breastfeeding problems

[Guest guest]

I just had a friend call me that just had a baby (after waiting 11

years!!!) and he was a bit early, had to be taken to NICU etc. He is

now home and she is having the hardest time with

breastfeeding. Apparently, she has quite a few things going on. She

has inverted nipples, and they are normally so sensitive that even

during sex, they are off limits to her hubby, it hurts just to stand

under the shower! So needless to say, BF is proving to be very

painful for her. Her Gyno gave her pain meds to slightly dull the

pain....but in her words... " for the first 5 minutes of him nursing,

it feels like every nerve in my breast is being pulled

out! " So....she asked about numbing stuff....tho I mentioned that

she wouldn't want the baby to get that every time he ate. She is

using some sort of silicone nipple shield?

My youngest is 17, so I am wayyy out of touch with new fangled

stuff! I can't think of anything EO to help her and not so sure that

there is anything herbal that will help with the nerve problems. *I*

have massive nerve damage from 3 screwed up back surgeries, and I am

here to tell you, there is very little out there to help with nerve

pain. I told her I would ask, so any advice you folks may have would be great!

[Guest guest]

I was going to suggest nipple shields but you said she's already tried that.

 

She could try getting in touch with the local La Leche League for

help--I've heard of a lot of people getting help that way.

 

HTH,

Serra

 

 

 

On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 8:41 PM, Chris Kelly <Purrrdy wrote:

> I just had a friend call me that just had a baby (after waiting 11

> years!!!) and he was a bit early, had to be taken to NICU etc. He is

> now home and she is having the hardest time with

> breastfeeding. Apparently, she has quite a few things going on. She

> has inverted nipples, and they are normally so sensitive that even

> during sex, they are off limits to her hubby, it hurts just to stand

> under the shower! So needless to say, BF is proving to be very

> painful for her. Her Gyno gave her pain meds to slightly dull the

> pain....but in her words... " for the first 5 minutes of him nursing,

> it feels like every nerve in my breast is being pulled

> out! " So....she asked about numbing stuff....tho I mentioned that

> she wouldn't want the baby to get that every time he ate. She is

> using some sort of silicone nipple shield?

> My youngest is 17, so I am wayyy out of touch with new fangled

> stuff! I can't think of anything EO to help her and not so sure that

> there is anything herbal that will help with the nerve problems. *I*

> have massive nerve damage from 3 screwed up back surgeries, and I am

> here to tell you, there is very little out there to help with nerve

> pain. I told her I would ask, so any advice you folks may have would be

> great!

>

>

 

 

--

Jewels, Navy and Wine are back for the cold weather, plus some other

very pretty washcloths.

 

Check them out at http://flickr.com/photos/scentedserra/2708725733/

[Guest guest]

>She could try getting in touch with the local La Leche League for

>help--I've heard of a lot of people getting help that way.

 

 

 

I second that! Let her call LLL, you can find their phone numbers here:

http://www.llli.org/WebUS.html

 

 

 

Saskia

 

 

 

..

 

 

<http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=2070936/grpspId=1705162397/msgId

=53474/stime=1221618022/nc1=5191945/nc2=5191951/nc3=5191953>

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

If breastfeeding is that much of a problem, might it

not be better to go to a GOOD formula, and enjoy the

feedings? What does it do to a child's psyche is

his nourishment is linked to mother's agony?

 

I am usually a nursing fanatic, but every rule has an

exception.

 

Sally Fallon's wonderful book " Nourishing Traditions. "

has a whole chapter devoted to feeding babies, complete

with recipes for home-made formula.

The whole book is sprinkled with fragments of Weston A.

Price's classic book " Nutrition and physical degeneration " .

I was going to copy one formula, but it should be read

in context.

 

Anyway, there is a lot on the website:

 

http://www.westonaprice.org/children/formula-faqs.html

 

Hoping for the best for Mom and babe

 

Ien in the Kootenays

http://freegreenliving.com

http://wildwholefoods.net

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hey there everyone,

 

I'm such a lurker but this post caught my eye and I thought I'd see

if I can add anything helpful.

