OT: Health care bill

[Guest guest]

This is my last thought here on this subject, but I feel that many people

who are for this think it is only a start. This subject has come up for

many years in Washington and it is too big a subject to even get a

foothold. Somebody finally got the ball rolling. In my opinion, no magic

bullet at all. Doing nothing is how it was ... and it was plenty broke.

Now is the time to START to make some beneficial changes.

 

Thank you all for your thoughts.

 

Annie

 

 

> I agree that it should be a choice - some people just don't want to pay

> for uninsured people! And yes, some of the uninsured are lazy, but some

> are seriously out of work for whatever reason - health, whatever, some

> can't afford it, some are just loafs. I believe that everyone is

> concerned about money in the long run - isn't that what all this is

> about? The people who are for this reform think that it's going to be a

> magic bullet and make everything fair. That is a joke.

[Guest guest]

To cover all Americans, would be a single-payer plan. And Congress doesn’t

seem to be able/willing to pass that. Unfortunately, to cover more

Americans, they have to force some to participate. I don’t think the

penalty will ever become more than the insurance costs itself. I’m looking

forward to not having to worry about whether I can keep my coverage. I am

concerned about the insurance companies jacking the price, I hope they do

the right thing. Gretta

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On Behalf Of SusanP

Friday, March 26, 2010 8:00 AM

 

Re: OT: Health Care Bill

 

 

 

 

 

I understand the burdens that society faces when people are uninsured. BUT,

the goal of healthcare in our country was to make it available and/or

affordable for every American. The goal was never for the government to

force people into buying it to resolve the issue of said burden. And as

Penny says in her post, there is so much abuse and waste in the

industry-those are just some of the items that needed to be addressed. The

government has been dealing with this issue for years and has yet to fix the

flaws which would have truly allowed people to willingly obtain affordable

insurance or would have allowed the government the ability to cover those

who can't afford their own. No burdens to anyone if the politicians would

stop being politicians and just do the right thing. Susan

 

 

<%40> , Susan Morris <nineyearfocus

wrote:

>

> Hi Lisa:

>

> I agree with what you are saying here.

>

> It's true that you don't have to buy car insurance - you just can't

legally drive a car if you don't have insurance. At the heart of this is the

fact that when we drive we risk harming others, and the insurance helps to

compensate for that risk. If a person is blindsided by an illness or

accident that can only be cured by modern medicine and others are harmed

when we can't pay our own medical bills, then we are not being personally

responsible if we don't compensate for that risk somehow.

>

> My preference is to maintain my right as an American to boycott the

private insurance industry, because they've already taken enough of my

money. Which is why I would like to be able pay for and receive Medicaid

before I reach retirement age. I would gladly do that in a heartbeat. I have

a son who is on Medicaid due to his disabilities, and it is better than

private health insurance in many ways.

>

> Susan

>

> I also agree with the car insurance (for whoever said that - I can't

remember), because it's required in my state as well, and I really really

don't like having to pay extra in case there's an accident with someone who

is uninsured.

>

> Lisa

>

>

__

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

 

[Guest guest]

On 3/26/2010 1:27 PM, Victorianne Cain wrote:

> no one is taking away your freedom of choice--you can still keep whatever

insurance you have, you can now just choose another one (even i you are

chronically ill or have a pre-existing condition). We have to have auto

insurance, we all have police and fire protection, and free public schools

(which doesn't mean you can't choose private schools.� Neither does a public

option mean you can't choose private insurance.� And yes, like private

schools, private insurance will likely be more expensive.� But when more

people are buying in large groups, they can get better deals, as well.� i

really don't see what everyone is so upset about

 

Hi Vicky.....

 

Unless something changed radically in the Senate recently...There is no

Public Option in this health legislation...That ended last September

with Nancy Pelosi announcing she had not enough votes to support Public

Option...

 

The next day, a 200K fundraiser was announced at the mansion of a UHC

honcho for her....I know it was a coincident event...No one could be

that dense...Could they....?

 

Care...

