

blame for

> hospital closings on everything from soulless corporations to simple

> mismanagement.

 

Hi Dave,

Absolutely no offense taken, to be informed is to have power, and

thanks for reflecting that my response was dispassionate. I can get a

little heady on the subject, it's dear to my heart.

At least where I live, it's not illeagals, however huge amts of

uninsured, underinsured folks who don't /can't go for wellness care,

and use Emergency Departments for clinic care, far more costly

overall, and bind up the system hence 3-4 hour waits for care here.

On the east coast my friends in the biz note 2 day waits for care,

with some folks doing their whole hospital stay in the ED, because

there are " No rooms at the Inn " . This dramatically increases cost for

everyone, because Emergency care is the most expensive care out there.

Those uninsured/underinsured aren't jobless folks who are laying

around doing nothing, they are hard working folks that surely can't

afford any type of medical expense. I will say for the most part it's

good to be a kid in America, cause there are tons of programs for

gettin free care for kids. As an adult the well dries up.

Your right about some souless corps or poor management as well, and

unfortunately everyone, patients and staff both get blasted when that

happens

 

> Me, I'm just a janitor,

 

Scuse me, just a Janitor, you buddy, are the life blood of the

facility you work for, cause without you they'd be knee deep in their

own.....

Not to mention that the Housekeeping/Janitorial staff know more about

what's goin' down at a company than anyone else. They travel all over

a complex, and hear stuff whether they want to or not. They also have

access to all the dirt...The Trash. For me, my best help mates at the

hospital were housekeeping, they could turn a room over, or not,

depending on your relationship with them, and help me do my job more

than anyone else. The clean up crew, and secretaries/assistance are

it. I know all their names wherever I work. Don't walk by a piece of

trash without picking it up. do as much on my own as I can to not

overburden either group.

Maybe something we should all do more of, Give and you shall recieve,

pay it forward. When I do it, magic happens for me, and the kids I

take care of. That would be 2200 little high school darlins',

manipulators all, but that's their job, mine is to prepare them for

replacing me, and keeping them healthy so they can do it. The more

folks on my side, the better I can do my job. It takes a village! OK

back up, not a political statement, just a reality, The good ole'

Boys, have a village, it's working for them. We just all need to get

a little more involved in our own villages.

Overall I'd say this group is far more health savvy than most, one of

the reasons I like it so much. Wary as well, a good thing these days.

Not everything you read or hear is true, even if it's your Doc

telling you. Question Question Question, and NEVER go to the hospital

by yourself, you don't feel well, and you won't take good notes!

 

but even I know that people have always tended to

> make the same kinds of mistakes, especially under pressure, and that

people

> in power cluster together and make as many blunders as any of them

might on

> his own. I know that greed is universal. So when I read about a

crisis in

> health care, or governance, or taxation, or military tensions, I

know that

> the same things are going on that activated the same thing in

ancient Rome,

> or in any other period and place.

 

History repeats itself...That's why a degree in history is a Good

Thing theses days. Study what went before, and try not to make the

same mistakes.

[Guest guest]

Absolutely no offense taken, to be informed is to have power, and

thanks for reflecting that my response was dispassionate. I can get a

little heady on the subject, it's dear to my heart.

 

[Dave:] I can tell, and I don’t blame you for that.

 

 

At least where I live, it's not illeagals, however huge amts of

uninsured, underinsured folks who don't /can't go for wellness care,

and use Emergency Departments for clinic care, far more costly

overall, and bind up the system

 

[Dave:] Been there, done that. I have McKaiser now, but for more than 10

years I was uninsured, and when I was an employer, I couldn’t afford to

offer insurance to my employees, and that kept me awake nights. Fortunately

for me, I’m healthier and stronger than I have any right to be considering

my mis-spent youth, and I was raised with a strong tradition of folk

medicine and self-reliance, even though I had doctors in the family. But

for those who are not robust, being uninsured is a sentence. I know, my

wife is disabled and for over a year we couldn’t afford her insurance. That

was hell for us both.

 

Your right about some souless corps or poor management as well, and

unfortunately everyone, patients and staff both get blasted when that

happens

 

[Dave:] It just seems to me that people are being victimized at every level

of the equation. Is the money not there? And are not people in the

health-care industry as well as every related industry becoming wealthy and

wealthier at the very top? Patients, dedicated pros, families and

communities all suffer, and since the money’s there, then something isn’t

being done right. What good is technology that no one can afford?

 

Scuse me, just a Janitor, you buddy, are the life blood of the

facility you work for, cause without you they'd be knee deep in their

own.....

Not to mention that the Housekeeping/-Janitorial staff know more about

what's goin' down at a company than anyone else

 

[Dave:] Oh yeah, haha, you know about that. It cuts both ways. On the one

hand, I’m qualified to do practically anything in the company. On the other

hand, I’m apparently the best janitor anyone has ever seen. The trouble

with being indispensable comes when it’s time to be promoted. Well, I

certainly haven’t gone through life wishing I could be a janitor, but since

that’s what I find myself doing these days, I try to do it well.

 

Overall I'd say this group is far more health savvy than most, one of

the reasons I like it so much. Wary as well, a good thing these days.

Not everything you read or hear is true, even if it's your Doc

telling you. Question Question Question, and NEVER go to the hospital

by yourself, you don't feel well, and you won't take good notes!

 

[Dave:] Yup, that about covers it. Good comments!

 

 

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