 

I'm a postpartum doula with a fair deal of experience helping new

moms sort out breastfeeding issues. Truly the most important thing

for this new mom is for her to define her own success with non-

judgemental support people at her side. Asking those around her to

do the laundry, dishes and manage meals so she can focus on her new

baby will be so, so helpful. She can find a postpartum doula on

www.dona.org.

 

Calling up La Leche League is such a fantastic idea. They really

know their stuff and will give her good information to help her be

succesful.

 

Here's a poem I learned in a breastfeeding counselor class: " Tummy

to mummy, nose to nip, pull in the hips to open the lips. " So make

sure baby's belly is facing mom and have mom line the baby's nose to

her nipple rather than baby's mouth to nipple as he's latching. Then

pull that little tushy close which helps baby open wide and feel

close and secure. A wide open mouth will help baby get a good latch

which might help things be less painful.

 

I wish your friend all the best as she learns how to define her

amazing new role. Thank you for your love and concern to search for

answers on behalf of your surely overwhelmed friend.

 

Cheers,

Carol

[Guest guest]

Home-made formula is bad, bad news. DO NOT attempt to feed a baby

home-made formula. If your friend cannot breast feed for whatever

reason, please stick with a reputable formula recommended by a

pediatrician.

 

I had a really really awful breastfeeding experience. I was overseas

and had no support or resources, and I experienced a lot of

excruciating pain and PPD to boot. I pleased to say that my now 3.5

year old is just fine.

 

Breastfeeding is not always easy. If you have inverted or flat

nipples, it takes time for the ligament that holds the nipple in to

stretch. It also takes some time for skin to thicken and sensation to

dull. If your friend is really committed to breastfeeding, encourage

her to take it day by day, and give it some time. PLEASE get her in

touch with LLL people so she can get some info and support.

 

Best of luck to her and baby.

 

JenB

[Guest guest]

I'm surprised that this lady waited until her baby was born to be concerned

with this. Most books and drs. (at least 25- 30 yrs. ago when I had my

children) recommended that if you had inverted nipples you begin

" exercising " and preparing the nipples long before the baby is born so that

you could breastfeed in comfort! I would definitely suggest she find a

LaLeche League for support - they can help her find solutions, or begin

giving her baby formula. Seems to me (this is something I feel strongly

about) that many women of today are not dedicated to breastfeeding. Although

it wasn't popular then, I wouldn't have done it any other way unless I

absolutely HAD to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jan G

 

_____

 

On Behalf Of Jennifer Budai

Thursday, September 18, 2008 5:50 AM

 

Re: breastfeeding problems

 

 

 

Home-made formula is bad, bad news. DO NOT attempt to feed a baby

home-made formula. If your friend cannot breast feed for whatever

reason, please stick with a reputable formula recommended by a

pediatrician.

 

I had a really really awful breastfeeding experience. I was overseas

and had no support or resources, and I experienced a lot of

excruciating pain and PPD to boot. I pleased to say that my now 3.5

year old is just fine.

 

Breastfeeding is not always easy. If you have inverted or flat

nipples, it takes time for the ligament that holds the nipple in to

stretch. It also takes some time for skin to thicken and sensation to

dull. If your friend is really committed to breastfeeding, encourage

her to take it day by day, and give it some time. PLEASE get her in

touch with LLL people so she can get some info and support.

 

Best of luck to her and baby.

 

JenB

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Jennifer Budai wrote:

 

<Home-made formula is bad, bad news. DO NOT attempt to feed a baby

home-made formula. If your friend cannot breast feed for whatever

reason, please stick with a reputable formula recommended by a

pediatrician.>

 

 

I was NOT suggesting just any old home-made formula,

but the extremely well-researched recommendations

on the Weston A Price website.

 

" Reputable formula recommended by a pediatrician "

could include any soy-based garbage put out by an

established company. How many months did the MD

spend on training in nutrition?