 

--

Gary W. Bourbonais

L'Hermite Aromatique

A.J.P. (GIA)

http://www.facebook.com/Le.Hermite

[Guest guest]

Factor in crooked atty's , I got beat out of 4 years back pay which affected

also my monthly allotment, under 400.00 and I pay 96.50 for A and B. I have

other coverage with the hosp. my spouse works for and I cannot afford the ER

visit if I used his ins. Its over 500.00 if you go and are now spewing blood

from a carotid. I cut a deal as I had already lost my home, job, car etc.....I

did a no no. I tried to work 4 hours mid year the year I filed. BAD ME for

trying to do it. The way I figure it, with ins. premiums being what they are. No

matter where you go in the U. S if you get sick your ins should cover

you.....thats called portability.

 

Im more scared of the obvious calls for violence in our nation right now.

 

evie

[Guest guest]

On 3/26/2010 2:05 PM, Victorianne Cain wrote:

> If you read the bill, Medicaid and Medicare will not be affected (don't foget

that most of those who put this bill together and/or voted for it are

" babyboomers " �and about at retirement age, and/or have parents living longer

and longer now and needing Medicare, as well.� Go to www.whitehouse.gov and

read it.

>

 

Hi Vicky...

 

$460 billion in Medicare cuts and cost/benefit analysis as to allowable

treatments will certainly affect people...

 

I see what it says...It defies logic and reason...

 

We'll just have to see how it plays out...

 

I am going on Medicare shortly....I'd *love* to be wrong....<G>.....!

 

BTW...those that crafted and voted this bill for us are not part of that

system....After serving one term, they can retire in a situation you or

I can only dream about...

 

--

Gary W. Bourbonais

L'Hermite Aromatique

A.J.P. (GIA)

http://www.facebook.com/Le.Hermite

[Guest guest]

You are talking about two different concepts. Fire, police, schools-we all pay

into it because it is how we maintain our infrastructure as a society. Read the

other posts about car insurance and homeowners insurance. We are talking about

the government forcing you to buy something you may not want and if you have the

means to cover your own expenses than that is your right. And yes, there are

actually people in this country who have the means to fully support themselves.

Now, if there are people who cannot afford coverage than that is what universal

healthcare was supposed to be about. Cleaning up the faults in the current

system so healthcare is affordable to those who want it but currently can't

afford it or the government having the funds to cover those who have no means to

afford it. To make the point again, perhaps the government should force everyone

to get a job so we can eliminate welfare (excpet for the short terms help it is

supposed to give those trying to get back on their fee). After all, there are

able-bodied people who, for whatever reason, choose not to work and are living

on welfare. If we are going to force people to do something and take away free

choice how about that one? And yes, I have worked in that sector and have seen

the people who grew up in welfare homes and as adults stepped right on it

themselves.

 

, Victorianne Cain <vickycain wrote:

>

> i don't believe in being forced to pay, either, for something you don't want

or don't use, BUT we are forced to pay taxes to have schools, police, fire

fighters, etc. i pay big taxes for my school district, and all my kids are long

grown. What if when we had a fire they came out and said " Do you have fire

insurance? " Sometimes when enough people don't pay enough for everyone who

needs the services, it needs to be mandated. If, after that, you choose NOT to

use the health insurance, or want to put out your own fire, i'm sure there will

be no problem with that.

>

> --- On Fri, 3/26/10, Kathy <vanokat wrote:

> This is my big reason too. Call me a rebel but I can't help it - I grew up

> in a free country. Don't force me to pay with the threat of the IRS dawgs if

> I don't or worse...can' t pay.

> Good post.

> Kathy

>

>

>

> -

> " Lisa " <lisamerrill2007@ hotmail.com>

> > Well, my problem is that I don't WANT health insurance, and I don't

> > appreciate being FORCED into it.

>

[Guest guest]

Work at an ER for 6 months and I assure you. Your mind will change. You can pay

out medical bills. Some people cant and if you get cancer? You will be in a

bind if you dont have insurance. You will NOT get the chemo you need. I know. I

just buried a friend who had a jar on counters in convenience stores for help

with her treatment.....no money? No treatment. she leaves behind a freshman in

college, the first in her family line, and a son who is 25 to care for her.

