Guest guest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 This has been discussed at length and elequently explained by Z'ev on a different list. But my short answer to this is that save for a few cases in the Shang Han Lun there is no hint of " healing crisis " in TCM. To have one, for me, in TCM is simply wrong treatment. TCM treatments should gracefully lead one back to restored health without crisis. Lonny Jarrett and others when focused on mental or spiritual health may see the unsurfacing of emotions expressed in physical forms. I would say that even then it is the responsibility of the practitioner to guide the patient into balance not simply tip the scales in the opposite direction. And to be clear, I'm not saying that Jarrett doesn't, just that those furtherest from TCM tend to view unwelcomed responses with the excuse of a healing crisis. Again, the homeopathic issue of a healing crisis is a different paradigm. doug , " " < wrote: > > Hi Thomas, Attilio & All, > > What is YOUR experience of the " healing crisis " and/or " Hering's Law of > Cure " in YOUR patients, especially those treated with acupuncture-type > therapy (including laser, point-injection, guasha, moxibustion, qigong, etc) > or herbal medicine? > > http://users.mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html says: > > " HERING'S LAW OF CURE: " All cure starts from within out, from the head > down and in reverse order as the symptoms have appeared. " > > Dr John Whitman Ray ... modified Hering's Law to the following: > > LAW OF HEALING CRISIS: " A healing crisis will occur only when an > individual is ready both physiologically and psychologically. The basic > foundation for all healing is nutritional preparedness. A healing crisis will > begin from within out, in reverse order chronologically as to how the > symptoms have appeared, tempered by the intensity of the trauma. The > individual will have the opportunity to re-experience each trauma, both > physiological and psychological, beginning with the trauma of least severity. > It must be recognised that traumas involving emotions, which include all > traumas, will be released in order, beginning with unconsciousness, then > apathy, grief, fear, anger, pain and eventually enthusiasm (love), in > conjunction with the appropriate word patterns for each emotion and > thought pattern (sensory memory) which are accessible at each level. > Unconditional love and unconditional forgiveness are the keys to apply and > transmute any resistance at any level, once these resistances are brought > to view through the application of the laws of love, light and perfection. > > With this definition Dr. Ray emphasises the importance of the emotional > side of our health problems. Each disease, accident or surgical intervention > contains a strong emotional component which needs to be re-experienced > during a reaction, otherwise the healing will remain incomplete and the > problem will present itself again at a later time for healing at a deeper level. > This also means that the body selects the kind of healing crisis that is most > appropriate at the time, taking into consideration its needs and abilities to > have a certain area healed or improved. We can consciously influence this > choice by working on a particular problem. I also noticed that the body self > tries to select a timing, which does not disable us during important events > coming up. I have no doubt that we are guided on our healing path by our > inner intelligence, which has our best interest at heart. In the beginning our > healing reactions will be mainly on the physical or biological level, but more > and more we will experience the release of emotional blocks and changes > in consciousness, preparing us for greater activity on the spiritual level. " > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Another potential cause for adverse effects of treatment is when an acute condition is getting worse, it may continue to get worse before it gets better. In the same way, even though there is more radiation coming from the sun at noon, it continues to get hotter and peak around 3 pm. On 12/6/06, wrote: > > This has been discussed at length and elequently explained by Z'ev on a > different list. But > my short answer to this is that save for a few cases in the Shang Han Lun > there is no hint > of " healing crisis " in TCM. To have one, for me, in TCM is simply wrong > treatment. TCM > treatments should gracefully lead one back to restored health without > crisis. > Lonny Jarrett and others when focused on mental or spiritual health may > see the > unsurfacing of emotions expressed in physical forms. I would say that even > then it is the > responsibility of the practitioner to guide the patient into balance not > simply tip the scales > in the opposite direction. And to be clear, I'm not saying that Jarrett > doesn't, just that > those furtherest from TCM tend to view unwelcomed responses with the > excuse of a > healing crisis. > Again, the homeopathic issue of a healing crisis is a different paradigm. > > doug > > --- In <%40>, > " " < wrote: > > > > Hi Thomas, Attilio & All, > > > > What is YOUR experience of the " healing crisis " and/or " Hering's Law of > > Cure " in YOUR patients, especially those treated with acupuncture-type > > therapy (including laser, point-injection, guasha, moxibustion, qigong, > etc) > > or herbal medicine? > > > > http://users.mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html<http://users.mrbean.net.au/\ %7Ewlast/healingcrisis.html>says: > > > > " HERING'S LAW OF CURE: " All cure starts from within out, from the head > > down and in reverse order as the symptoms have appeared. " > > > > Dr John Whitman Ray ... modified Hering's Law to the following: > > > > LAW OF HEALING CRISIS: " A healing crisis will occur only when an > > individual is ready both physiologically and psychologically. The basic > > foundation for all healing is nutritional preparedness. A healing crisis > will > > begin from within out, in reverse order chronologically as to how the > > symptoms have appeared, tempered by the intensity of the trauma. The > > individual will have the opportunity to re-experience each trauma, both > > physiological and psychological, beginning with the trauma of least > severity. > > It must be recognised that traumas involving emotions, which include all > > > traumas, will be released in order, beginning with unconsciousness, then > > > apathy, grief, fear, anger, pain and eventually enthusiasm (love), in > > conjunction with the