 

Ien in the Kootenays

http://wildwholefoods.net

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Seems to me (this is something I feel strongly

about) that many women of today are not dedicated to breastfeeding.

 

Hold it! This poor girl has such sensitive breasts that her husband wasn't

allowed to play with them, yet she still tried breastfeeding. That sounds

pretty dedicated. I nursed my own forever, and am all in favor of breasts, but

there are times when dogma, even well-meaning dogma, can get in the way of a

reasonable solution.

 

Ien

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hear! Hear! Ien

 

Well said. I was a breast feeding fanatic, even the wretch that the top

Breast feeding expert in England called " weird " because he HATED nursing got

breast fed until he was 13 months old. However that was my CHOICE.

 

I was lucky to have a choice. I didn't have militants parked on my doorstep

shouting at me " Thou MUST breast feed " . I also didn't have anyone telling me

it was disgusting and should be kept private if one MUST indulge in that

sort of behaviour (although my mother and mother in law's attitude would

lean that way! LOL!). I also didn't have anything in the way physically or

mentally to prevent me from feeding the little hooligans. I had a choice.

 

This poor woman is trying her BEST and that is all anyone can ask. Quite

frankly, as someone who is not into pain, I wouldn't blame her if she went

to the bottle now and in fact I'd probably ask her why she didn't do it

sooner. Most of my generation were bottle fed. It was not the " done thing "

to breastfeed a baby. Funnily enough my generation seems to be doing just

fine, Thank you!.

 

Yes call in LL and see if they can help. However at the end of the day, the

choice is hers and if she decides it's just too darn painful to continue,

then I hope her friends and family go out and buy all the equipment needed,

and give her all the support and encouragement she wants and needs and never

let her feel like a failure. Someone who tries that hard has all the

earmarks of a good mom. What more could a baby ask for?

 

K

 

 

--

Kathleen Petrides

Bead Hussy

http://www.BeadHussy.com

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

>This poor girl has such sensitive breasts that her husband wasn't allowed

to play with them

 

 

 

I had such sensitive nipples too. my husband couldn't even point at them,

let alone touch them. But I breastfed my two children, the oldest for 4

years, and the youngest for 3 years. It took me 6 weeks to not feel a

pailsensation every time my firstborn latched on, but after that I was fine.

My nipples hardened a bit, and now my husband is allowed to touch them and I

even enjoy it :-)

 

 

 

Saskia

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

As I stated in my original post, " I would definitely suggest she find a

LaLeche League for support - they can help her find solutions, or begin

giving her baby formula. " I never said this individual was not dedicated -

that was a generalization! Considering the age of myown children, I see/hear

this often from their friends who are having children, so I DO know what I'm

talking about! They see it as an inconvenience. Primarily because it means

giving something of themselves. If you bottle feed your baby, well, anyone

can do that!

 

 

 

Jan G

 

_____

 

On Behalf Of Ieneke van Houten

Thursday, September 18, 2008 12:56 PM

 

Re: Re: breastfeeding problems

 

 

 

Seems to me (this is something I feel strongly

about) that many women of today are not dedicated to breastfeeding.

 

Hold it! This poor girl has such sensitive breasts that her husband wasn't

allowed to play with them, yet she still tried breastfeeding. That sounds

pretty dedicated. I nursed my own forever, and am all in favor of breasts,

but there are times when dogma, even well-meaning dogma, can get in the way

of a

reasonable solution.

 

Ien

 

 

 

 

 

 

..

 

 

<http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=2070936/grpspId=1705162397/msgId

=53496/stime=1221756956/nc1=5191951/nc2=5191949/nc3=4025304>

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

>I was NOT suggesting just any old home-made formula,

>but the extremely well-researched recommendations

>on the Weston A Price website.