 

Some illnesses cost much, much more than you can imagine. how fast could you

pay off 125,000.00?

Then again I guess you COULD just accept dying when you would have a shot at

life and get some really good pain killers while you are doped out until you

died. But who would care for you?

 

And we've not even touched those with mental illnesses who need real care....out

of site , out of mind. As long as they stay under their bridges they dont exist

I guess. Those of you who care to? If you know where the mentally ill tend to

inhabit, you can leave boxes of clothing, blankets, coats, handiwipes, pillows,

soaps and all sorts of things......they wont let you see them often but you can

leave the box. I do. The home I have isn't much compared to what I did have but

it is a roof and it embarrasses my spouse but on those cold nites when we are

snuggled together after a bowl of beans , rice and some cornbread you can bet

I'm thinking about those in the cold and I visualize them finding a clean warm

place to sleep. We have doctor's without borders..... I say charity begins at

home.

 

selkie

[Guest guest]

My husband works for a small company that is *fortunate* enough to get

their insurance

(Humana and it sucks) thru this much larger company. We were just told

that our insurance

will increase from $98.75 a week to $135.98 a week.....for the same

lousy insurance!

 

My take on all this is that the insurance companies will continue to

raise rates for as long as

they are able to do so...then when government steps in, they can

*reduce* their rates and we

will probably still be paying more than the original $98.75 a week!

This whole bill is a definite

give-away to the insurance companies...but what else is new in the US?

 

Sandi

 

 

> On 3/26/2010 1:27 PM, Victorianne Cain wrote:

>

>> � But when more people are buying in large groups, they can get better

deals, as well.� i really don't see what everyone is so upset about

>>

>

[Guest guest]

Then reform welfare. It has always been my stance to help the working

parent/parents with a percentage of help vs complete support which not only

traps many in the system but then creates a portion of society who only know

that part of the system. If you help those who work......they'll work and more

often than not its medical care that keeps that mother or father in the system.

Whats done now as a result is more and more doctors are denying those on

welfare . We have ONE dentist in town who will accept medicaid. He's got to be

89 if he's day .

 

Years ago when the oil field went bust many people went under. I had a sick

child who needed monthly meds we couldn't afford so I went to DHS and I didnt

ask for a handout.......I asked (naively) for a 'discount' on her drugs. The man

said 'how much money do you have in the bank' and I said '3000.00 and thats

about a month and a half and then zero. We have bills ' and he said

'no.......how much money do you have?' and I repeated myself and said 'look, I'm

NOT here for a handout. My child is sick and needs meds monthy we can't afford.

I dont want you to buy my food, I want a simple 25-30% discount on her meds and

I can manage a budget somehow. Beans, brown rice and cornbread at least have

protein, complex and simple carbs and I can grow veggies' and he repeated the

question AGAIN and I noted he was shaking his head 'no' . He wanted me to say I

had NO money. Finally he said 'when that money is gone.......come back and see

me. It finally occurred to me he

wanted me to say I had no money and to go take it out of the bank. When I was

fully tapped out I came back. Nice man. Rather rare at DHS and he said 'okay,

lets get you fixed up.' And do you know they paid for rent, utilities, food,

meds and the adults got three free med punches at the pharmacy and I NEVER used

those for us. Only for my kids. The pharmacist kept telling me 'but you dont

understand, you DONT have to pay for it' and I told her 'no, YOU don't

understand, I got help for MY CHILD, I'll pay for MY medication (I thought I was

saving the system a few bucks)......so the welfare system couldn't help us with

a discount thereby saving them money but were willing to pay for our living

expenses in totality? Well except for stuff you can't eat or use for

meds.....and that puts you in a precarious place.....you find a job that pays

you cash so you can buy stuff like underwear and hope you dont get caught. But

thats where a lot of money can be saved,

dont support the family, lend a hand.....its a form of slavery and keeping some

people in a certain area and away from the nicer neighborhoods. It is a trap.

 

I keep an old food stamp in an old bible I have. Havent read that thing in

years. Lots has changed in how I see things but I keep that to remember. Help

those who work and you wont find those three generation welfare families and

I've had my share of seeing those.