appropriate word patterns for each emotion and > > thought pattern (sensory memory) which are accessible at each level. > > Unconditional love and unconditional forgiveness are the keys to apply > and > > transmute any resistance at any level, once these resistances are > brought > > to view through the application of the laws of love, light and > perfection. > > > > With this definition Dr. Ray emphasises the importance of the emotional > > side of our health problems. Each disease, accident or surgical > intervention > > contains a strong emotional component which needs to be re-experienced > > during a reaction, otherwise the healing will remain incomplete and the > > problem will present itself again at a later time for healing at a > deeper level. > > This also means that the body selects the kind of healing crisis that is > most > > appropriate at the time, taking into consideration its needs and > abilities to > > have a certain area healed or improved. We can consciously influence > this > > choice by working on a particular problem. I also noticed that the body > self > > tries to select a timing, which does not disable us during important > events > > coming up. I have no doubt that we are guided on our healing path by our > > > inner intelligence, which has our best interest at heart. In the > beginning our > > healing reactions will be mainly on the physical or biological level, > but more > > and more we will experience the release of emotional blocks and changes > > in consciousness, preparing us for greater activity on the spiritual > level. " > > > > > -- Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Doug, I think that your response may be generally true, but the healing crisis and homeopathic ideas like peeling away an onion do exist in Chinese medicine. This example is one reason I picked the case study that Chip and I released recently in the Lantern. It can be viewed at: Chinese Medicine/index.php?page=Chinese_Medicine_Articles) The title is Lurking Pathogens: A Qing Dynasty Case Study. It talks about lurking pathogens having multiple layers. The result of peeling away a layer, revealing the subsequent layer, can produce s/s that are worse then the first (layer). I have seen this in real clinical practice and will be publishing a personal case study that demonstrates this idea, in the near future. The key to understanding this concept is differentiating between a " proper progression " or " proper eviction " of a pathogen and what is just a mistreatment. But maybe more straightforward is looking at basic wenbing lurking pathogen theory. IMO, it does support the idea of healing crisis. Let us define healing crisis. The patient's presentation (s/s) gets much worse as a result of treatment and then get better, resolving an previous issue. (is that fair?) If so, let us look at a lurking pathogen that resides in the ying level as an example. When pathogen lingers in the ying or blood levels, the s/s actually might not be that severe. But as the pathogen is evicted out to i.e. the qi level, the presentation can suddenly become very violent and look much worse then what the patient normally deals with. They can feel quite 'sick'. This is especially true if their ying level pathogen has been hanging out for years. The eviction (to the qi level) can be the result of a proper treatment! Of course at this point in time one can evict the pathogen out of the body (potentially through the bowels). This experience, in the moment, can be unsettling if one does not understand what is happening. Therefore, if one understands lurking pathogen theory as well as wenbing 4 stages, then one can not only predict the course of disease but ensure the patient that they are having a positive progression. So I do disagree with the statement that " CM does not have a hint of healing crisis except for the SHL " ; warm disease theory does contain this. But generally speaking though, I think that people overuse the healing crisis concept to justify their mistreatment, and patients, at least in Boulder, are on to that one . I hope this expands things a bit. - _____ On Behalf Of Wednesday, December 06, 2006 12:35 PM Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " This has been discussed at length and elequently explained by Z'ev on a different list. But my short answer to this is that save for a few cases in the Shang Han Lun there is no hint of " healing crisis " in TCM. To have one, for me, in TCM is simply wrong treatment. TCM treatments should gracefully lead one back to restored health without crisis. Lonny Jarrett and others when focused on mental or spiritual health may see the unsurfacing of emotions expressed in physical forms. I would say that even then it is the responsibility of the practitioner to guide the patient into balance not simply tip the scales in the opposite direction. And to be clear, I'm not saying that Jarrett doesn't, just that those furtherest from TCM tend to view unwelcomed responses with the excuse of a healing crisis. Again, the homeopathic issue of a healing crisis is a different paradigm. doug @ <%40> , " " < wrote: > > Hi Thomas, Attilio & All, > > What is YOUR experience of the " healing crisis " and/or " Hering's Law of > Cure " in YOUR patients, especially those treated with acupuncture-type > therapy (including laser, point-injection, guasha, moxibustion, qigong, etc) > or herbal medicine? > > http://users. <http://users.mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html> mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html says: > > " HERING'S LAW OF CURE: " All cure starts from within out, from the head > down and in reverse order as the symptoms have appeared. " > > Dr John Whitman Ray ... modified Hering's Law to the following: > > LAW OF HEALING CRISIS: " A healing crisis will occur only when an > individual is ready both physiologically and psychologically. The basic > foundation for all healing is nutritional preparedness. A healing crisis will > begin from within out, in reverse order chronologically as to how the > symptoms have appeared, tempered by the intensity of the trauma. The > individual will have the opportunity to re-experience each trauma, both > physiological and psychological, beginning with the trauma of least severity. > It must be recognised that traumas involving emotions, which include all > traumas, will be released in order, beginning with unconsciousness, then > apathy, grief, fear, anger, pain and eventually enthusiasm (love), in > conjunction with the appropriate word patterns for each emotion