 

> " Reputable formula recommended by a pediatrician "

>could include any soy-based garbage put out by an

>established company. How many months did the MD

>spend on training in nutrition?~~

 

~~~

 

First, let me point out that I do have a passing knowledge about

infant nutrition.

 

I went and looked at these formula recipes and they are NOT well

researched - they are down right dangerous!

 

Infant kidneys are extremely sensitive to salinity and mineral balance

- these formulas could easily RUIN a baby's delicate kidneys, OR cause

damage not apparent until later in life.

 

From the website:

 

LIVER-BASED FORMULA

Makes about 36 ounces

 

Our liver-based formula also mimics the nutrient profile of mother's

milk. It is extremely important to include coconut oil in this formula

as it is the only ingredient that provides the special medium-chain

saturated fats found in mother's milk. As with the milk-based formula,

all oils should be truly expeller-expressed.

 

3 3/4 cups homemade beef or chicken broth

2 ounces organic liver, cut into small pieces

5 tablespoons lactose*

1/4 teaspoon bifidobacterium infantis**

1/4 cup homemade liquid whey (See recipe for whey, below)

1 tablespoon coconut oil*

1 teaspoon cod liver oil or 1/2 teaspoon high-vitamin cod liver oil*

1 teaspoon unrefined sunflower oil*

2 teaspoons extra virgin olive oil

1 teaspoon acerola powder

 

*Available from Radiant Life 888-593-8333, www.radiantlifecatalog.com

**Available from Natren 866-462-8736, www.natren.com. Also, please

note earlier versions of this web page called for 1 tsp of

bifidobacterium infantis--this was a typo.

 

Simmer liver gently in broth until the meat is cooked through. Liquefy

using a handheld blender or in a food processor. When the liver broth

has cooled, stir in remaining ingredients. Store in a very clean glass

or stainless steel container. To serve, stir formula well and pour 6

to 8 ounces in a very clean glass bottle. Attach a clean nipple and

set in a pan of simmering water until formula is warm but not hot to

the touch, shake well and feed to baby. (Never heat formula in a

microwave oven!)

 

 

 

and this:

 

 

 

" Breastfeeding is best. . . in a perfect world. But the world is not

perfect and self-evident statements are not always true. Breastfeeding

advocates argue that breast-fed children have lower mortality rates

and better levels of health than formulafed children. In third world

countries, where the cleanliness needed for safe bottle-feeding is

lacking, this is undoubtedly true. But a perusal of recent studies

comparing breastfed and formula-fed infants presents a real dilemma

for breastfeeding advocates because the research does not provide a

clear case of benefit. "

 

~~~

 

That last statement is so full of bovine excrement (as Butch says.) A

" persual of recent studies " would actually show they are finding more

and more benefits to breastfeeding everyday.

 

 

But I can't even begin to go over the ways in which this home-made

formula is so very very dangerous for an infant, but for one, an

infant's digestive system is not ready to digest those large meat

proteins - OR complete whey proteins.

 

There is nothing here that is comparable to breastmilk.

 

Formula does not HAVE to be a soybased formula.

 

Most peds these day are more well versed in infant nutrition, i.e.:

formula and it's ingredients. Where they fail miserably in in

understanding breastfeeding, its importantance and how to properly

support and encourage new mothers.

 

Breastfeeding IS important - just look at what's happening in China,

but if the mother needs to stop for whatever reason, she should do so

with the help and guidence of a medical professional, not a website.

 

JenB

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I *HIGHLY* recommend that your friend contacts her local LLL leader. Meanwhile,

there are

wonderful resources on the LLLI.org website:

 

Breastfeeding Answers from La Leche League:

http://www.llli.org/nb.html

 

La Leche League Resources:

http://www.llli.org/resources.html

 

Proper Positioning and Latch:

http://www.llli.org/NB/NBlatch.html

 

Additionally, KellyMom.com was may SAVIOR when I was learning to breastfeed.

