Guest guest Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I have a 40 pound dog that ingested a half a bar of rat poison. The poison in question is a blood clotting inhibitor, so in other words he will not be able to clot and will in turn bleed to death within the next 24 to 48 hours! Poison control says IV fluids which I have, and Vitamin K (clotting factor). My regular vet is not available by phone and the emergency vet does not have injectable Vitamin K. They will not write a prescription for the pharmacy to fill. the pharmacy only has it in human doses anyway and the vet can't figure out the conversion. In the meantime, I found that chlorfyll rich plant matter is loaded with natural Vitamin K. I have alfalfa pellets on hand and I want to make use of this idea. My thoughts were to make a alfalfa tea, if you will. I have to make it a drench-able solution as he will not usually or willingly eat anything other than his kibble. My question is how can I figure out how much is enough? Or too much? No one could tell me the poison rate for a 40 pound dog versus the poison content of 1/2 a bar of poison. This just happened and he is symptom free at this point and I want to keep it that way! If anyone has any thoughts on this matter I would greatly appreciate any insight, advice, experience or any other comments or ideas what so ever please! I have been lurking here for quite some time and I had never a reason to post as a noob to herbal living, but I have learned many valuable lessons within this forum. I thank all who read this post and especially those who can respond. many thanks, Kerry and " Winkers " the 12 year old poisoned corgi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Kerry, This is not something to mess with. Grab your phone book and start calling every Vet, Large animal and Small animal, until you find one that has injectable Vitamin K1. You also need to try and get as much out of the system as possible by inducing vomiting and you need to inhibit any more absorbsion by giving Activated Charcoal. You will also need to give Vitamin K1 tablets for 4 to 6 weeks as it takes that long to work all the anticoagulant out of the system. Laurie Hoppe _____ On Behalf Of Kerry Saturday, September 29, 2007 7:54 PM Help ...need vitamin K advice I have a 40 pound dog that ingested a half a bar of rat poison. The poison in question is a blood clotting inhibitor, so in other words he will not be able to clot and will in turn bleed to death within the next 24 to 48 hours! Poison control says IV fluids which I have, and Vitamin K (clotting factor). My regular vet is not available by phone and the emergency vet does not have injectable Vitamin K. They will not write a prescription for the pharmacy to fill. the pharmacy only has it in human doses anyway and the vet can't figure out the conversion. In the meantime, I found that chlorfyll rich plant matter is loaded with natural Vitamin K. I have alfalfa pellets on hand and I want to make use of this idea. My thoughts were to make a alfalfa tea, if you will. I have to make it a drench-able solution as he will not usually or willingly eat anything other than his kibble. My question is how can I figure out how much is enough? Or too much? No one could tell me the poison rate for a 40 pound dog versus the poison content of 1/2 a bar of poison. This just happened and he is symptom free at this point and I want to keep it that way! If anyone has any thoughts on this matter I would greatly appreciate any insight, advice, experience or any other comments or ideas what so ever please! I have been lurking here for quite some time and I had never a reason to post as a noob to herbal living, but I have learned many valuable lessons within this forum. I thank all who read this post and especially those who can respond. many thanks, Kerry and " Winkers " the 12 year old poisoned corgi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 > My question is how can I figure out how much is enough? Or too much? > No one could tell me the poison rate for a 40 pound dog > versus the poison content of 1/2 a bar of poison. [Dave]: Sounds like the poison is dicumerol. Very, very unpleasant. Lost a dog this way once, and it was a much larger one. I don't know what amount of poison is in half a bar of rat poison, but believe me, you're not going to OD your dog on alfalfa. Brew away. Let us know how this turns out. Keep the dog as quiet as you can for the next few days. Someone else will know more than I do but I wouldn't worry about the tea. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.33/1037 - Release 9/29/2007 1:32 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 RUN, do not walk to the nearest vet that is open. This is a deadly emergency that cannot be treated with alfalfa, and needs treatment ASAP if your dog is going to survive. >>My regular vet is not available by phone and the emergency vet does not have injectable Vitamin K. They will not write a prescription for the pharmacy to fill. the pharmacy only has it in human doses anyway and the vet can't figure out the conversion<< If this is true, then you need to get a new vet. Not only should they have it on the premises (for emergencies such as this) but the math to convert the dosage is very simple - if he can't do that then he's a terrible vet and should not be practicing. Please keep us posted and let us know how the dog is. Good luck, and please hurry. JenB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Vitamin K is found in cabbage, cauliflower, spinach and other green leafy vegetables, cereals, soybeans, and other vegetables. Vitamin K is