and > thought pattern (sensory memory) which are accessible at each level. > Unconditional love and unconditional forgiveness are the keys to apply and > transmute any resistance at any level, once these resistances are brought > to view through the application of the laws of love, light and perfection. > > With this definition Dr. Ray emphasises the importance of the emotional > side of our health problems. Each disease, accident or surgical intervention > contains a strong emotional component which needs to be re-experienced > during a reaction, otherwise the healing will remain incomplete and the > problem will present itself again at a later time for healing at a deeper level. > This also means that the body selects the kind of healing crisis that is most > appropriate at the time, taking into consideration its needs and abilities to > have a certain area healed or improved. We can consciously influence this > choice by working on a particular problem. I also noticed that the body self > tries to select a timing, which does not disable us during important events > coming up. I have no doubt that we are guided on our healing path by our > inner intelligence, which has our best interest at heart. In the beginning our > healing reactions will be mainly on the physical or biological level, but more > and more we will experience the release of emotional blocks and changes > in consciousness, preparing us for greater activity on the spiritual level. " > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Jason, I just wanted to point out that I mentioned this article and Liu Bao-yi's writings in my lengthy post on another listserve, as an example of a possible parallel to the Law of Cure and layers of pathogens. I also concluded that the difference here is that this is a very particular type of disease progression (latent qi warm disease), and not a global theory for the general practice of medicine. On Dec 6, 2006, at 5:46 PM, wrote: > > I think that your response may be generally true, but the healing > crisis and > homeopathic ideas like peeling away an onion do exist in Chinese > medicine. > This example is one reason I picked the case study that Chip and I > released > recently in the Lantern. It can be viewed at: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Jason and Z'ev, fair enough. Although I agree that there are hints, I can't think of many outside of SHL and as you remind me, in Wen Bing. Perhaps Zang-fu Theory is less used to this type of perception because qi gets shuttled around the different organs to be eventually eliminated - presumably through the urination and the stool. One doesn't expect heart heat when treated with Huang Lian to show up as heat in the Small Intestine- urination.- No, it gets eliminated at the source and then drained often with the assistance of the Fu lIng, Mu dan pi etc.. . SHL and Wen Bing has a special from outside to inside progression. Perhaps that is the uniqueness of it's onion skin. I am sorry to hear that the patients in Boulder are on to the " healing crisis " defense. Hopefully they won't catch on the West Coast for awhile. ;-) doug , " " wrote: > > Doug, > > > > I think that your response may be generally true, but the healing crisis and > homeopathic ideas like peeling away an onion do exist in Chinese medicine. > This example is one reason I picked the case study that Chip and I released > recently in the Lantern. It can be viewed at: > > > > Chinese Medicine/index.php?page=Chinese_Medicine_Articles) > > > > The title is Lurking Pathogens: A Qing Dynasty Case Study. > > > > It talks about lurking pathogens having multiple layers. The result of > peeling away a layer, revealing the subsequent layer, can produce s/s that > are worse then the first (layer). I have seen this in real clinical practice > and will be publishing a personal case study that demonstrates this idea, in > the near future. The key to understanding this concept is differentiating > between a " proper progression " or " proper eviction " of a pathogen and what > is just a mistreatment. > > > > But maybe more straightforward is looking at basic wenbing lurking pathogen > theory. IMO, it does support the idea of healing crisis. Let us define > healing crisis. The patient's presentation (s/s) gets much worse as a result > of treatment and then get better, resolving an previous issue. (is that > fair?) If so, let us look at a lurking pathogen that resides in the ying > level as an example. > > > > When pathogen lingers in the ying or blood levels, the s/s actually might > not be that severe. But as the pathogen is evicted out to i.e. the qi level, > the presentation can suddenly become very violent and look much worse then > what the patient normally deals with. They can feel quite 'sick'. This is > especially true if their ying level pathogen has been hanging out for years. > The eviction (to the qi level) can be the result of a proper treatment! Of > course at this point in time one can evict the pathogen out of the body > (potentially through the bowels). This experience, in the moment, can be > unsettling if one does not understand what is happening. Therefore, if one > understands lurking pathogen theory as well as wenbing 4 stages, then one > can not only predict the course of disease but ensure the patient that they > are having a positive progression. > > > > So I do disagree with the statement that " CM does not have a hint of healing > crisis except for the SHL " ; warm disease theory does contain this. But > generally speaking though, I think that people overuse the healing crisis > concept to justify their mistreatment, and patients, at least in Boulder, > are on to that one . > > > > I hope this expands things a bit. > > > > - > > > > _____ > > > On Behalf Of > Wednesday, December 06, 2006 12:35 PM > > Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " > > > > This has been discussed at length and elequently explained by Z'ev on a > different list. But > my short answer to this is that save for a few cases in the Shang Han Lun > there is no hint > of " healing crisis " in TCM. To have one, for me, in TCM is simply wrong > treatment. TCM > treatments should gracefully lead one back to restored health without > crisis. > Lonny Jarrett and others when focused on mental or spiritual health may see > the > unsurfacing of emotions expressed in physical forms. I would say that even > then it is the > responsibility of the practitioner to guide the patient into balance not > simply tip the scales > in the opposite direction. And to be clear, I'm