Guest guest Posted July 1, 2006 Report Share Posted July 1, 2006 I have a question on a somewhat related topic regarding treatment to induce abortion. I had a friend call today who is due to deliver around July 23rd. She is having a vbac (vaginal birth after ceasarean), and her doula advised getting acupuncture. I'm concerned about the timing. With 3 weeks to go when is it ok to start needling? I'm concerned about her and the baby's safety as well as legalality. Anyone have experience? Thanks Wendy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 2, 2006 Report Share Posted July 2, 2006 Wendy, The summer issue of Qi Journal [http://qi-journal.com/] (V16 #2) has an article on acupressure for labor and delivery. Be well...mm www.balancemethod.org : A web site by and for Balance Method practitioners. , " wendyballen " <> wrote: > > I have a question on a somewhat related topic regarding treatment to induce abortion. I had a > friend call today who is due to deliver around July 23rd. She is having a vbac (vaginal birth > after ceasarean), and her doula advised getting acupuncture. I'm concerned about the timing. > With 3 weeks to go when is it ok to start needling? I'm concerned about her and the baby's > safety as well as legalality. Anyone have experience? > > Thanks > > Wendy > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2006 Report Share Posted July 5, 2006 Wendy, Zita West's ACUPUNCTURE IN PREGNANCY AND CHILDBIRTH is a great reference for you to check out. The author states that she will only use acupuncture in normal, healthy pregnant woman w/o complications. I have worked on 5 labor induction cases; all women went into labor within a week. All cases I worked on were also taking additional measures to induce (homeopathy, nipple stim, sex, herbs, etc.). Zita West states that acupuncture induction works best for women that are on or past their due date, and have higher success with multiple treatments in one day. In addition, it is important to communicate with the pregnant woman's midwife or physician and get their input. Hope this helps, and good luck. Cynthia Splies, L.Ac., RH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2006 Report Share Posted July 6, 2006 Zita West also has a new book that's supposed to be excellent. The title escapes me at the moment, but you could find it by searching under her name. As for liability insurance, you may not be covered for inductions. This is an issue I'm very much involved with at the moment. But, since this is an herbal listserv, I won't bore folks with the particulars. Email me if you want more on this. Best wishes, Sarah Rivkin, MS, LAc, Dipl. OM saydit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 Hi Sarah. I am interested in the liability insurance issue you have come across for labor inductions. My personal email is gzuleger. (Your personal email appears to be blocked from the post...I think ) Thanks much, in advance. Gina Zuleger , " Sarah Rivkin " <saydit wrote: > > Zita West also has a new book that's supposed to be excellent. The title escapes me at the > moment, but you could find it by searching under her name. > > As for liability insurance, you may not be covered for inductions. This is an issue I'm very > much involved with at the moment. But, since this is an herbal listserv, I won't bore folks > with the particulars. Email me if you want more on this. > > Best wishes, > > Sarah Rivkin, MS, LAc, Dipl. OM > saydit > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 My insurance broker said that I I am covered for everything except acupuncture anesthesia. This is from eastern Special Risk. -- Cara O. Frank, R.Ac, Dipl Ac & Ch.H. President China Herb Company Program Director of the Chinese Herb Program Tai Sophia Institute for the Healing Arts office: 215- 438-2977 fax: 215-849-3338 Www.chinaherbco.com Www.carafrank.com Gina Zuleger <gzuleger Mon, 17 Jul 2006 14:58:40 +0000 Re: Acupuncture to assist delivery Hi Sarah. I am interested in the liability insurance issue you have come across for labor inductions. My personal email is gzuleger <gzuleger%40sbcglobal.net> . (Your personal email appears to be blocked from the post...I think ) Thanks much, in advance. Gina Zuleger <%40> , " Sarah Rivkin " <saydit wrote: > > Zita West also has a new book that's supposed to be excellent. The title escapes me at the > moment, but you could find it by searching under her name. > > As for liability insurance, you may not be covered for inductions. This is an issue I'm very > much involved with at the moment. But, since this is an herbal listserv, I won't bore folks > with the particulars. Email me if you want more on this. > > Best wishes, > > Sarah Rivkin, MS, LAc, Dipl. OM > saydit > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 Does that include everything around pregnancy and delivery? Any special training required for that coverage? -Steve On Jul 17, 2006, at 3:47 PM, Cara Frank wrote: > eastern Special Risk Stephen Bonzak, M.S., L.Ac., Dipl. Ac. & C.H. Assistant Professor, Department of Herbal Medicine Pacific College of Oriental Medicine - Chicago sbonzak 773-470-6994 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 Yes. And no. what my agent said is this: read your policy. Everything is covered UNLESS it says it is not. Anesthesia is the only exclusion on my policy. Since I turn a lot of breeches and also induce women frequently, I needed to be clear about this. Cara -- Cara O. Frank, R.Ac, Dipl Ac & Ch.H. President China Herb Company Program Director of the Chinese Herb Program Tai Sophia Institute for the Healing Arts office: 215- 438-2977 fax: 215-849-3338 Www.chinaherbco.com Www.carafrank.com Stephen Bonzak <smb021169 Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:30:59 -0500 Re: Re: Acupuncture to assist delivery Does that include everything around pregnancy and delivery? Any special training required for that coverage? -Steve