also made by the bacteria that line the gastrointestinal tract. Couldn't you give your dog some leafy greens to eat right away? Kerry <funnyfarmnaturally Saturday, September 29, 2007 5:54:17 PM Help ...need vitamin K advice I have a 40 pound dog that ingested a half a bar of rat poison. The poison in question is a blood clotting inhibitor, so in other words he will not be able to clot and will in turn bleed to death within the next 24 to 48 hours! Poison control says IV fluids which I have, and Vitamin K (clotting factor). My regular vet is not available by phone and the emergency vet does not have injectable Vitamin K. They will not write a prescription for the pharmacy to fill. the pharmacy only has it in human doses anyway and the vet can't figure out the conversion. In the meantime, I found that chlorfyll rich plant matter is loaded with natural Vitamin K. I have alfalfa pellets on hand and I want to make use of this idea. My thoughts were to make a alfalfa tea, if you will. I have to make it a drench-able solution as he will not usually or willingly eat anything other than his kibble. My question is how can I figure out how much is enough? Or too much? No one could tell me the poison rate for a 40 pound dog versus the poison content of 1/2 a bar of poison. This just happened and he is symptom free at this point and I want to keep it that way! If anyone has any thoughts on this matter I would greatly appreciate any insight, advice, experience or any other comments or ideas what so ever please! I have been lurking here for quite some time and I had never a reason to post as a noob to herbal living, but I have learned many valuable lessons within this forum. I thank all who read this post and especially those who can respond. many thanks, Kerry and " Winkers " the 12 year old poisoned corgi ______________________________\ ____ Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Games. http://get.games./proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Okay, if it helps any, our 6lb dog ate rat poison about 4 months ago. She ate a whole bar of it! We took her to the emergency off. First off they made her throw up and tubed her with charcoal in her stomach to help absorb whatever was left. For the next 21 days we gave her 1 ml of Vitamin K. Hopefully, that will help convert that for you on a 40lb dog. Actually, with the rat poison, it takes about a week to kill a rat because of the blood clotting factors. As long as you don't see any blood in their stools or coming out of their noses, they should be fine. What you might want to do to is to try to find an emergency vet that might be a little further, but still give your dog some of the green veggies as well. You figure if they were giving 1ml per 6lbs then for a 40lb dog it should be about 7ml of Vitamin K. If you want they are more than happy to call our emergency vet down here to get the conversion rate! Email me privately if you would like the number. Best regards, Nikie Brown After The Rayne - Handmade Soaps & Bath Products http://www.aftertherayne.com nbrown 936-203-3188 On Behalf Of goldencougarwolf Sunday, September 30, 2007 1:27 PM Re: Help ...need vitamin K advice Vitamin K is found in cabbage, cauliflower, spinach and other green leafy vegetables, cereals, soybeans, and other vegetables. Vitamin K is also made by the bacteria that line the gastrointestinal tract. Couldn't you give your dog some leafy greens to eat right away? Kerry <funnyfarmnaturally Saturday, September 29, 2007 5:54:17 PM Help ...need vitamin K advice I have a 40 pound dog that ingested a half a bar of rat poison. The poison in question is a blood clotting inhibitor, so in other words he will not be able to clot and will in turn bleed to death within the next 24 to 48 hours! Poison control says IV fluids which I have, and Vitamin K (clotting factor). My regular vet is not available by phone and the emergency vet does not have injectable Vitamin K. They will not write a prescription for the pharmacy to fill. the pharmacy only has it in human doses anyway and the vet can't figure out the conversion. In the meantime, I found that chlorfyll rich plant matter is loaded with natural Vitamin K. I have alfalfa pellets on hand and I want to make use of this idea. My thoughts were to make a alfalfa tea, if you will. I have to make it a drench-able solution as he will not usually or willingly eat anything other than his kibble. My question is how can I figure out how much is enough? Or too much? No one could tell me the poison rate for a 40 pound dog versus the poison content of 1/2 a bar of poison. This just happened and he is symptom free at this point and I want to keep it that way! If anyone has any thoughts on this matter I would greatly appreciate any insight, advice, experience or any other comments or ideas what so ever please! I have been lurking here for quite some time and I had never a reason to post as a noob to herbal living, but I have learned many valuable lessons within this forum. I thank all who read this post and especially those who can respond. many thanks, Kerry and " Winkers " the 12 year old poisoned corgi ______________________ ____________ Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Games. http://get.games./proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Thank you all for your input. So far, so good. I have been drenching him with the alfalfa tea every two hours or so and shaklee's vitalea daily as well. He is tolerating it well as he is still eating normally. I am taking him to my regular vet tomorrow for a platlet count to see what effect the poison is having, if any. I am