not saying that Jarrett > doesn't, just that > those furtherest from TCM tend to view unwelcomed responses with the excuse > of a > healing crisis. > Again, the homeopathic issue of a healing crisis is a different paradigm. > > doug > > @ <%40> > , " " <@> wrote: > > > > Hi Thomas, Attilio & All, > > > > What is YOUR experience of the " healing crisis " and/or " Hering's Law of > > Cure " in YOUR patients, especially those treated with acupuncture-type > > therapy (including laser, point-injection, guasha, moxibustion, qigong, > etc) > > or herbal medicine? > > > > http://users. <http://users.mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html> > mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html says: > > > > " HERING'S LAW OF CURE: " All cure starts from within out, from the head > > down and in reverse order as the symptoms have appeared. " > > > > Dr John Whitman Ray ... modified Hering's Law to the following: > > > > LAW OF HEALING CRISIS: " A healing crisis will occur only when an > > individual is ready both physiologically and psychologically. The basic > > foundation for all healing is nutritional preparedness. A healing crisis > will > > begin from within out, in reverse order chronologically as to how the > > symptoms have appeared, tempered by the intensity of the trauma. The > > individual will have the opportunity to re-experience each trauma, both > > physiological and psychological, beginning with the trauma of least > severity. > > It must be recognised that traumas involving emotions, which include all > > traumas, will be released in order, beginning with unconsciousness, then > > apathy, grief, fear, anger, pain and eventually enthusiasm (love), in > > conjunction with the appropriate word patterns for each emotion and > > thought pattern (sensory memory) which are accessible at each level. > > Unconditional love and unconditional forgiveness are the keys to apply and > > > transmute any resistance at any level, once these resistances are brought > > to view through the application of the laws of love, light and perfection. > > > > With this definition Dr. Ray emphasises the importance of the emotional > > side of our health problems. Each disease, accident or surgical > intervention > > contains a strong emotional component which needs to be re-experienced > > during a reaction, otherwise the healing will remain incomplete and the > > problem will present itself again at a later time for healing at a deeper > level. > > This also means that the body selects the kind of healing crisis that is > most > > appropriate at the time, taking into consideration its needs and abilities > to > > have a certain area healed or improved. We can consciously influence this > > choice by working on a particular problem. I also noticed that the body > self > > tries to select a timing, which does not disable us during important > events > > coming up. I have no doubt that we are guided on our healing path by our > > inner intelligence, which has our best interest at heart. In the beginning > our > > healing reactions will be mainly on the physical or biological level, but > more > > and more we will experience the release of emotional blocks and changes > > in consciousness, preparing us for greater activity on the spiritual > level. " > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Doug and group, I think that what you mention below exemplifies one of the weaknesses of zang-fu. Zang-fu explains things in a snapshot, versus a moving picture. Wenbing (and SHL) theory are not outdated nor just incorporated into zang-fu. They are separate theories in and of themselves, with bits and pieces integrated into zang-fu. Unfortunately the schools (/students coming out of the schools) teach (/know) very little of wenbing / SHL theory. Or should I say, the schools do not teach an actual way to think about the theories. They pretty much end it at memorizing formula names and the corresponding zang-fu pattern. IMO this approach misses the point. One has to understand how to THINK SHL / warm disease. I am wondering how much other schools teach of SHL and wenbing. Many school says they have a class, but IMO this means very little. When I was in school we were fortunate enough to have outside classes that taught the more detailed versions of these topics. This was still only the tip of the iceberg. I am sure people like Z'ev are pushing the bar up in his classes. Just curious what other educators are experiencing in this realm? Finally, I consider wenbing and SHL theory an integral piece of my general medicine practice. But as Z'ev stated, lurking pathogen theory is a little more " particular " but again no less useful in the clinic. Chip and I (and hopefully another) will be presenting three personal case studies showing how this theory was used in everyday clinical situations. One can only something if one knows what to look for. Comments? - _____ On Behalf Of Wednesday, December 06, 2006 11:11 PM Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " Jason and Z'ev, fair enough. Although I agree that there are hints, I can't think of many outside of SHL and as you remind me, in Wen Bing. Perhaps Zang-fu Theory is less used to this type of perception because qi gets shuttled around the different organs to be eventually eliminated - presumably through the urination and the stool. One doesn't expect heart heat when treated with Huang Lian to show up as heat in the Small Intestine- urination.- No, it gets eliminated at the source and then drained often with the assistance of the Fu lIng, Mu dan pi etc.. . SHL and Wen Bing has a special from outside to inside progression. Perhaps that is the uniqueness of it's onion skin. I am sorry to hear that the patients in Boulder are on to the " healing crisis " defense. Hopefully they won't catch on the West Coast for awhile. ;-) doug @ <%40> , " " wrote: > > Doug, > > > > I think that your response may be generally true, but the healing crisis and > homeopathic ideas like peeling away an onion do exist in Chinese medicine. > This example is one reason I picked the case study that Chip and I released > recently in the Lantern. It can be viewed at: > > > > http://www.chinesem <Chinese Medicine/index.php?page=Chinese_Medicine_Articles> edicinedoc.com/index.php?page=Chinese_Medicine_Articles) > > > > The title is Lurking Pathogens: A Qing Dynasty Case Study. > > > > It talks about lurking pathogens having multiple layers. The result of > peeling away a layer, revealing the subsequent layer, can produce s/s that > are worse