On Jul 17, 2006, at 3:47 PM, Cara Frank wrote: > eastern Special Risk Stephen Bonzak, M.S., L.Ac., Dipl. Ac. & C.H. Assistant Professor, Department of Herbal Medicine Pacific College of Oriental Medicine - Chicago sbonzak <sbonzak%40pacificcollege.edu> 773-470-6994 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Cara, Stephen, et al, When I spoke with Don (is that his name?) at Eastern Special Risk, he said, " Once labor starts, you're not covered. " This was just a couple of months ago. I would *love* to be wrong, as this is an unfortunate situation. Is your information any more current? Maybe this exclusion only applies to new policyholders? (I have not had insurance with them previously.) I am currently covered through AAC and they have offered me an obstetrics rider. However, I think they're quite restrictive about whom they'll offer the rider to. I spent two years interning in a hospital where I worked in L & D, so that was sufficient. So far, I think, they've only offered the rider to practioners who've participated in this program, although I assume they'll expand this as folks with comparable credentials request it. The unfortunate thing is that they will charge you per institution for coverage--so it's $x for one hospital $(x+x) for two $(x+x+x) for three, etc. And they don't to cover turning breech...So, AAC is a more restrictive and more expensive option than ESR at least used to be. Sorry to post all this acupuncture info to an herbs list, but it seemed folks were interested. Best wishes, Sarah Rivkin, MS, LAc, Dipl. OM saydit www.slopeacupuncture.com , Cara Frank <herbbabe wrote: > > Yes. And no. > what my agent said is this: read your policy. Everything is covered UNLESS > it says it is not. Anesthesia is the only exclusion on my policy. Since I > turn a lot of breeches and also induce women frequently, I needed to be > clear about this. > Cara > -- > Cara O. Frank, R.Ac, Dipl Ac & Ch.H. > President China Herb Company > Program Director of the Chinese Herb Program > Tai Sophia Institute for the Healing Arts > office: 215- 438-2977 > fax: 215-849-3338 > Www.chinaherbco.com > Www.carafrank.com > > > > > Stephen Bonzak <smb021169 > > Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:30:59 -0500 > > Re: Re: Acupuncture to assist delivery > > > > > > Does that include everything around pregnancy and delivery? Any > special training required for that coverage? > > -Steve > > On Jul 17, 2006, at 3:47 PM, Cara Frank wrote: > > > eastern Special Risk > Stephen Bonzak, M.S., L.Ac., Dipl. Ac. & C.H. > Assistant Professor, Department of Herbal Medicine > Pacific College of Oriental Medicine - Chicago > sbonzak <sbonzak%40pacificcollege.edu> > 773-470-6994 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2006 Report Share Posted July 19, 2006 Hi Sarah, yes- Don Naugle. This is my info. And I am covered for breeches on this policy. But not being able to treat women in labor is really a problem. I thought you could, as long as it wasn¹t anesthesia. Like, say, getting a slow labor to pick up. Cara -- Cara O. Frank, R.Ac, Dipl Ac & Ch.H. President China Herb Company Program Director of the Chinese Herb Program Tai Sophia Institute for the Healing Arts office: 215- 438-2977 fax: 215-849-3338 Www.chinaherbco.com Www.carafrank.com Sarah Rivkin <saydit Wed, 19 Jul 2006 02:48:56 +0000 Re: Acupuncture to assist delivery Cara, Stephen, et al, When I spoke with Don (is that his name?) at Eastern Special Risk, he said, " Once labor starts, you're not covered. " This was just a couple of months ago. I would *love* to be wrong, as this is an unfortunate situation. Is your information any more current? Maybe this exclusion only applies to new policyholders? (I have not had insurance with them previously.) I am currently covered through AAC and they have offered me an obstetrics rider. However, I think they're quite restrictive about whom they'll offer the rider to. I spent two years interning in a hospital where I worked in L & D, so that was sufficient. So far, I think, they've only offered the rider to practioners who've participated in this program, although I assume they'll expand this as folks with comparable credentials request it. The unfortunate thing is that they will charge you per institution for coverage--so it's $x for one hospital $(x+x) for two $(x+x+x) for three, etc. And they don't to cover turning breech...So, AAC is a more restrictive and more expensive option than ESR at least used to be. Sorry to post all this acupuncture info to an herbs list, but it seemed folks were interested. Best wishes, Sarah Rivkin, MS, LAc, Dipl. OM saydit <saydit%40excite.com> www.slopeacupuncture.com <%40> , Cara Frank <herbbabe wrote: > > Yes. And no. > what my agent said is this: read your policy. Everything is covered UNLESS > it says it is not. Anesthesia is the only exclusion on my policy. Since I > turn a lot of breeches and also induce women frequently, I needed to be > clear about this. > Cara > -- > Cara O. Frank, R.Ac, Dipl Ac & Ch.H. > President China Herb Company > Program Director of the Chinese Herb Program > Tai Sophia Institute for the Healing Arts > office: 215- 438-2977 > fax: 215-849-3338 > Www.chinaherbco.com > Www.carafrank.com > > > > > Stephen Bonzak <smb021169 > < <%40> > > Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:30:59 -0500 > < <%40> > > Re: Re: Acupuncture to assist delivery > > > > > > Does that include everything around pregnancy and delivery? Any > special training required for that coverage? > > -Steve > > On Jul 17, 2006, at 3:47 PM, Cara Frank wrote: > > > eastern Special Risk > Stephen Bonzak, M.S., L.Ac., Dipl. Ac. & C.H. > Assistant Professor, Department of Herbal Medicine > Pacific College of Oriental Medicine - Chicago > sbonzak <sbonzak%40pacificcollege.edu> > 773-470-6994 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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