being optimistic! Apparantly vitamin K is a rare thing to dispense and so many clinics are not equipped for such an emergency. I was really surprised at that. I was told that it is generally only found at trauma centers and the like. Well again, thank you all and I will keep you abreast of our progress. Cheers, Kerry and Winkers The Funny Farm Rr 1 Box 1127 Hop Bottom, PA 18824 570-434-2367 Http:www.freewebs.com/funnyfarmnaturally/ Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Modern day rat poisons are long acting, and it could take several days or weeks for your dog to start hemorrhaging, and once he does the chances of survival are very slim. Time is of the essence here, if he really did eat rat poison, you are not being optimistic, you are gambling with your dog's life. Vit K is NOT a rare thing to dispense, except in a very rural or old fashioned practice. It's around 8$ a bottle. Your vet's casual attitude to what is considerd a life threatening emergency is puzzling. I've been a vet tech for 15 years - the dosage calculation is no big deal. Standard treatment is +/- gastric lavage, injectable vit K at multiple sites, and followup treatment with oral vit K for 6 weeks. please google rodenticide poisoning. Get your dog treated ASAP. Good luck. JenB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 , Jennifer Budai <jen wrote: > > > Modern day rat poisons are long acting, and it could take several > days or weeks for your dog to start hemorrhaging, and once he does > the chances of survival are very slim. Time is of the essence here, > if he really did eat rat poison, you are not being optimistic, you > are gambling with your dog's life. > > Vit K is NOT a rare thing to dispense, except in a very rural or old > fashioned practice. It's around 8$ a bottle. Your vet's casual > attitude to what is considerd a life threatening emergency is > puzzling. I've been a vet tech for 15 years - the dosage calculation > is no big deal. > > Standard treatment is +/- gastric lavage, injectable vit K at > multiple sites, and followup treatment with oral vit K for 6 weeks. > > please google rodenticide poisoning. > > Get your dog treated ASAP. > > Good luck. > > JenB You are right on the money on the very rural AND old fashioned! We have both going here unfortunately. But thank goodness for internet and good sense. I found the brand on line and it clearly identified the type of poison and the subsequent course of action. Luckily for us, it would take 400 grams for a 40 pound dog to be fatally effected. He only injested 14G. So the alfalfa was on a good track, but it would not have been nearly enough if he had eaten gross amounts of it. He is within normal blood chemistry at the moment and we will re test again in two weeks. We are giving him Vit.k for the next 10 days profalactically (sp?) As it turned out, the receptionist who answered my call at the emergency vet mistakenly told me that they couldnt dispense it, Which they could'nt but they could administer it! Dumb mistake. But in any event, I thank you all for your help. It looks as though Wink is going to be just fine thankfully. Many regards, Kerry and Wink > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 First, call your vet. My bichon did the same thing and the vet had me feed him peroxide to make him vomit -- which dogs will do immediately. I hope you and your dog make it through this fine. Cindy B. On 9/29/07, Kerry <funnyfarmnaturally wrote: > > I have a 40 pound dog that ingested a half a bar of rat poison. The > poison in question is a blood clotting inhibitor, so in other words he > will not be able to clot and will in turn bleed to death within the > next 24 to 48 hours! > Poison control says IV fluids which I have, and Vitamin K (clotting > factor). > My regular vet is not available by phone and the emergency vet does > not have injectable Vitamin K. They will not write a prescription for > the pharmacy to fill. the pharmacy only has it in human doses anyway > and the vet can't figure out the conversion. > In the meantime, I found that chlorfyll rich plant matter is loaded > with natural Vitamin K. I have alfalfa pellets on hand and I want to > make use of this idea. My thoughts were to make a alfalfa tea, if you > will. I have to make it a drench-able solution as he will not usually > or willingly eat anything other than his kibble. > My question is how can I figure out how much is enough? Or too much? > No one could tell me the poison rate for a 40 pound dog versus the > poison content of 1/2 a bar of poison. This just happened and he is > symptom free at this point and I want to keep it that way! > If anyone has any thoughts on this matter I would greatly appreciate > any insight, advice, experience or any other comments or ideas what so > ever please! > I have been lurking here for quite some time and I had never a reason > to post as a noob to herbal living, but I have learned many valuable > lessons within this forum. I thank all who read this post and > especially those who can respond. > many thanks, > Kerry and > " Winkers " the 12 year old poisoned corgi > > > -- Cindy B. www.nonais.org Hope for America www.RonPaul2008.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 YAY!!! Its great that it looks as though your doggie will be alright.I was very concerned when i read about this being the animal lover that i am.I just didn't have any helpful info to contribute so i kept my mouth shut.Im sure you will keep your eye on him and his condition.Good luck!!! ~Moon~ Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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