 

I recently gave a rather stinging appraisal of one of my family members who

views each child as more money from the System and it ticks me off to know that

I had to give up 4 years of my ss, did my best to raise honest kids and taught

them to work . They didn't like it either. They didn't want the free lunch

program and they didn't have to be embarrassed to stand in that

line......another line of socio-economical distinction for their peers to learn

early on who's valuable and who's not.....and to know one of my own siblings

kids knocked out babies like pez dispensers just rubs me raw. I didn't stay in

the system long......3 months was all I could deal with and shopping at midnite

so no one could see me and being red faced and sweating because I couldnt tear

that coupon out fast enough and always someone I knew would walk in.....I could

not handle it.

 

But to see people who feel entitled because they are inbred , illiterate,

ignorant and lazy is also not acceptable and if you tell them 'you get a job

and we'll help you?' you'll see some big differences in not so long a time. And

that ER thats a walk in clinic for some kid with a scab on his knee from last

week or some gal who wants her yearly pelvic or that guy who called an

ambulance because he figured out taking an ambulance got him in faster for an

IMPACTION....., if they can work and dont have a disability, then at least have

them pay 10.00 on the spot. One doctor did that in Ok. City for an experiment

and at the window was 'medicaid pts. 6.00 at time of service'.........most of

them walked back out. What does that tell you? They are conditioned to think

that and who did that? Where are the fail safes and the encouragement? Let a

woman do the DHS budget laws . Preferrably one who has had to raise a family and

stay within her means.....guarantee

you some big changes would come about and more people would go to work and

health care costs would go down and so would our deficit in some areas.Well they

would have before the wallstreet fell apart..... another issue...corruption

cannot fix corruption. There's a threat looming and those who 'have it' are

scared they might have to do without the best caviar and they dont like it and

they will buy, call in markers and pull strings from as many sources as they can

and you better believe that those in high offices for a long time will get

nervous.....and that will be the tell tale signs of who to boot out and proof

its time to start with a clean slate.

 

It aint about healthcare and it never was......say what you will about the

Kennedy's but JFK was not popular with those who were NOT catholic. I remember.

MLK was uppity and it was appalling that someone taught his ancestors to

read.....and now we have a young man who was voted into office by mostly whites

between the ages of 25-35 who are educated and I hope they are ready to stand up

one more time and look at the sources these mass mails of false birth documents

.. People like Tom Metzger, David Dukes and grand wizards every where,

survivalists etc have waited for this day and even prayed for this day and its

not about health care and for those of you in health care if it ticks you off

to deal with those who have less, I always thought medicine was a

calling......if you can't be civil and non judgmental remember.....because of

the sick YOU have a job and a purpose and if thats not enough I hear Walmart is

hiring. If you are people of color I do hope

this is not negatively affecting you. My family is many colors.

 

selkie. I'm done. I'll not say anymore. I've got a house to pack up and I wish

you all safety, sanity and prosperity and love.

[Guest guest]

On 3/27/2010 5:44 AM, Sandi Wakefield wrote:

>

> My take on all this is that the insurance companies will continue to

> raise rates for as long as

> they are able to do so...then when government steps in, they can

> *reduce* their rates and we

> will probably still be paying more than the original $98.75 a week!

> This whole bill is a definite

> give-away to the insurance companies...but what else is new in the US?

>

 

>> On 3/26/2010 1:27 PM, Victorianne Cain wrote:

>>

>>> � But when more people are buying in large groups, they can get better

deals, as well.� i really don't see what everyone is so upset about

>>>

 

Hi Sandi, Folks...

 

Some time back I saw the figure 30-40% increase in private insurance

premiums as one of the expected results of this plan.....It was not part

of the Plan, per se....but an expected result...

 

Guess you are one of the first, Sandi...

 

A Public Option might have curbed some of this...There was talk about

that for while, but a strategic fundraiser or two run by Health

Insurance folks changed that...

 

Maybe we'll see it back, down the road...

 

Care....

 

 

 

Gary W. Bourbonais

L'Hermite Aromatique

AJP (GIA)