then the first (layer). I have seen this in real clinical practice > and will be publishing a personal case study that demonstrates this idea, in > the near future. The key to understanding this concept is differentiating > between a " proper progression " or " proper eviction " of a pathogen and what > is just a mistreatment. > > > > But maybe more straightforward is looking at basic wenbing lurking pathogen > theory. IMO, it does support the idea of healing crisis. Let us define > healing crisis. The patient's presentation (s/s) gets much worse as a result > of treatment and then get better, resolving an previous issue. (is that > fair?) If so, let us look at a lurking pathogen that resides in the ying > level as an example. > > > > When pathogen lingers in the ying or blood levels, the s/s actually might > not be that severe. But as the pathogen is evicted out to i.e. the qi level, > the presentation can suddenly become very violent and look much worse then > what the patient normally deals with. They can feel quite 'sick'. This is > especially true if their ying level pathogen has been hanging out for years. > The eviction (to the qi level) can be the result of a proper treatment! Of > course at this point in time one can evict the pathogen out of the body > (potentially through the bowels). This experience, in the moment, can be > unsettling if one does not understand what is happening. Therefore, if one > understands lurking pathogen theory as well as wenbing 4 stages, then one > can not only predict the course of disease but ensure the patient that they > are having a positive progression. > > > > So I do disagree with the statement that " CM does not have a hint of healing > crisis except for the SHL " ; warm disease theory does contain this. But > generally speaking though, I think that people overuse the healing crisis > concept to justify their mistreatment, and patients, at least in Boulder, > are on to that one . > > > > I hope this expands things a bit. > > > > - > > > > _____ > > @ <%40> > [@ <%40> ] On Behalf Of > Wednesday, December 06, 2006 12:35 PM > @ <%40> > Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " > > > > This has been discussed at length and elequently explained by Z'ev on a > different list. But > my short answer to this is that save for a few cases in the Shang Han Lun > there is no hint > of " healing crisis " in TCM. To have one, for me, in TCM is simply wrong > treatment. TCM > treatments should gracefully lead one back to restored health without > crisis. > Lonny Jarrett and others when focused on mental or spiritual health may see > the > unsurfacing of emotions expressed in physical forms. I would say that even > then it is the > responsibility of the practitioner to guide the patient into balance not > simply tip the scales > in the opposite direction. And to be clear, I'm not saying that Jarrett > doesn't, just that > those furtherest from TCM tend to view unwelcomed responses with the excuse > of a > healing crisis. > Again, the homeopathic issue of a healing crisis is a different paradigm. > > doug > > @ <%40> > , " " <@> wrote: > > > > Hi Thomas, Attilio & All, > > > > What is YOUR experience of the " healing crisis " and/or " Hering's Law of > > Cure " in YOUR patients, especially those treated with acupuncture-type > > therapy (including laser, point-injection, guasha, moxibustion, qigong, > etc) > > or herbal medicine? > > > > http://users. <http://users. <http://users.mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html> mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html> > mrbean.net.au/~wlast/healingcrisis.html says: > > > > " HERING'S LAW OF CURE: " All cure starts from within out, from the head > > down and in reverse order as the symptoms have appeared. " > > > > Dr John Whitman Ray ... modified Hering's Law to the following: > > > > LAW OF HEALING CRISIS: " A healing crisis will occur only when an > > individual is ready both physiologically and psychologically. The basic > > foundation for all healing is nutritional preparedness. A healing crisis > will > > begin from within out, in reverse order chronologically as to how the > > symptoms have appeared, tempered by the intensity of the trauma. The > > individual will have the opportunity to re-experience each trauma, both > > physiological and psychological, beginning with the trauma of least > severity. > > It must be recognised that traumas involving emotions, which include all > > traumas, will be released in order, beginning with unconsciousness, then > > apathy, grief, fear, anger, pain and eventually enthusiasm (love), in > > conjunction with the appropriate word patterns for each emotion and > > thought pattern (sensory memory) which are accessible at each level. > > Unconditional love and unconditional forgiveness are the keys to apply and > > > transmute any resistance at any level, once these resistances are brought > > to view through the application of the laws of love, light and perfection. > > > > With this definition Dr. Ray emphasises the importance of the emotional > > side of our health problems. Each disease, accident or surgical > intervention > > contains a strong emotional component which needs to be re-experienced > > during a reaction, otherwise the healing will remain incomplete and the > > problem will present itself again at a later time for healing at a deeper > level. > > This also means that the body selects the kind of healing crisis that is > most > > appropriate at the time, taking into consideration its needs and abilities > to > > have a certain area healed or improved. We can consciously influence this > > choice by working on a particular problem. I also noticed that the body > self > > tries to select a timing, which does not disable us during important > events > > coming up. I have no doubt that we are guided on our healing path by our > > inner intelligence, which has our best interest at heart. In the beginning > our > > healing reactions will be mainly on the physical or biological level, but > more > > and more we will experience the release of emotional blocks and changes > > in consciousness, preparing us for greater activity on the spiritual > level. " > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Jason, thanks for your response. I would say that Zang-fu has a circular movement through the 5 elements or through the 12 organs. Done well it can be very dynamic. Unfortunately, because of those darn multiple choice tests most students tend to see only the " correct snapshot " and not realize the