 

Illustrations on how to get a good, deep latch:

http://www.kellymom.com/newman/a-when_latching.html

 

These are good sources of information on inverted nipples:

http://www.breastfeeding-basics.com/html/flat_inverted.shtml

http://www.breastfeed-essentials.com/invertednipples.html

 

And please note what the above site says about the nipple shield. " ONLY TO BE

USED AS A

LAST RESORT, the nipple shield is a flexible nipple made out of silicone that is

placed over

the mother's nipple during feedings so that latch-on is possible for the baby.

To prevent

the baby from becoming too addicted to nursing with the shield, it should be

removed as

soon as the baby is latched-on and nursing well. The length of time during the

feeding

that the shield is used should also be steadily decreased. Possible problems

associated

with the use of nipples shields include a drop in the mother's milk supply and

insufficient

transfer of milk to the baby. Because of these possible risks, it is strongly

recommended

that you only use a nipple shield under the direct supervision of a lactation

expert such as

as a lactation consultant or La Leche League leader. It should be noted,

however, that even

with the possible risks of using a nipple shield, as long as the mother is aware

of what to

watch for, breastfeeding with a nipple shield is much more preferable to not

breastfeeding! " (http://www.breastfeed-essentials.com/invertednipples.html)

 

Good luck good for you for helping to support your friend! She needs your

encouragement. That said, she also should not feel anything negative about

providing her

baby with good, nourishing formula if she needs to.

 

Michelle

(typing while breastfeeding my 17mo DD!!)

 

 

, Chris Kelly <Purrrdy wrote:

>

> I just had a friend call me that just had a baby (after waiting 11

> years!!!) and he was a bit early, had to be taken to NICU etc. He is

> now home and she is having the hardest time with

> breastfeeding. Apparently, she has quite a few things going on. She

> has inverted nipples, and they are normally so sensitive that even

> during sex, they are off limits to her hubby, it hurts just to stand

> under the shower! So needless to say, BF is proving to be very

> painful for her. Her Gyno gave her pain meds to slightly dull the

> pain....but in her words... " for the first 5 minutes of him nursing,

> it feels like every nerve in my breast is being pulled

> out! " So....she asked about numbing stuff....tho I mentioned that

> she wouldn't want the baby to get that every time he ate. She is

> using some sort of silicone nipple shield?

> My youngest is 17, so I am wayyy out of touch with new fangled

> stuff! I can't think of anything EO to help her and not so sure that

> there is anything herbal that will help with the nerve problems. *I*

> have massive nerve damage from 3 screwed up back surgeries, and I am

> here to tell you, there is very little out there to help with nerve

> pain. I told her I would ask, so any advice you folks may have would be

great!

>

[Guest guest]

Nobody in this whole discussion ever doubted the

superiority of breastmilk. But just in case one

really can't, it is nice to know what's out there.

 

My daughter did nothing but rest and nurse for

the first three weeks of her son's life, there were

no problems with latching on etc, and yet she just

didn't have enough milk. The midwife noticed the

baby had actually lost weight.

 

I must admit that the liver formula does look a bit

weird, but it is all based on organic organs which

are impossible to come by anyhow. I doubt if

many people will use it.

 

Sally Fallon goes into great detail about why

certain ingredients are important.

 

I was an excellent cow in my day, and don't

have any personal knowledge on the topic of

formulas.

But I have a lot of respect for the work of

the Weston A Price foundation, and thought

the link might come in useful.

That's all.

 

Ien in the Kootenays

http://freegreenliving.com

~Our redemption is in the beauty of the world

for of Love and Beauty we are made~

Ger Agrey-Thatcher, " The Gaia Code "

 

Ien Eat Wild. Feel Great.

Get Paid for Saving the Rainforest.

Ien in the Kootenays

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I was wondering.....it's been 8yrs since I nursed....but wasn't there some kind

of cream you can put on the nipple to help with something?  Or was that for

cracking?  Genevive

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Yes there was a cream and we were told to let our breasts air too.  Back in my

grandmother's day, if your had your milk impacted or an infection, they used

puppies to get that out..........NO ITS NOT A JOKE.

 

re: cream for nipples