OT: Aspirin vs Rat Poison ** Was: Blood Thinners

[Guest guest]

Howdy Bill from Tennessee .. Gary from Milwaukee .. or thereabouts.

 

Lots of snipping I did .. but Bill wrote:

 

> BTW Gary, aspirin was also developed from rat poison. Thought you

> would want to know about that.

 

I would like to know about that too cause its new info to this old boy. Might

be true but if it is I would like to know what the connection is.

 

Both Coumadin (found in some rat poisons) and Aspirin (acetylsalicylic acid),

are common blood thinners and both can have some serious side effects .. but I

wonder where you got the information that Aspirin was developed from a rat

poison?

 

Around 420 B.C. or so, Hippocrates was using a powder made from the bark and

leaves of a willow tree to make a medicine to stop pain and fever .. and in the

1820s scientists discovered that the active ingredient in what he used back then

was " salicin " .. and they assumed that was probably what caused Hippocrates'

potions to work.

 

A few years after that some scientists split or separated salicin into two major

components .. sugar (found in most plants) and salicylaldehyde. Then they

converted the salicylaldehyde to a pure acid compound .. salicylic acid .. which

we should not confuse with the Methyl salicylate found in Wintergreen and Sweet

Birch .. but .. read on ..

 

They found that Salicylic acid worked mighty well but it was mighty tough on the

stomach so in the mid 1800s they neutralized (buffered) it with Sodium

salicylate and with Acetyl chloride. As a matter of trivia .. today Sodium

salicylate is generally made from Sodium phenolate and carbon dioxide using high

temperatures and high pressure .. but way back then it was likely that they

created it from the Methyl salicylate found in Wintergreen and Sweet Birch.

And .. today Sodium salicylate is used in some anti inflammatory drugs and as

part of a treatment for cancer .. plus .. in some cases its used as a

replacement ingredient for a generic Aspirin .. for folks who can't deal with

straight up Aspirin.

 

Back at the ranch. That potion (Salicylic acid buffered with Sodium salicylate

and with Acetyl chloride) lingered around for some 50 years without becoming

too popular till 1899 when a German scientist approached Bayer with an idea of

marketing it .. and in 1900 Bayer created what we today know as Aspirin

(Acetylsalicylic acid).

 

The " A " came from acetyl chloride .. the " spir " from Spiraea ulmaria (the plant

they used to obtain the salicylic acid) .. and the " in " was then a common name

ending for medicines.

 

Bayer marketed this potion as a powder and it wasn't until 1915 that it was

produced in tablet form.

 

When I was a youngun I recall most country folks still referred to products for

pain as " headache powders " . We also used a potion back then called Groves

Chill Tonic .. I drank it more than once .. lots of quinine. It was made and

patented by Dr. Edwin Grove http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwin_Wiley_Grove ..

and .. http://tennesseeencyclopedia.net/imagegallery.php?EntryID=G044a

... right here in Gawd's Kuntry .. in our County Seat of Henry County .. Paris,

TN ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris,_Tennessee

 

I have a small bottle collection .. some going back over 100 years. Most of

them are from my dad who traded German clocks to a feller who had a contract to

clean off some land in Cripple Creek, Colorado a buncha years ago .. but I also

have a few Groves bottles from my great aunt.

 

I was born in 1942 but when I was a youngun in the early 1950s folks were still

using a lotta wild and homespun medicines .. Groves Chill Tonic, Black Draught,

Turpentine, Asafetida, Sassafras Tea, Sulfur, Lard, Tobacco and Poke Salad .. to

name a few. Some folks around here still use some of these remedies.

 

Back at the ranch again .. today we have forty leven products based on Aspirin

and scientists are bantering back and forth as to whether Aspirin should be

classified as a Wonder Drug or a Miracle Drug.

 

I capitalized the word Aspirin in this post cause it was a patented name ..

owned by Bayer .. till it was taken away from them after World War I.