movements. I think why I balk at the unpeeling of the onion analogy from homeopathic practitioners is that there can be a reductionist tendency to viewing illness. That is, dare I say, Western approach that we are perfect and that we are corrupted by something that has to be discovered, uncovered or removed. Therefore we get a lot of purging and detoxification. I don't know if homeopathy has a theory of the well working system and why it does so. Let's hear from others who have ideas about this. I would agree that our SHL classes aren't great. Here in Los Angeles we have at least two great teachers (that I know of) but the time allotted to their classes is too limited. For those who want to get a greater appreciation of Zang-fu Bob Damone's Blue Poppy CEU class is a good place to start. It's over 15 hours of lectures and notes. doug , " " wrote: > > Doug and group, > > > > I think that what you mention below exemplifies one of the weaknesses of > zang-fu. Zang-fu explains things in a snapshot, versus a moving picture. > Wenbing (and SHL) theory are not outdated nor just incorporated into > zang-fu. They are separate theories in and of themselves, with bits and > pieces integrated into zang-fu. Unfortunately the schools (/students coming > out of the schools) teach (/know) very little of wenbing / SHL theory. Or > should I say, the schools do not teach an actual way to think about the > theories. They pretty much end it at memorizing formula names and the > corresponding zang-fu pattern. IMO this approach misses the point. One has > to understand how to THINK SHL / warm disease. I am wondering how much other > schools teach of SHL and wenbing. Many school says they have a class, but > IMO this means very little. When I was in school we were fortunate enough to > have outside classes that taught the more detailed versions of these topics. > This was still only the tip of the iceberg. I am sure people like Z'ev are > pushing the bar up in his classes. Just curious what other educators are > experiencing in this realm? > > > > Finally, I consider wenbing and SHL theory an integral piece of my general > medicine practice. But as Z'ev stated, lurking pathogen theory is a little > more " particular " but again no less useful in the clinic. Chip and I (and > hopefully another) will be presenting three personal case studies showing > how this theory was used in everyday clinical situations. One can only > something if one knows what to look for. > > > > Comments? > > > > - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Hello all, I am also unable to speak to the presence or absence of the concept of healing crisis in the literature of Traditional . I have seen what I call a " healing crisis " in the clinic many times though. How do we assess whether the arising symptoms are from a healing crisis or a manifestation of our patient getting worse or responding to faulty treatment? Through this experience I have developed my own guidelines for evaluating this. I inquire whether the symptoms meet the following criteria: 1. If the patient was feeling noticably better relative to the main complaints before the new symptoms arose. 2. If the new symptoms are on a more superficial level than the improved main complaint. 3. If there is a subjective sense for the patient that the main complaint is still better and/or that the new symptom subjectively feels as if it is what the body needs to do. 4. if the new symptom passes quickly and leaves the patient with a sense that they are better than they have been for a long time. The new symptom has to meet all of these criteria for me to call it a healing crisis. A few of the cases in which I have seen this are- a woman with severe low back pain developed severe but temporary dizziness after her back felt better very deficient patients getting a really bad cold - especially when they have reported not getting " really sick " for many years. I've seen this a lot with cancer patients and see it as a very good sign. Patients often feel much better after working through the cold. Very commonly patients feel better from their main complaint only to go through a period of deep sadness or even fear. As per my criteria, they feel a sense of getting to the truth of something and they move through it quickly. These are just a few of the instances in which the concept of " healing crisis " has been helpful to me. The criteria really help me and they help my patients because they can frame the new symptoms in a healthy way and evaluate them for themselves. If patients don't meet the criteria then that is a wake up call for me to seriously evaluate my diagnosis and treatment. Hope this helps, Sharon Sharon Weizenbaum 86 Henry Street Amherst, MA 01002 413-549-4021 sweiz www.whitepinehealingarts.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Hello all: Total rookie chiming in here (graduated in 2005), but I thought I would say something about SHL and Wenbing or classics in general as taught in school today. I don't know how it is everywhere else, but I went to a small private school in Vancouver BC and SHL, Jing Gue Yao Lue, Wen Bing, and Huang Di Nei Jing were taught towards the end of the program. We had a multiple quarters of lecture on these texts and my teachers stressed the importance of them in relation to clinical practice. They used to say that if one treat any disease solely with the knowledge contained in SHL and Wen Bing. Unfortunately I think its VERY hard for a student to see this (at least it was for me). This was partly due to the monotony of SHL " for X symptoms use X formula " as well as just the overall volume of information that is presented in general. It's very easy to tune out after a few of those lines and assume that one wouldn't be seeing problems like this in a clinic today (some SHL patients should/would probably go to the western hospital before coming to see their TCM doctor!) I agree with Jason that it would be more beneficial to teach students how to THINK SHL/Wen Bing so that they can truly understand the warm/cold diseases. Save rote memorization for personal study instead. Just my two cents, Benjamin Chang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Doug, I was wondering if you could give some good dynamic circular movement examples from zang-fu theory that one may use to predict the future events of the transmission of a pathogen. I really have not seen this explained in the English zang-fu books and I have not spent that much time reading zang-fu theory in Chinese. I really just think of zang-fu mainly as organ function and dysfunction and less about evicting pathogens. (maybe my own limitation). But this is, IMO, why things are more static. Meaning if you fix the organ pathology then there will be no pathogen. Of course draining the damp or heat (etc) is always part of the treatment, but at least to my knowledge, zang-fu doesn't really lay a map of how things move around. Even within patterns where there is transmission I.e. Heart heat -> SI-> Bladder, these are still (at least in my mind) somewhat static. For example there is not much chance of predicting that a patient with heart fire will get a bladder infection with a treatment (or no treatment). It is kind of luck of the draw. Zang-fu kind of says, if a patient has s/s XYZ, then the have heart->SI->BL problem. Am I missing something? I know Bob Damone is a great teacher, but I probably won't be buying any BP CEU stuff, therefore if you have time could you show a couple examples? Or do you know of a good English or Chinese source that discusses this? - _____ On Behalf Of Thursday, December 07, 2006 8:37 AM Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " Jason, thanks for your response. I would say that Zang-fu has a circular movement through the 5 elements or through the 12 organs. Done well it can be very dynamic. Unfortunately, because of those darn multiple choice tests most students tend to see only the " correct snapshot " and not realize the movements. I think why I balk at the unpeeling of the onion analogy from homeopathic practitioners is that there can be a reductionist tendency to viewing illness. That is, dare I say, Western approach that we are perfect and that we are corrupted by something that has to be discovered, uncovered or removed. Therefore we get a lot of purging and detoxification. I don't know if homeopathy has a theory of the well working system and why it does so. Let's hear from others who have ideas about this. I would agree that our SHL classes aren't great. Here in Los Angeles we have at least two great teachers (that I know of) but the time allotted to their classes is too limited. For those who want to get a greater appreciation of Zang-fu Bob Damone's Blue Poppy CEU class is a good place to start. It's over 15 hours of lectures and notes. doug @ <%40> , " " wrote: > > Doug and group, > > > > I think that what you mention below exemplifies one of the weaknesses of > zang-fu. Zang-fu explains things in a snapshot, versus a moving picture. > Wenbing (and SHL) theory are not outdated nor just incorporated into > zang-fu. They are separate theories in and of themselves, with bits and > pieces integrated into zang-fu. Unfortunately the schools (/students coming > out of the schools) teach (/know) very little of wenbing / SHL theory. Or > should I say, the schools do not teach an actual way to think about the > theories. They pretty much end it at memorizing formula names and the > corresponding zang-fu pattern. IMO this approach misses the point. One has > to understand how to THINK SHL / warm disease. I am wondering how much other > schools teach of SHL and wenbing. Many school says they have a class, but > IMO this means very little. When I was in school we were fortunate enough to > have outside classes that taught the more detailed versions of these topics. > This was still only the tip of the iceberg. I am sure people like Z'ev are > pushing the bar up in his classes. Just curious what other educators are > experiencing in this realm? > > > > Finally, I consider wenbing and SHL theory an integral piece of my general > medicine practice. But as Z'ev stated, lurking pathogen theory is a little > more " particular " but again no less useful in the clinic. Chip and I (and > hopefully another) will be presenting three personal case studies showing > how this theory was used in everyday clinical situations. One can only > something if one knows what to look for. > > > > Comments? > > > > - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 I agree with Sharon, it does happen in the clinic. But I do not agree that the all her below requirements have to met. Number 3 especially is a bit hard to tell in the midst of a full eruption. But in general warm disease theory does mention a healing crisis, as previously posted, just not those words. And with the theory we can be even more specific than just thinking our patient is having a " positive " healing crisis. It can show us if the current s/s are psotive as well as suggest the s/s that we should expect in a given situation (future), and then help formulate what we should do. I am unsure if homeopathic has such a map, but this is on thing in particular I find fascinating about CM. - _____ On Behalf Of sharon weizenbaum Thursday, December 07, 2006 9:22 AM Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " Hello all, I am also unable to speak to the presence or absence of the concept of healing crisis in the literature of Traditional . I have seen what I call a " healing crisis " in the clinic many times though. How do we assess whether the arising symptoms are from a healing crisis or a manifestation of our patient getting worse or responding to faulty treatment? Through this experience I have developed my own guidelines for evaluating this. I inquire whether the symptoms meet the following criteria: 1. If the patient was feeling noticably better relative to the main complaints before the new symptoms arose. 2. If the new symptoms are on a more superficial level than the improved main complaint. 3. If there is a subjective sense for the patient that the main complaint is still better and/or that the new symptom subjectively feels as if it is what the body needs to do. 4. if the new symptom passes quickly and leaves the patient with a sense that they are better than they have been for a long time. The new symptom has to meet all of these criteria for me to call it a healing crisis. A few of the cases in which I have seen this are- a woman with severe low back pain developed severe but temporary dizziness after her back felt better very deficient patients getting a really bad cold - especially when they have reported not getting " really sick " for many years. I've seen this a lot with cancer patients and see it as a very good sign. Patients often feel much better after working through the cold. Very commonly patients feel better from their main complaint only to go through a period of deep sadness or even fear. As per my criteria, they feel a sense of getting to the truth of something and they move through it quickly. These are just a few of the instances in which the concept of " healing crisis " has been helpful to me. The criteria really help me and they help my patients because they can frame the new symptoms in a healthy way and evaluate them for themselves. If patients don't meet the criteria then that is a wake up call for me to seriously evaluate my diagnosis and treatment. Hope this helps, Sharon Sharon Weizenbaum 86 Henry Street Amherst, MA 01002 413-549-4021 sweiz <sweiz%40rcn.com> www.whitepinehealingarts.