 

Obviously I was not born with this information .. it comes from simple research

which could be flawed.. but I am still wondering where you got the information

that Aspirin was developed from a rat poison. Could be that the two share some

common chemical components .. but I doubt it. Best as I can determine .. the

makings of Aspirin were around and in use long before any rat poisons.

 

The class of rat poisons that might be confused with Aspirin are the

anticoagulant poisons .. but they normally contain brodificoum, diphacinone,

warfarin, bromadiolone and some other chemical compounds which don't appear to

have ever been used in Aspirin.

 

Bill .. where from in Tennessee? Are you from the wild and uncivilized

Eastern part .. or from the civilized Western part?

 

Gary .. I recall your stroke .. and you pretty much missing the symptoms to the

point that you were lucky to have reached the emergency room when you did .. and

later you told the folks on the list how to not make the same mistakes you made

... you wrote ...

http://health./message/54257

 

One more thing Gary .. I heard that the Gummit was contemplating bringing

criminal charges against a family who voluntarily moved from West Tennessee to

Milwaukee .. said raising a youngun in a city like that was a cut and dry case

of Child Abuse. Though I rarely agree with our Gummit on anything .. I gotta

go along with them on this one. ;-)

 

Y'all have a gud'un .. and keep smiling. :-)

 

Butch ..... http://www.AV-AT.com

[Guest guest]

whoa. I totally feel like that baby on etrades commercial with all this

info....man I am sooooooo a shankapotamus....LOL......some of those old time

treatments are still used in the hills....in my house growin up if duct tap,

black salve, poultices , poke root and dandelion or elderberry home made

wine....well, if that didnt help, you just werent gonna make it....and they

wonder whats wrong my brother and his offspring.....ah, I can hear the banjo's

now.......

 

You left out the needle and thread pendulum. I have to insist that this be in

the kit along with all the sally sumpin or druthers you mentioned.

 

Cripple creek eh? My old stomping grounds. My dad was marshall of Green Mountain

Falls and a weekend in the rockies was to stay in the Jail for free in Cripple

Creek before it became a casino...I miss Old Cripple Creek.

 

Egads. I'm old enough to remember this stuff! Well, 'heard' this stuff. I loved

sitting and talking to the old folks about how it was and how baby gramma went

courtin in a horse and buggy with a chaparone and wore pantaloons and

bloomers...

 

You know my folks bought some land in Arkansas and my dad had the well 'witched'

and it was perfectly acceptable and his mother knew what herbs could cure what

ailment too.

 

Teas with the components of aspirin and if one was nursing a baby and got

mastitis, you could use cabbage poutices to dry up milk and those teas for pain

or....you could get new born pups so drain that infection out....and no, I'm not

kidding.

 

I do know that my grandmothers generation, the ladies had a particular fondness

of ether LOL.....

evie

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Butch,

 

I also snipped a bunch of good info from your posting.

 

I have no idea where I found out about aspirin and rat poison. It was on

the net and probably from on one of these groups. If it wasn't the

groups. Then it was from one of various e-mail newsletters sent to me by

the Health Sciences Institute(HSI).

 

Yes I know, that a lot of information just isn't right, here on the net.

Not saying they are downright lies, but I hope you get my drift.

 

As to where I live. In a retreat, at a site in Eastern Tennessee. Think

Tennessee mountains and you will be in the general area. I expect to

outlive a majority of people, WTSHTF(When The S _ _ _ Hits The Fan).

Notice I said retreat and not home, although it was built as a home.

 

Bill

 

Butch wrote:

> Howdy Bill from Tennessee .. Gary from Milwaukee .. or thereabouts.

>

> Lots of snipping I did .. but Bill wrote:

>

>> BTW Gary, aspirin was also developed from rat poison. Thought you

>> would want to know about that.

>

> I would like to know about that too cause its new info to this old

> boy. Might be true but if it is I would like to know what the

> connection is.

[Guest guest]

Butch is right.

It's the other way around, some rat poisons where made from the aspirin

compounds and coumarins, both easily found natural growing.

Willow bark, birch bark, contain the aspirin compounds, sweet woodruff,

white sweet clover contain the blood thinner compounds,.

C-M