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Benjamin, Was this Dr. Lu's school? I know he is very big on the classics, and I agree with him that it is essential in clinical practice to study these works. Very few schools put an emphasis on them in the U.S. However, how these texts are taught is just as critical, it is not easy to do. " X symptoms = Y formula " is sadly the rule in many classes such as SHL, when what is important is to teach the theory and thinking process behind clinical decisions, so that the practitioner/student can develop independently. On Dec 7, 2006, at 8:59 AM, Benjamin Chang wrote: > Hello all: > > Total rookie chiming in here (graduated in 2005), but I thought I > would say > something about SHL and Wenbing or classics in general as taught in > school > today. I don't know how it is everywhere else, but I went to a small > private school in Vancouver BC and SHL, Jing Gue Yao Lue, Wen Bing, > and > Huang Di Nei Jing were taught towards the end of the program. We had a > multiple quarters of lecture on these texts and my teachers > stressed the > importance of them in relation to clinical practice. They used to > say that > if one treat any disease solely with the knowledge contained in SHL > and Wen > Bing. Unfortunately I think its VERY hard for a student to see this > (at > least it was for me). This was partly due to the monotony of SHL > " for X > symptoms use X formula " as well as just the overall volume of > information > that is presented in general. It's very easy to tune out after a > few of > those lines and assume that one wouldn't be seeing problems like > this in a > clinic today (some SHL patients should/would probably go to the > western > hospital before coming to see their TCM doctor!) > > I agree with Jason that it would be more beneficial to teach > students how to > THINK SHL/Wen Bing so that they can truly understand the warm/cold > diseases. > Save rote memorization for personal study instead. > > Just my two cents, > > Benjamin Chang > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2006 Report Share Posted December 7, 2006 Jason, I think you are exactly right that Zang-fu says that by correcting the Zheng qi then the pathogen will disappear down one or another orifice. The dynamism I was referring to was the simply the interactions of Zheng Qi, to tonify the Spleen tonify the Kidney etc... as opposed to what I thought you were alluding to, a static: this person has Spleen Qi Xu, tonify it. SHL and Wen Bing is obviously more focused on the pathogen and its routes in and out of the body. This is something I am just beginning to appreciate. Sorry to bore long-time CHA members with this example- In Chronic Hepatitis, I like most, approached it through Xiao Chai Hu Tang expanding it's role in ShaoYang theory. But as I began to study further I saw other practitioners using the primary role of the tonification of the liver and kidney and spleen to prevent the further proliferation of the disease. In a sense these formulas have a two edged approach, one is this tonification, the second is the use of heat and damp clearing herbs. There is no guiding it is pretty much simultaneous defense and attack. Doug , " " wrote: > > Doug, > > > > I was wondering if you could give some good dynamic circular movement > examples from zang-fu theory that one may use to predict the future events > of the transmission of a pathogen. I really have not seen this explained in > the English zang-fu books and I have not spent that much time reading > zang-fu theory in Chinese. I really just think of zang-fu mainly as organ > function and dysfunction and less about evicting pathogens. (maybe my own > limitation). But this is, IMO, why things are more static. Meaning if you > fix the organ pathology then there will be no pathogen. Of course draining > the damp or heat (etc) is always part of the treatment, but at least to my > knowledge, zang-fu doesn't really lay a map of how things move around. Even > within patterns where there is transmission I.e. Heart heat -> SI-> Bladder, > these are still (at least in my mind) somewhat static. For example there is > not much chance of predicting that a patient with heart fire will get a > bladder infection with a treatment (or no treatment). It is kind of luck of > the draw. Zang-fu kind of says, if a patient has s/s XYZ, then the have > heart->SI->BL problem. Am I missing something? > > > > I know Bob Damone is a great teacher, but I probably won't be buying any BP > CEU stuff, therefore if you have time could you show a couple examples? Or > do you know of a good English or Chinese source that discusses this? > > > > - > > > > _____ > > > On Behalf Of > Thursday, December 07, 2006 8:37 AM > > Re: The " law of cure " OR " healing crisis " > > > > Jason, thanks for your response. I would say that Zang-fu has a circular > movement > through the 5 elements or through the 12 organs. Done well it can be very > dynamic. > Unfortunately, because of those darn multiple choice tests most students > tend to see only > the " correct snapshot " and not realize the movements. > > I think why I balk at the unpeeling of the onion analogy from homeopathic > practitioners is > that there can be a reductionist tendency to viewing illness. That is, dare > I say, Western > approach that we are perfect and that we are corrupted by something that has > to be > discovered, uncovered or removed. Therefore we get a lot of purging and > detoxification. I > don't know if homeopathy has a theory of the well working system and why it > does so. > Let's hear from others who have ideas about this. > > I would agree that our SHL classes aren't great. Here in Los Angeles we have > at least two > great teachers (that I know of) but the time allotted to their classes is > too limited. For > those who want to get a greater appreciation of Zang-fu Bob Damone's Blue > Poppy CEU > class is a good place to start. It's over 15 hours of lectures and notes. > > doug > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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